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US tri-service V- ("XV-") series

Matej

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I always wanted to have this serie complete, but I never found time for some serious research. What I have till now:

McDonnell Douglas XV-1 (rotorcraft)
Sikorsky XV-2 (one bladed retractable rotorcraft - never built)
Bell XV-3 (rotorcraft)
Lockheed XV-4 (inovative VTOL plane)
Ryan XV-5 (fan in wing and fuselage VTOL plane)
XV-6
XV-7
Ryan XV-8 (STOL powered rogallo)
Hughes XV-9 (hot cycle helicopter)
XV-10
XV-11
Rockwell XFV-12 (inovative VTOL fighter)
XV-13
XV-14
Bell XV-15 (tiltrotor)
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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Re: US XV series

There was an article on this in recent Air Enthusiasts, I think.
 

elmayerle

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Re: US XV series

Hawker Siddeley XV-6A "Kestrel" replacing the earlier US Army VZ-11 build of the pre-Kestrel P.1127.
 

Andreas Parsch

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Re: US XV series

Hi Matej,

your list mixes two different lists into one.

First, there was a USAF/Army "V-for-Convertiplane" series, which was introduced around 1953/54, and which had the following members:
- McDonnell XV-1 (ex XH-35, ex XL-25)
- Sikorsky XV-2 (not built)
- Bell XV-3 (ex XH-33)

In the joint designation system of 1962, the vehicle type letter V is defined as "STOL or VTOL". The post-1962 V-series has the following members:
- Grumman OV-1A to OV-1E Mohawk (ex AO-1)
- DeHavilland Canada CV-2A, CV-2B Caribou (ex AC-1; became C-7A and B when transferred to USAF)
- Bell XV-3A (was integrated into "new" V-series; old XV-1 and -2 no longer existed in '62)
- XV-4A (ex VZ-10), XV-5A (ex VZ-11) as per your list
- Hawker-Siddeley XV-6A Kestrel (ex VZ-12)
- DeHavilland Canada CV-7A Buffalo (ex AC-2; became C-8A)
- XV-8A, XV-9A as per your list
(AV-8 Harrier series is a re-use of the V-8 slot; AV-8A was briefly designated AV-6B)
- Rockwell OV-10A to OV-10F[/b] Bronco
- Parsons XV-11 Marvel
- XFV-12A as per your list
- V-13 slot was not used (triskaidekaphobia, apperently)
- XV-14 was original designation of Bell Model 301; was changed to XV-15 to avoir confusion with X-14
- XV-15A as per your list
- McDonnell Douglas AV-16A; projected Harrier development; not built
- XV-17: Designation reserved for Army in 1973; no details available
- DeHavilland Canada UV-18A and UV-18B Twin Otter
- V-19A: Designation reserved for Navy in 1977 and cancelled in 1980; no details available
- Pilatus UV-20A (Model PC-6)
- PV-21: Designation reserved in 1980 (or '83) for US Navy patrol blimp with tilt rotors. Most likely related to "Patrol Airship Concept Evaluation Study" (PACES) program.
- Bell/Boeing CV/MV-22 Osprey series
- Skytrader UV-23A Scout (Model Skytrader 800); single example procured by Army for evaluation

Hope this helps!

Andreas
 

hesham

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Re: US XV series

Hi,
I suggest that the picture was for Lockheed design (XV-19).
 

hesham

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Re: US XV series

Hi,

XV-24 was JCA joint cargo aircraft program and current JCA
possibilities are the GMAS C-27J and CASA CN-235 or C-295.
 

Andreas Parsch

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Re: US XV series

hesham said:
Hi,

XV-24 was JCA joint cargo aircraft program ...

What's your source for the "XV-24" designation? As of September 2006, there was no XV-24 in DOD's official listing. And "XV" would be the wrong prefix anyway.
 

hesham

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Re: US XV series

Dear Andreas,

it was Air Enthusiast 125 magazine and for dear Matej artist picture it was
XV-17 for the Army because the picture shows a project to the Army.
 

Andreas Parsch

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Re: US XV series

hesham said:
it was Air Enthusiast 125 magazine and for dear Matej artist picture it was
XV-17 for the Army because the picture shows a project to the Army.

Huh?!? ??? What was in A.E. 125, XV-17 or XV-24?? And what picture? You have me totally confused here, so could you please clarify:
- What designation is mentioned in A.E. 125?
- What exactly does this designation refer to, according to A.E. 125?

Thank you!
 

hesham

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Re: US XV series

Oh yah,

dear Andreas you are right,it is just suggesting from the magazine
and not sure,and for XV-17 I only think it was the artist picture from
dear Matej;
 

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Andreas Parsch

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Re: US XV series

hesham said:
dear Andreas you are wright,it is just suggesting from the magazine
and not sure,

Thanks. So it was only a speculation about a possible designation, and if they did indeed say "XV-24" (instead of "CV-24"), it was by someone who didn't know too much about the designation system ;).

and for XV-17 I only think it was the artist picture from dear Matej;

I see. However, I don't think the picture can be associated with the XV-17A. The number is barely legible, but it's definitely not "17".
 

Archibald

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Re: US XV series

V-19A: Designation reserved for Navy in 1977 and cancelled in 1980; no details available

This could be a V/STOL variant of USAF F-19 no ? ;D (a bit like the F-35 variants...)
 

Jos Heyman

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Re: US XV series

Here is a pic of the Sikorsky XV-2 that was sent to me by Sikorsky a very long time ago.
 

