Sukhoi T-75 LTS (CheckMate)

[Rolead]

No gun panels visible on the starboard side like the Su-27/35/34 and MiG-29, on the port side perhaps ?

 

[RavenOne]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nnm0stFtnkw

 

[Scar]

I just hope this doesn't become another S-37 - looks good but ultimately gets nowhere.

S-37 was an X-plane to experiment with FSW and composites. Dunno where the misconception it's meant to be a prototype of the combat fighter-jet came from. Journalists, i guess?

Global Security's S-37 page https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/su-47.htm
"In April 2002 the OKB Sukhoi was chosen as the system leader for the development of a new combat aircraft of the 5th Generation, with an internal designation of T-50. MiG and Sukhoi had long been in competition for the state order for the development of a fifth generation fighter jet. MiG specialists chose the 1.44 index aircraft as the prototype of the new jet, whereas Sukhoi decided to base its work on the Su-47 fighter jet. Sukhoi's Su-47 eventually won the contest. "

(Mind you there's quite a few awkward expressions and incomplete translations (eg "OKB imeni P.O. Sukhoi") in the article that make me suspect at least part of it's translated from a Russian original)

OMG, this quote from GS contains so many misconceptions. First of all, 1.44 is a product of I-90(Istrebitel 1990'kh - Fighter of 1990's) program from 1980's and really was an aerodynamical/technology configuration demonstrator for the real flighter, funded by Soviet MoD.

While S-37 was just an initiative X-plane of Sukhoi, based on the Soviet paper-project of the deck based fighter, known as S-52/S-22/Su-27KM, that was dropped by Siviet MoD due to the high technology risk of FSW.

And both of them, neither 1.44 nor S-37, were not related to PAK FA program.

 

[LMFS]

Not only the canopy bow but the geometry of the canopy (not wind screen) that rescind abruptly where the pilot's helmeted head sits. That could make swiveling from left to right difficult with a rear view only possible when the pilot lean forward.
The seating position is also odd with the seat headrests nearly in contact with the canopy.
Once again, with helmets as they are built today for off-boresight targeting and synthetic imagery, the available space looks oddly small.

Do you even realize that part comes DIRECTLY from the Su-57?

 

[Scar]

Once again, with helmets as they are built today for off-boresight targeting and synthetic imagery, the available space looks oddly small.

keyword

 

[TomcatViP]

Same overall geometry but I think It looks smaller.

 

[Scar]

Same overall geometry but I think It looks smaller.

It might be slightly shorter but judging by the seat's headrest - it's pretty the same.

 

[DWG]

Not only the canopy bow but the geometry of the canopy (not wind screen) that rescind abruptly where the pilot's helmeted head sits. That could make swiveling from left to right difficult with a rear view only possible when the pilot lean forward.
The seating position is also odd with the seat headrests nearly in contact with the canopy.
Once again, with helmets as they are built today for off-boresight targeting and synthetic imagery, the available space looks oddly small.

Do you even realize that part comes DIRECTLY from the Su-57?

Just coming from the Su-57 raises questions in itself - is the over the nose angle the same? If it isn't, does that mean raising the seat to achieve an acceptable over-the-nose view for landing? If the seat position has to be moved, how much space does that leave for the pilot and helmet? And so on. These aren't comments to run down a Russian project, they're questions we'd ask of any project.

 

[TomcatViP]

Dassault. It was already posted here long ago and comes from a presentation of the Neuron project.

 

[stealthflanker]

Yeah so im also doing checkmate (proper, hopefully).. For science. Still crude but well it will improve with time.

What do you guys think on the location of the central bay ?

 

[LowObservable]

So the air channel is split... that makes the nose wheel probably quite capable of handling serious loads needed for rough landings (STOL is a claimed characteristic of the plane) and maybe even CATOBAR launch in a potential future.

Double nose-wheel, though I can't tell if there's anywhere for a catapult bridle to attach.

Double nosewheel = smaller diameter = easier fit for height under inlet duct. (Even easier if they filched the CV X-32 design, a double nosewheel that split and stowed with wheels horizontal.)

 

[Jason Dykstra (Wyvern)]

I have seen the designation "Su-75" thrown round. Is this official? I doubt it personally...

 

[stealthflanker]

It will have to get "T" first before Su.

