US Navy Class Designators

[hesham]

Hi,

http://www.avia-it.com/act/biblioteca/periodici/PDF Riviste/Ala/L'Ala 1947 04.pdf

 

[Stargazer]

Certainly not post-WW2. This system of designating U.S. Navy classes existed since the 1920s. Only the H* classes for helicopters were introduced during the 1940s.

A "VA Class" type is simply an attack aircraft. An "HO Class" type is simply an observation helicopter.

 

[hesham]

Thank you my dear Skyblazer.

 

[Stargazer]

Just so that you know I'm not making up things out of the blue, here's a 1941 document from Consolidated's corporate magazine which recapitulates the U.S. Navy codes (I also have Navy documents proper, but I'd have to look for them). At any rate, if you can get hold of William T. Larkins's seminal book U.S. Navy Aircraft 1921-1941 you'll see that starting in 1922 the Navy squadrons started using the Class codes:

Effective 1 July 1922 all Fleet Air Squadrons were reorganized; Scouting Squadron 2 became VS-1, Torpedo Plane Squadron 1 became Torpedo and Bombing Plane Squadron 1 (VT-1), Seaplane Patrol Squadron 1 became VT-2, Spotting Squadron 4 became VO-1, Spotting Squadron 3 became VO-2, Spotting Squadron L1 became VO-3, Combat Squadron 4 became VF-1 and Combat Squadron 3 became VF-2. VF-32 was organized as a new unit to provide air protection to Train ships and to be a nucleus for Aircraft Squadrons, Base Force. VS-1, VT-1 and Kite Balloon Squadron 1 formed Aircraft Squadrons, Scouting Fleet (Atlantic); the remainder forming Aircraft Squadrons, Battle Fleet (Pacific).

 

[hesham]

Amazing Info.

 

[Stargazer]

From Aero Digest, September 1929:

 

[hesham]

From Aero Digest, September 1929:

Nice find.

 

[Yellow Palace]

This seems like as good a thread as any...

The US Navy clearly distinguished between 'patrol planes', classified VP, and 'patrol bombers', classified VPB. But I can't find any clear distinction between the two. By way of example: the Consolidated Model 28 was initially classified as P3Y, then reclassified as PBY. So clearly there was some perceived difference. It was replaced by the PBM, and that in turn by the P5M.

You could reasonably argue that this is because it lost the 'bomber' part of the mission, becoming pure patrol. The contemporary P2V replaced the PV in the short-to-medium range patrol niche. Fair enough. But in much the same timeframe, the P4M was developed to replace the PB4Y - including in the offensive minelaying role. Then, to add insult to injury, the P6M is nothing less than a strategic bomber! Clearly, at some point there was a decision not to designate any more aircraft as patrol bombers.

Further muddling the waters, look again at those wartime landplanes. The PB4Y was a derivative of a heavy bomber, used for patrol and strike missions. The PV was... a derivative of a medium bomber, used for patrol and strike missions. In fact, there's some contemporary commentary that the PV was a fine strike aircraft, but had too little range to be useful for patrol work!

The simplest explanation is that 'Patrol' and 'Patrol Bomber' are purely arbitrary distinctions. But that's not very satisfactory. Is there any evidence to indicate where the difference actually lay?

 

[Apophenia]

... The simplest explanation is that 'Patrol' and 'Patrol Bomber' are purely arbitrary distinctions. But that's not very satisfactory. Is there any evidence to indicate where the difference actually lay?

Good questions. Those PB/PBY designations are a puzzle. And there seems to be no overlap with contemporary squadron designations.

For example: In 1937, Patrol Squadron 2 (VP-2) was flying Martin PM-1/-2s. So far, so good. In 1939, the squadron was renumbered as VP-31 while flying PBY-2s. About to move on to land-based PB4Y-1s, the squadron was redesignated as a Bombing Squadron and renumbered as VB-105. Only in October 1944 would VB-105 be finally redesignated VPB-105 for Patrol Bombing Squadron ;p

 

[Arjen]

Simply another attempt to confuse the enemy - the USAAF

 

[Yellow Palace]

Simply another attempt to confuse the enemy - the USAAF

I suspect, but can't prove, that the end of the 'Patrol Bomber' classification coincides with the formation of the USAF and their... parochial... views on bombing.