Rear firing air-to-air missiles

[Temistocle]

Looking for rear firing air-to-air missile projects in this forum I found:

The Hawker P1184-16 proposal, with a tail gunner for the rear launched Taildog (being launched from a tube it has less disvantages compared to "normal" missiles like Sidewinder or R-73):

https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/taildog-sraam-aam.178/post-229793

https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/hawker-hs-1205-11-and-p-1216.9360/post-101807

A hint to a proposal to replace the gun tail turret on Tu-22M with a rocket launcher:

https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/tu-22m3m-backfire-upgrade-program.22382/post-334688

A couple of MiG 70.1 cutaways with two "rear facing" R-73 inside the bomb bay:
https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/th...s-izdelije-54-tactical-bombers.419/post-61146

The Grumman Design 143 Bushfire missile installed in the tail of the Martin P6M Seamaster:
https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/martin-p6m-seamaster.334/post-294079

A list of Bomber Defense Missile (BDM) proposals and for the XB-70:
https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/bomber-defense-missiles-bdm.9901/#post-400243
https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/north-american-xb-70.8220/post-354496

and the MX-904 for the B-52:
https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/tube-launched-air-to-air-missiles.2613/post-144971

but nothing about the R-73 test launches from a Su-27, tough the info found in Internet are minimal:



From Google Translate:

Reverse launch rocket with combined aerogasdynamic control
The missile is being developed on the basis of the R-73 missile and is intended for arming frontline, bomber, transport and anti-submarine aircraft. Provides protection for the rear hemisphere of the aircraft carrier.
Launches in the direction opposite to the flight direction of the carrier aircraft.
The missile ensures the destruction of air targets day and night, in the presence of natural and organized interference, against the background of the earth and water surfaces. Does not impose restrictions on the initial launch conditions, implements the "fire and forget" principle.

Technical characteristics of the "reverse" launch rocket
Launch weight, 115 kg
Length, 3.2 m
Diameter, 0.17 m
Wingspan, 0.404 m
Flight altitude of targets hit, 0.05 km minimum, 13 km maximum
Launch range, 1 km min, 10-12 maximum
Guidance: passive IR
Targeting angles: 60°
Qarhead weight: 7.4 kg

Provides target acquisition on a trajectory according to target designation from a rear-view radar.
Providing a controlled flight of a rocket with angles a f = 180 ° ... 90 ° in the "reverse" flight (V <0) using a gas-dynamic control system. It is used from the rail APS.
No analogues are known.
Development status: Stage of axial processing.
Launches from Su-27 aircraft to M <1 and M> 1 were carried out

 

[Blitzer9856]

Kindly what is the source of this? A manual, or?..

 

[Nik]

Don't forget the infamous fictional one from movie where parachute flare was ingested by Rus fighter closing for gun-kill...

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Kindly what is the source of this? A manual, or?..

I think it was a leaflet at MAKS airshow.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

I don't know if these count, but in WW 2, rear firing rocket launchers were tried on B-17's and 24's



This three tube 4.5" arrangement was tried and rejected. Interestingly, this version is reloadable through a hatch in the bottom of the plane.

 

[Gerard]

Don't forget the infamous fictional one from movie where parachute flare was ingested by Rus fighter closing for gun-kill...

Think that was FireFox with Clint Eastwood.

 

[NMaude]

I don't know if these count, but in WW 2, rear firing rocket launchers were tried on B-17's and 24's

View attachment 681067

This three tube 4.5" arrangement was tried and rejected. Interestingly, this version is reloadable through a hatch in the bottom of the plane.

View attachment 681068

That's a very dodgy looking arrangement.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

Here's how the B-24 installation was to work





And, the B-17 version.

 

[Firefinder]

The P6M Seamaster was to have a rear firing misdile launcher as well.

Somewhere here.

https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/martin-p6m-seamaster.334/page-2

 

[The K2]

Don't forget the infamous fictional one from movie where parachute flare was ingested by Rus fighter closing for gun-kill...

Think that was FireFox with Clint Eastwood.

In FIREFOX, it appeared the rearward defense pod had a rocket engine.

Sorry if my entry is off topic.

 

[Nik]

IIRC, again fictional, though probably inspired by an actual local kludge, rear-ward firing rockets appeared in a 'Biggles' WWI tale, cheerfully re-cycled for WW2 in 'Spitfire Parade'...

I think they were 'Very' flares in a cluster of improvised tubes, akin to smoke-poppers on AFVs...

IIRC, inventor barely survived test deployment, but German Ace who'd strafed him surely needed a change of pants...

( Hey, did you know Capt WE Johns also wrote space adventures, too ? Styled like AC Clarke's 'Lunar Mission' shorts... )

 

[The K2]

IIRC, again fictional, though probably inspired by an actual local kludge, rear-ward firing rockets appeared in a 'Biggles' WWI tale, cheerfully re-cycled for WW2 in 'Spitfire Parade'...

I think they were 'Very' flares in a cluster of improvised tubes, akin to smoke-poppers on AFVs...