 

[tequilashooter]

Dont mind the something out of nothing arguments even though this is a mock up(congrats for not being like another forum bashing the aircraft before any of its features are shown ) can we show comparisons to run off of an aircrafts a pilots seat and canopy view? Other than one person saying I can see, no I cant see?

 

[Jason Dykstra (Wyvern)]

It will have to get "T" first before Su.

Exactly as I thought.

 

[Scar]

I have seen the designation "Su-75" thrown round. Is this official? I doubt it personally...

IMO, Su-51 would be much better and symbolical.

 

[FighterJock]

I have seen the designation "Su-75" thrown round. Is this official? I doubt it personally...

IMO, Su-51 would be much better and symbolical.

Any Su-XX designation in the 50s would do as far as I am concerned, Scar.

 

[Scar]

I have seen the designation "Su-75" thrown round. Is this official? I doubt it personally...

IMO, Su-51 would be much better and symbolical.

Any Su-XX designation in the 50s would do as far as I am concerned, Scar.

I mean, MiG-21 >> Su-51

 

[Jason Dykstra (Wyvern)]

The designation is definitely a fantasy, and was probably come up by a "defence analyst" who just swapped the "57" in "Su-57" around to make it "75".

"That'll fool 'em!" - him probably

 

[XaHyMaH]

So no Elevators?

There are small elevators between exhaust and keels.

 

[Mike Pryce]

So the air channel is split... that makes the nose wheel probably quite capable of handling serious loads needed for rough landings (STOL is a claimed characteristic of the plane) and maybe even CATOBAR launch in a potential future.

Double nose-wheel, though I can't tell if there's anywhere for a catapult bridle to attach.

Double nosewheel = smaller diameter = easier fit for height under inlet duct. (Even easier if they filched the CV X-32 design, a double nosewheel that split and stowed with wheels horizontal.)

Or an offset wheel for a bay. Very Boeing in either case.

 

[Roland55]

My read: The aircraft is shown delivered to the UAE (whose representative doesn't look surprised), then it shows Argentina and Vietnam receiving a text and getting excited (presumably indicating there has been some interest), then it shows the rest of the world being impressed.

The problem with this is that while the UAE and Vietnam can probably afford a new fighter purchase, Argentina's in a prolonged financial crisis, and is more likely a customer for second-hand fighters, if anything.

We really dont know how would this be in terms of price and financing, im guessing if india doesn't bite into it, the whole thing could probably be a lot harder...
Regarding Argentina's chances of getting into this aircraft, money is not the handicap...

 

[FighterJock]

I have seen the designation "Su-75" thrown round. Is this official? I doubt it personally...

IMO, Su-51 would be much better and symbolical.

Any Su-XX designation in the 50s would do as far as I am concerned, Scar.

I mean, MiG-21 >> Su-51

Ah I get it, both being single engined fighters. On a slow day Scar.

 

[Grey Havoc]

The designation is definitely a fantasy, and was probably come up by a "defence analyst" who just swapped the "57" in "Su-57" around to make it "75".

Or alternatively, some company marketing type getting ahead of himself.

 

[DWG]

I just hope this doesn't become another S-37 - looks good but ultimately gets nowhere.

S-37 was an X-plane to experiment with FSW and composites. Dunno where the misconception it's meant to be a prototype of the combat fighter-jet came from. Journalists, i guess?

Global Security's S-37 page https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/su-47.htm
"In April 2002 the OKB Sukhoi was chosen as the system leader for the development of a new combat aircraft of the 5th Generation, with an internal designation of T-50. MiG and Sukhoi had long been in competition for the state order for the development of a fifth generation fighter jet. MiG specialists chose the 1.44 index aircraft as the prototype of the new jet, whereas Sukhoi decided to base its work on the Su-47 fighter jet. Sukhoi's Su-47 eventually won the contest. "

(Mind you there's quite a few awkward expressions and incomplete translations (eg "OKB imeni P.O. Sukhoi") in the article that make me suspect at least part of it's translated from a Russian original)

OMG, this quote from GS contains so many misconceptions. First of all, 1.44 is a product of I-90(Istrebitel 1990'kh - Fighter of 1990's) program from 1980's and really was an aerodynamical/technology configuration demonstrator for the real flighter, funded by Soviet MoD.