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Stargazer2006

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Re: US XV series

One little theory I've had for a long time about the V-19 designator reserved for US Navy: the V/STOL Multimission Aircraft!

Both the Vought V-530 and McDonnell 260 went pretty far in terms of full-scale wind tunnel models and so forth. What if the Navy wanted to procure either of them and reserved the designation for it until they got the winner, all before canceling the program? True, these programs were initiated early in the seventies, but they were still under development in the late seventies, when the V-19 designation was reserved.

I'd love to have Andreas' viewpoint on this, for instance. And what about the others too? Does that seem likely to you?
 

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Jos Heyman

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Re: US XV series

Apart from your theory, would you have any indication whatsoever that this would be the case? Otherwise I would be reluctant to go down this path of speculation as eventually somebody might regard such speculation as 'hard fact'.
Has happened before....
 

Andreas Parsch

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Re: US XV series

As far as "V-19" goes, the attached image shows the only reference to a "V-19" designation I've ever seen anywhere! It is a single "nomenclature record", which documents that the designation V-19A was reserved (but not allocated!) on 25 Feb 1977 for the US Navy, and cancelled on 08 Dec 1980. Note the remark "Cancelled after contact with Tim Nichols. He can find nothing on this reservation". I.e., less than 4 years after the reservation of V-19A, the responsible Navy officer had no idea what the reservation was for. Now how good are the chances that anyone will find out anything about "V-19" more than 30 years later?

Anyway, I presented the facts, but will not add to any speculation (for the reasons Jos mentioned) here ;) !
 

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Stargazer2006

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Re: US XV series

Can't get much clearer than this, Andreas, thanks!
And indeed, although my speculations have often proved right in terms of designations and related stuff, I do NOT want anyone to confuse my speculations with actual fact.
This can happen easily on forums, especially if they are read by people whose mother tongue is different.
Recently I uploaded a fake car advert on an automotive forum here in France and it carried my name and copyright so that no one could think it was for real. Yet a Romanian forum reframed it, removing the identification, and uploaded it, with a mention of where they had found it. As they are viewed as a valuable source in their subject, people from all over the world started writing articles on the supposedly upcoming new model, sometimes even giving specs and all!
All of this to say that hardly two weeks after I'd made up that car, there were at least 60 websites and 5 distinct articles circulating all over the web claiming they knew what they were talking about!
 

hesham

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Stargazer2006

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Re: US XV series

There is no evidence that this project was given the "V-19" designation, even temporarily... Until someone proves otherwise I believe it to be artistic license from the painter:

1°) If you look at a higher resolution version of this picture (see first attachment below), you'll see that the numeral in the designation is blurred, possibly on purpose, to evoke a fictitious future designation.

2°) The Composite Research Aircraft depicted in the image is similar to the 1965 Y-Wing concept developed from the "Hot Cycle" technology (see other attachments below). The "V-19" slot would have been allocated a lot later than that (the Pilatus UV-20A Chiricahua aircraft were serviced from May 1979 while the De Havilland UV-18A Twin Otters flew operationally from 1982).
 

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Jos Heyman

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Re: US XV series

The description that comes with that model is incorrect. 54-0043 is a F-105A. the correct serial for the XV-2 is 53-4403.
Also this model looks slightly different from the XV-2 photo I posted some time (see an earlier post) - although it does represent another XV-2 picture that does the rounds.
 

robunos

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gatoraptor

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As it was noted, the AV-8 Harrier was not numbered in the "V-" series. I believe that it was really part of the "A-" series, as you will note the absence of any other "A-8" in that series.
 

Stingray

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Re: US XV series

Andreas Parsch said:
- DeHavilland Canada CV-7A Buffalo (ex AC-2; became C-8A)

According to the December '64 issue of Army Aviation Digest, this was originally called the Caribou 2 and was to carry the Army name "Cheyenne."
 

Stargazer2006

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gatoraptor said:
As it was noted, the AV-8 Harrier was not numbered in the "V-" series. I believe that it was really part of the "A-" series, as you will note the absence of any other "A-8" in that series.

Absolutely. One of the earliest examples of the DoD misusing its own tri-service system. The Harrier ought to have been either the AV-6A or the A-8A.
Someone once speculated that the "AV-8" designator was used instead because it sounded like "aviate". Never knew if there was any amount of truth to it...


Stingray™ said:
Andreas Parsch said:
- DeHavilland Canada CV-7A Buffalo (ex AC-2; became C-8A)

According to the December '64 issue of Army Aviation Digest, this was originally called the Caribou 2 and was to carry the Army name "Cheyenne."

I knew about it being originally the "Caribou 2" (at De Havilland) but the planned allocation of "Cheyenne" to it is new to me. What the Army did eventually with all DHC products was to NOT apply the usual American Native name scheme and keep the company names instead. The U.S. military Otters, Caribous and Buffaloes all retained their names.
 

Vahe Demirjian

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As it was noted, the AV-8 Harrier was not numbered in the "V-" series. I believe that it was really part of the "A-" series, as you will note the absence of any other "A-8" in that series.
AV-8 was indeed designated in the V-series. As noted in the book Convair Advanced Designs II: Secret Fighters, Attack Aircraft, and Unique Concepts 1929-1973, the General Dynamics Model 100 COIN aircraft project was referred to as A-8, there's no way the Harrier could have designated in the A-series given its VTOL nature.
 

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