IIRC, inventor barely survived test deployment, but German Ace who'd strafed him surely needed a change of pants...

( Hey, did you know Capt WE Johns also wrote space adventures, too ? Styled like AC Clarke's 'Lunar Mission' shorts... )

I agree with you on the Very Flare idea. However, when the defense pod(s) is used, the terms “drone tail unit,” and “rearward missile” come up. I believe flares and chaff can be fired, but also the whole pod can be ejected to save the pilot and plane.

About the Capt. Johns space adventures, no, I didn't know about that.

 

[klem]

Rocket launcher on a B-24 Liberator

Bet a tenner you havent seen this.... All coming from this ebay WWII US ARMY / AIR FORCE SET OF 11 B&W PHOTOGRAPHS - AIRCRAFT ROCKETS, SECRET. | eBay

ww2aircraft.net

 

[T. A. Gardner]

Rocket launcher on a B-24 Liberator

Bet a tenner you havent seen this.... All coming from this ebay WWII US ARMY / AIR FORCE SET OF 11 B&W PHOTOGRAPHS - AIRCRAFT ROCKETS, SECRET. | eBay

ww2aircraft.net

You owe me 10. See post 5

 

[Avimimus]

If we're including unguided systems then the Kamov/TsAGI A-7 autogyro and the Pe-2 (with RUB-2L and RUB-4) both were tested with defensive rearward firing RS-82 rockets (presumably with the time delayed fragmentation fuses equipped).

 

[Avimimus]

The P6M Seamaster was to have a rear firing misdile launcher as well.

Somewhere here.

https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/martin-p6m-seamaster.334/page-2

I believe the Lockheed Seasitter concept carried defensive missiles (I think they were side-ways firing though and I'm not sure if they could be used while airborne) and the CL-1201 concept certainly did (again - not sure how they were distributed, but probably could've had some type of rearward firing defences?).

 

[Nik]

Thank you.
'Sea Sitter' ?? Sorta catamaran WIG with a helipad ??
Yes, after usual diversions chasing fun stuff down rabbit-warren, searches arrived back here and at OBB's extensive site...

 

[pathology_doc]

Don't forget the infamous fictional one from movie where parachute flare was ingested by Rus fighter closing for gun-kill...

My recollection is that in the book, it was a flare; in the movie it was an actual rear-firing missile.

 

[Scott Kenny]

Don't forget the infamous fictional one from movie where parachute flare was ingested by Rus fighter closing for gun-kill...

Combined response:

My recollection is that in the book, it was a flare; in the movie it was an actual rear-firing missile.

Correct, in the book it was a flare, the movie turned it into a (more interesting, IMO, if less realistic) rear-firing missile.

Also more likely to FOD an engine than a flare, you'd have to get stupid close to ingest a flare.

In FIREFOX, it appeared the rearward defense pod had a rocket engine.

Yup! Was explicitly a flare in the books, though.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

Here's an obscure rear firing rocket on an aircraft, the 'Retrobomb / Retrorocket.' VP 63 was the only unit to use them in service. These were sort of a hedgehog ASW bomb with a rocket motor that were fired backwards from the aircraft.



My article on them:

https://www.usni.org/magazines/naval-history-magazine/2022/june/retro-bomb

 

[Scott Kenny]

Here's an obscure rear firing rocket on an aircraft, the 'Retrobomb / Retrorocket.' VP 63 was the only unit to use them in service. These were sort of a hedgehog ASW bomb with a rocket motor that were fired backwards from the aircraft.

View attachment 711690

My article on them:

https://www.usni.org/magazines/naval-history-magazine/2022/june/retro-bomb

Even today, sonobuoys are dropped at an angle such that they fall vertically from the aircraft, instead of forward at some distance.

 

[Dilandu]

Here's an obscure rear firing rocket on an aircraft, the 'Retrobomb / Retrorocket.' VP 63 was the only unit to use them in service. These were sort of a hedgehog ASW bomb with a rocket motor that were fired backwards from the aircraft.

Yep, the idea was to increase drop accuracy against something as small as submerged submarine from level flight. Since anti-submarine attacks were conducted from low altitude, sharply reducing the bomb velocity actually helped to improve accuracy... if the attack was conducted on exactly right altitude and velocity, of course. It was an interesting and capable weapon - but FIDO appeared soon, and it was just better.

 

[T. A. Gardner]

Yep, the idea was to increase drop accuracy against something as small as submerged submarine from level flight. Since anti-submarine attacks were conducted from low altitude, sharply reducing the bomb velocity actually helped to improve accuracy... if the attack was conducted on exactly right altitude and velocity, of course. It was an interesting and capable weapon - but FIDO appeared soon, and it was just better.

The idea was to drop the ASW bombs on the submarine as the plane passed over the target using its MAD (Magnetic Anomaly Detector) mounted on the tail of the aircraft. The retrobomb and MAD worked together to put rounds on target, and the only way to do that was to fire the rockets aft of the aircraft based on its speed.