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Orionblamblam

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Currently travelling. Occaisionally hitting places of probable interest... itinerary includes USAF Museum in Dayton and Niagara Aerospace Museum.

September 25: Patton Museum near Fort Knox, including the sole remaining T28 superheavy tank
 

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flateric

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Scott - If you will be lucky to get to USAF Museum Restoration area and make walkaround of YF-23 PAV-1...ask whatewer you want from me...
 

Orionblamblam

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flateric said:
Scott - If you will be lucky to get to USAF Museum Restoration area and make walkaround of YF-23 PAV-1...

I am not sure how much time I will have for the USAF museum... I'm hoping more than one day, but can't say (this is a "wandering" vacation with family... we get where we get when we get there). So, no promises. However... I'll take requests. Anything in particular anybody wants photo'ed from the USAF Museum or the Niagara Aerospace Museum (which I gather is mostly Bell stuff), let me know.

Another *possible* aerospace museum to be hit is the New England Air Museum in Connecticut: http://www.neam.org/inventory/airsearch.asp

And if anybody knows of other worthy museums in the New England area, I'm taking suggestions.


ask whatewer you want from me...

I like redheads, but wouldn't turn my nose up at hot blondes or brunettes (female, of course... ). But barring the ability to send me some Russian Mail Order Brides... how's about $0.75 per photo of your designated "target?"
 

flateric

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Orionblamblam said:
I am not sure how much time I will have for the USAF museum... I'm hoping more than one day, but can't say (this is a "wandering" vacation with family... we get where we get when we get there). So, no promises.

As far as I remember, Tuesday and Fridays are restoration area visiting days - you must call 'em in advance then they took you on a bus on first come-you get place rule.

Orionblamblam said:
I like redheads, but wouldn't turn my nose up at hot blondes or brunettes (female, of course... ). But barring the ability to send me some Russian Mail Order Brides... how's about $0.75 per photo of your designated "target?"

Russian girls are WOMD that barely can be compared to anything. Phrases spoken after buying for her Guess? jeans for USD 500, like 'I've calculated how much you earned last year we were together - aren't you already must have enough to buy Mazda3?" sometimes make you think that she misses sums spent on her in calculations)))But they are so cute that you forgive them everything. Also, our postal service are much worse than even Canadian. Seriously - 0.75 is quite a good price. Agreed!
 

TinWing

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flateric said:
Russian girls are WOMD that barely can be compared to anything. Phrases spoken after buying for her Guess? jeans for USD 500, like 'I've calculated how much you earned last year we were together - aren't you already must have enough to buy Mazda3?" sometimes make you think that she misses sums spent on her in calculations)))

My advice: take the $500 jeans back to the store for a full return and spend the proceeds on a fine pre-owned example of the glamorous automobile depicted below.





flateric said:
But they are so cute that you forgive them everything. Also, our postal service are much worse than even Canadian. Seriously - 0.75 is quite a good price. Agreed!

I seriously doubt that your postal system can be that much worse than Canada Post, which seems to be so unspeakable that Canadians who wish to post a letter or parcel to the United States actually cross the American border to the nearest USPS mailbox.
 

flateric

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Glamorous VAZ-11113 Oka is out of production, to my sorrow))...You won't find used Oka here less than for 1000 bucks, most of the prices starts at USD 2000.

OK, we are totally out of the topic. To Scott - I don't know if you have been here http://aeroweb.brooklyn.cuny.edu/museums/, but I think it's a geood way to finding museums and hearing independent opinions.
 

LowObservable

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I have always envied tank historians. Even single prototypes of the weirdest tanks survive because (a) nobody can be ar*ed to scrap them (it's too much work and steel is cheap) and (b) they can be left out in the rain and snow for 60 years and nothing happens to them, except the paint fades. Still having the T-28 around is like still having an XB-19.
 

Orionblamblam

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Sept 30, visited the Pennsylvania Veterans Memorial. My father and I were *stunned,* it's a remarkable place. *Class* all the way.

Tomorrow I should get to the New England Air Museum, and with luck should walk away with a pile of photos.
 

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Orionblamblam

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New England Air Museum is certainly worth a visit if you're in the region. A small sample of what they have.
 

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yasotay

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Orionblamblam (or anyone else for that matter) - If you ever have reason to be traveling through Southeast Alabama (few have reason to travel "to" Southeast Alabama) and have time please to visit the US Army Aviation Museum, please let me know. Will be glad to coordinate a tour.

With enough notice I might even be able to arrange for a visit to the "Holding Hangar" where many of the US VTOL projects of the 50's and 60's reside. I also know where some of the other prototypes are hiding (some languishing).
 

flateric

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Seems that Scott digged something very interesting...no news for a long time...
 