And yet that bit about 1.44 is one of those I'd say is most clearly translated, no-one speaking English as their first language would say "the 1.44 index aircraft", we just don't use 'index' in that form. English usage at the time was generally MiG 1.44, so we'd just say "the MiG 1.44". I don't think the whole document is Russian-sourced, the start especially seems to have been written by a native English speaker, but as soon as it starts talking about the history of S-37 the written English pattern changes stylistically to someone speaking it as a second language. I might be wrong about the source language being Russian, might have been Polish, for instance, but Russian makes most sense for GS to use as a source, which in turn suggests at least some people in Russia thought it was more than just an aerodynamic research vehicle, which is actually was what Western coverage at the time believed it to be. But as a source for later English language confusion, the GS page seems a good possibility, and we all know how incorrect information is perpetuated on the net.

Looking at the sources listed, https://web.archive.org/web/20071123234606/http://aeroweb.lucia.it/rap/RAFAQ/six5th_5.html by Alexei Gretchikine definitely seems to talk about it as a prototype fighter, Sukhoi's competitor for MFI, and indeed quotes defence-ministry acquisition chief Col Gen Anatoly Sitnov saying "What is the use of developing the Sukhoi fifth-generation fighter, if the aircraft's cockpit dates back to a second- or third-generation design?" (OTOH the English is fine, better than in the GS article). Unfortunately the other source doesn't seem to be archived.

 

[Scar]

Alexei Gretchikine definitely seems to talk about it as a prototype fighter, Sukhoi's competitor for MFI

If he said it, he was definitely wrong. Because only insane person would choose a forward-swept design, with its fundamental divergence problem, which is not solved(if we're talking about manueverable supersonic fighter-jets) even today.

 

[Sundog]

Alexei Gretchikine definitely seems to talk about it as a prototype fighter, Sukhoi's competitor for MFI

If he said it, he was definitely wrong. Because only insane person would choose a forward-swept design, with its fundamental divergence problem, which is not solved(if we're talking about manueverable supersonic fighter-jets) even today.

There isn't a problem with designing forward wept wings. We understand them quite well. The issues are;
1) Not great for LO.
2) Not great for hanging stores off of, due to their location relative to the cm.
3) Really only good to M=1.6 / 1.7. If you're going to go any faster, then a standard swept wing is the lower weight solution.

 

[AN/AWW-14(V)]

And so who will buy it? China, Algeria?

 

[Dilandu]

And so who will buy it? China, Algeria?

Basically anyone who is not US ally but wanted an affordable fifth-generation plane.

 

[AN/AWW-14(V)]

And so who will buy it? China, Algeria?

Basically anyone who is not US ally but wanted an affordable fifth-generation plane.

Really? I don't see array of customers

 

[tequilashooter]

Thais probably why there is an airshow to draw in interests for orders 1st? Probably what those Rostec trailers were presenting. Depending how good the air to air capabilities are on the Su-70 I will probably be the only goofball here suggesting the Su-70 has better export potential.

 

[Jason Dykstra (Wyvern)]

And so who will buy it? China, Algeria?

Argentina was touted in the promotional video, but they lack the funds and reason to purchase it, as well as the fact they're a major NATO ally. China is developing its own stealth fighters, so I doubt they'd want something foreign as well. North Korea is a big fat NO, due to the fact that any arms sale to North Korea will be controversial (with China, Japan, the US and the South Koreans, and literally everyone else in the region) and the fact that it's a political hellhole as well as a greyzone. Iran is a possibility, but I honestly doubt it. India is trying to develop its own stealth fighter, and had a bit of a falling out with Moscow when they were working on the Su-57.

Currently some nations that could order the aircraft are: Vietnam, UAE, Egypt, Saudi Arabia (?) (doubt it), Belarus, and many of the former Soviet republics.

The problem is cost. Why would a nation want to order this, when a MiG-29 is good enough?

 

[trose213]

And so who will buy it? China, Algeria?

Whoever's willing to pay for its development.

 

[AN/AWW-14(V)]

Currently some nations that could order the aircraft are: Vietnam, UAE, Egypt, Saudi Arabia (?) (doubt it), Belarus, and many of the former Soviet republics.