Orionblamblam

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flateric said:
Seems that Scott digged something very interesting...no news for a long time...

Nothing of aerospace interest for a long time. Been wandering the Northeast. *Tomorrow* I go to the Bell/Niagara Aerospace Museum. I've been by it... from the outside it looks good. With luck, I'll gain archive access and spend all day on a mad scanning spree. With my luck, they'll be closed for maintenance. But at the very least, if they're open I'll walk away with a boatload of photos of the X-22.

Today was spent with this:
 

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Apophenia

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A belated thanks for that Burnelli hit (can't blame Canada Post for my tardiness!).

Sad to see the CBY-3 still moldering away in the open. I came across an article about this from few years back -- http://www.aircrash.org/burnelli/neam1.htm

Some good details but not even a mention that the aircraft was built by Canadian Car & Foundry. Didn't fit with the call to American patriots, I guess ;)
 

Orionblamblam

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Apophenia said:
I came across an article about this from few years back -- http://www.aircrash.org/burnelli/neam1.htm

Some good details but....

... lots and lots of paranoid conspiracy-mongering ravings.
"We have previously written how the Smithsonian Institution removed America's most important aeronautical genius, Vincent Justus Burnelli, from America's aeronautical heritage by eliminating any mention of him..."

In a word: my ass.

NASA attributes the conception of the lifting-body aircraft to one of its own engineers, despite abundant empirical evidence and scientific facts that Vincent Burnelli invented and reduced to practice the lifting body principal of design with his 1921 RB-1 aircraft.

The RB-1 had wings. Thus, *not* a lifting body.

The only conclusion we can draw from NEAM's reluctance to restore the only remaining Burnelli plane in existence, or to permit the Burnelli Company the right to do so, is that NEAM has joined the Pentagon, NASA, the Smithsonian and many others, including the Flight Safety Foundation. They wish to prevent the CBY-3 from ever flying again...

Snort. Kelly Johnson couldn't make that wreck fly again.
 

sferrin

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Orionblamblam said:
flateric said:
Seems that Scott digged something very interesting...no news for a long time...

Nothing of aerospace interest for a long time. Been wandering the Northeast. *Tomorrow* I go to the Bell/Niagara Aerospace Museum.


Damn, I wish I'd spotted that earlier. I'd have asked if you could keep an eye out for the Hughes Model 385 / XV-9A "Hot Cycle". BTW do coyotes and tumbleweeds really count as neighbors? ;)
 

Apophenia

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Orionblamblam said:
... Snort. Kelly Johnson couldn't make that wreck fly again.

I'd settle for seeing the booms back on :)
 

Orionblamblam

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I'm back and in serious need of shower and sleep. Apart from some head-slapping stupidity on my part (Note for future reference: doesn't matter how good your laptop and thin flatbed scanner combo are if you fail to brign the right goddamned connecting cord), my general response regarding the visit to the Bell Aircraft archive at the Niagara museum is:

Oh, my...


Got about 710 photos to sort through. This'll take a little while... but I'll be dropping a *lot* of stuff off here in the near future.
 

Orionblamblam

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Shower accomplished.

OK, the Niagara Aerospace Museum is fairly small, but has three levels. The entire third level is the archive. Now, imagine the entire creative output of several thousand engineers and artists, over a span of five decades... put through a blender. The archive is *huge.* And randomized. And as yet uncataloged. This is an ongoign effort, one I don't envy... but progress is visible. Several dozen linear feet of shelfspace have been organized, but there is a long road ahead.

My main goal in visiting there today was to get a sense of the place... to find out if it's little more than a few sad boxes, or someplace of real worth. As it turns out, it's the latter, and decisively so.

Given the nature of the place, I was allowed to poke through it at will and at random. I had a few things I wanted to find:
1: RoBo/BoMi stuff: FAIL
2:Armed tiltrotor stuff (AV-22, XV-15 derivatives, BAT, Mighty Mouse, etc.): FAIL
3: Tri Service Tilt-Duct designs: SCORE

As previously mentioned, my scanner was useless. However, I had a tripod and a good 8megapixel digital camera; this worked out well. The image quality clearly ain't what it would have been with a scanner, but it's perfectly servicable in most cases. Glossy art prints were a bit of a nightmare, as they'd reflect surrounding lights and such.

Probably the biggest score was a photocopied database. It had every design that Bell had attributed a Model number to, listing the model number, very basic description, who was responsible, wha tthe contract numer was. While it did not provide things like drawings, it nevertheless provides a hint of interestingness and pointers towards further research. One thign spotted was a "strategic Lunar System." Photoed every page.
 