Vietnamese want western block aircrafts
Egypt - there are already too many new-made aircrafts
UAE - F-35
Saudi Arabia - politically unacceptable
Belarus - gets weapons for free, not buy
many of the former Soviet republics - a lot of Su-30/27 and skinny defence budgets

 

[Roland55]

And so who will buy it? China, Algeria?

Argentina was touted in the promotional video, but they lack the funds and reason to purchase it, as well as the fact they're a major NATO ally. China is developing its own stealth fighters, so I doubt they'd want something foreign as well. North Korea is a big fat NO, due to the fact that any arms sale to North Korea will be controversial (with China, Japan, the US and the South Koreans, and literally everyone else in the region) and the fact that it's a political hellhole as well as a greyzone. Iran is a possibility, but I honestly doubt it. India is trying to develop its own stealth fighter, and had a bit of a falling out with Moscow when they were working on the Su-57.

Currently some nations that could order the aircraft are: Vietnam, UAE, Egypt, Saudi Arabia (?) (doubt it), Belarus, and many of the former Soviet republics.

The problem is cost. Why would a nation want to order this, when a MiG-29 is good enough?

Weeelll...there is a certain apealing to this new concept?, design?

When we think russian exports, we think of both Mig-29 and Su-27 families (Yak-130 can go away), both are twin engine, heavy multirole aircraft that when compared to their equivalents in the west they dont have a lot of upsides regarding their maintenance and costs. This kinda puts a handicap on them, a recent example is the Peruvian Mig-29s that are all grounded due to high maintenance costs and issues regarding spares.

Their engines dont have a long lifetime, their airframes often suffer the same deal, a lot of nations with not much $$$ to spare are going to look for single engine lighter solutions, and thats something the Russians stopped offering since the Mig-23 and 21.

The other thing i see, is well...what if india or a larger investor dont really put much interest on it...well...its surely going to be a lot hard to "keep it a float"

 

[Dilandu]

Really? I don't see array of customers

Look at the list of nations that brought Su-30 and Su-35. Basically any of them could be interested in fifth-generation fighter at affordable cost.

 

[Scar]

Please let me be the only 'fool' this time and do not restart another naming contest

Funny reporting names, actually. I, personally, don't give a **** about the names US/NATO giving to our tech and, after all...no one can surpass MiG-15 Fagot, anyway.

And it won't be a reporting name, unless they can find a buyer.

Who told you they didnt, already?

Russia's Rostec to co-develop 5th-gen fighter with UAE

Sergey Chemezov, CEO of Russia defense heavyweight Rostec, spoke to Defense News about the deal, as well as hopes to expand cooperation with the United States under the Trump administration.

www.defensenews.com

 

[GARGEAN]

So... who about this: One R-74 class missile in each side bay. A ventral bay with two R-77 class missiles (would prefer R-37 class, but I'm not sure there is room)...

But they'll primarily pitch it to clients has also having 4xR-37 class missiles or 4x700kg class air-to-surface weapons carried by two S-70 Okhotnik that it leads into battle... 'checkmate' in terms of a chess set having multiple pieces which work together (only some of which are manned).

That is my bet on what they'll pitch.

Liking the sound of that so far Avimimus, the R-37 looks a bit big for internal carriage in the weapons bay, though it could be carried externally if stealth is not needed.

There is "derivative" of it, Izd.810, intended for internal carriage by Su-57. And 95% that those two have unified weapons bay.

 

[Hydroman]

Son of MIG-21 with a hint of X-32 and F-35.

And so who will buy it? China, Algeria?

China would probably pirate the design, don't think they would by it. I think India would probably buy, India seems to have purchased almost every type of aircraft from the US and European countries plus design and build their own, they buy and have it all!

 

[trose213]

Please let me be the only 'fool' this time and do not restart another naming contest

Funny reporting names, actually. I, personally, don't give a **** about the names US/NATO giving to our tech and, after all...no one can surpass MiG-15 Fagot, anyway.

And it won't be a reporting name, unless they can find a buyer.

Who told you they didnt, already?

Russia's Rostec to co-develop 5th-gen fighter with UAE

Sergey Chemezov, CEO of Russia defense heavyweight Rostec, spoke to Defense News about the deal, as well as hopes to expand cooperation with the United States under the Trump administration.

www.defensenews.com

The UAE is getting F-35s, so pretty redundant now.