Mark Nankivil

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Sounds like a worthy trip then. Looking forward to seeing some of the tidbits :)

Enjoy the Day! Mark
 

yasotay

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I really would love to see whatever you are willing to share on the Tri-Service Tilt Duct.

I am not surprised that there was little of anything on the Tilt-Rotor as I think all of that work was done in Texas. I do have some stuff from Bell on the Mighty Mouse (FAAV) but will have to get permission to share it.
 

Orionblamblam

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Arrived in Dayton this afternoon. Just enough time to drop by the USAF museum and get some basic info. In short... the restoration facility is only open on Friday, you need to sign up in advance, and this Friday is already booked solid. So, if you want photos from there, you're SOL. Will be going to the Presidential & X-Planes hangar, though. If anyone wants somethign in particular photoed from the museum, now's the time to speak up.

Wandered around the outdoor air park taking about 300 photos (amazing how fast you can take pics with a good digital camera). About 200 of them were of the Midgetman launcher.
 

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sferrin

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Orionblamblam said:
Arrived in Dayton this afternoon. Just enough time to drop by the USAF museum and get some basic info. In short... the restoration facility is only open on Friday, you need to sign up in advance, and this Friday is already booked solid. So, if you want photos from there, you're SOL. Will be going to the Presidential & X-Planes hangar, though. If anyone wants somethign in particular photoed from the museum, now's the time to speak up.

Wandered around the outdoor air park taking about 300 photos (amazing how fast you can take pics with a good digital camera). About 200 of them were of the Midgetman launcher.


There is this one and the one at Hill, do you know if any examples of the other design (the one done with Caterpiller) exist anywhere?
 

Orionblamblam

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sferrin said:
There is this one and the one at Hill...

Which I have a bunch of photos of. Not surprising given that it's only 40 miles from my house.

, do you know if any examples of the other design (the one done with Caterpiller) exist anywhere?

Not sure, but it seems likely. These things were built to withstand nuke blasts, they should be hard to kill. The one here at Dayton looks nearly exactly the same as it did the last time I saw it, prit near a dozen years ago. The one at Hill, though, looks a little rough around the edges... particularly the flat tires.
 

flateric

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Scott - If YF-23A out of reach - Tacit Blue, BoP and YF-22 then...


Added:
Woman in charge of Restoration tours - Erin S. Craig with ext.462 - may be if you explain who you are she can arrange something.
 

Orionblamblam

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flateric said:
Scott - If YF-23A out of reach - Tacit Blue, BoP and YF-22 then...

YF-23 out of reach. Got photos of Tacit Blue, BoP and YF-22 and then some more...

By "photos," I mean "1,250 photos with the primary 8 megapixel camera and 93 photos with the backup 3 megapixel camera, for a total of 4.35 gigabytes of filespace."


Gonna take *just* a little time to sort through.
 

flateric

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Err...Scott, did you mean 1250 photos just of YF-22, BoP and The Whale? I just need to check my wallet, pal)
 

Orionblamblam

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flateric said:
Err...Scott, did you mean 1250 photos just of YF-22, BoP and The Whale? I just need to check my wallet, pal)

No, 1250 photos *total,* everything I took at the museum.

A preliminary count (to be revised after more detailed exam... I can assure you that some photos suck at will be deleted, and I haven't sorted everythign yet):
BoP: 43 photos (they have it hanging from the ceiling, so views are limited... and the lighting sucked)
F-86 (several): 52
F-107: 26
Lifting bodies (X-23, ASSET, X-24A, X-24B): 35
Midgetman launcher: 119
Tacit Blue: 41
Titan I/II ICBM: 27
X-3: 48 (at least)
X-4: 13
X-5: 32
X-10: 31 (at least)
X-15: 82
XB-70: 48 (a very difficult aircraft to photograph given how tightly packed it is with other aircraft)
X-13: 31
X-47: 8
XC-142: 27
YF-22: 13
SR-71/YF-12/D-21: 39
Bocks Car (B-29): 15
Exterior memorials: 81 (enough marble and granite to build a Greek temple)

Plus a bunch of other as-yet uncorrelated images.
 

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Orionblamblam

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More photos, showing only the most advanced of technologies on display....
 

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flateric

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Strange shots angle - you have used tripid to the maximum height? Or were jumping?)))
Hangar lightening level didn't changed much since 1994. Good flashlight is a must there...
 

Orionblamblam

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flateric said:
Strange shots angle - you have used tripid to the maximum height?

Tripod extended to max length, legs folded together, and held at arms length over my head.Worked better than I thought it would. Got abut 10-11 feet up doing it that way. But taht only worked in the X-Plane hanger... everywhere else was too dim.
 
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