sferrin said:Wonder if there's any relation to this:
DrRansom said:Is Japan bound by mtcr(sp?). Any reason for the 300km range besides export potential? The US has allowed Korea to go over 300km.
Japan plans missile to test Chinese strategy in East China Sea
Leo Lewis and Kana Inagaki in Tokyo
Japan's new missile, with a 300km range, will be able to cover the waters around the Senkaku islands
Japan is planning to develop a new tactical ballistic missile that would reset Chinese military strategy around disputed islands in the East China Sea.
Plans for the surface-to-ship weapon, which would be the longest-range missile ever built by Japan, have emerged after prolonged months of rancour between Tokyo and Beijing over rival territorial claims.
As tensions have persisted, Japan revealed last month that it scrambled fighter jets a record 199 times in the second quarter as Chinese military activities intensified around Japan’s territorial waters and drew closer to the uninhabited Senkaku islands — a chain known as the Diaoyu in China.
The new missile, say military experts familiar with the plans, is designed to “complicate enemy planning”. By positioning them on Japanese islands in the East China Sea and with a range that stretches to the edge of Japan’s territorial claims, the missiles would discourage naval aggression. If an attacking force were planning a landing on a Japanese island, its commander would need to destroy the missiles beforehand — in effect initiating conflict.
Japan’s move to build the missiles comes as the country strengthens its internal capability to develop military equipment after Prime Minister Shinzo Abe ended the country’s self-imposed ban on the export of weapons in 2014. The programme is part of a wider effort to reduce spending on foreign-made weaponry if a domestic alternative can be produced.
The new vehicle-mounted, GPS-guided missile system is expected to be deployed to locations such as the southern island of Miyako in Okinawa, according to people familiar with the plan.
With a range of about 300km, the system will be able to cover the waters around the Senkakus. Experts say the current Type 12 surface-to-ship missiles, which Japan procured in 2012, have a range of roughly 200km.
The defence ministry said it was studying ways to enhance its existing surface-to-ship missile capability to deter invasion of Japan’s remote islands.
But it declined to comment on details after an August 14 report in the Yomiuri Shimbun newsppaper said the new missiles were expected to be deployed around 2023.
Industry watchers say the move to develop a new missile is no surprise given that the ministry’s defence guidelines released in 2013 called for Japan’s Self Defence Forces to strengthen their ability to deal with attacks on islands using aircraft, naval vessels and missiles.
The ministry is currently explaining to local municipalities in Miyako and Ishigaki islands in Okinawa and Amami island of Kagoshima in southern Japan about its plan to deploy its surface-to-ship guided-missile units.
It is expected to seek funding for development of the new missile in its initial budget requests for the 2017-18 fiscal year, to be submitted later this month.
Governments in the Asia-Pacific region are closely scrutinising Japan’s military posture following this month’s appointment of Tomomi Inada as the country’s defence minister. The outspoken nationalist, who returned on Wednesday from a visit to a Japanese military base in Djibouti, has previously expressed a hardline position on Japan’s territorial rights in the East China Sea.
Hood said:Might be just a journalistic error, after all the first line calls the missile a "tactical ballistic missile". :
Japanese version of Tomahawk eyed
8:20 pm, November 20, 2017
The Yomiuri Shimbun
The government is considering developing a cruise missile capable of striking targets on the ground.
The Defense Ministry plans to start research on antiship missiles from fiscal 2018, and it is considering adding land-attack capabilities to the missiles. If realized, it will be the first time for Japan to develop land-attack cruise missiles on a full scale.
The key aim of the plan is to regain control of remote islands occupied by enemies, but the new cruise missile will be technically able to attack enemy bases, which is expected to heighten deterrence of North Korea.
Cruise missiles are precision guided weapons that head for targets using on-board radar and other equipment. Compared to ballistic missiles that fly on a parabolic curve and come from above, cruise missiles fly level using wings and jet engines, just like aircraft. Since the envisaged cruise missiles have much in common with the U.S. Tomahawk cruise missile, officials of the Defense Ministry position the planned cruise missiles as a “Japanese version of the Tomahawk.”
The Defense Ministry asked for ¥7.7 billion in its budget request for fiscal 2018 for research on a new antiship guided missile to defend remote islands. The ministry announced that it would start research on new antiship missiles, and it is considering incorporating land-attack missile functions that have many technical commonalities. The ministry aims to build a test model by fiscal 2022.
In the planning stage, the envisaged antiship cruise missile will have a range of over 300 kilometers, and be capable of being launched from special vehicles, destroyers, P1 patrol aircraft, fighter jets and other places. The missile will fly low using GPS and other devices, switch to on-board radar just before reaching a target, and destroy it.
With a shape that enhances its stealth capability, the new missile will be better able than U.S. Tomahawk cruise missiles of escaping enemies’ radar nets. In addition, the ministry also will consider introducing functions to enable the new missile to avoid interceptions more easily, such as changing directions during flight.
The government is considering developing land-attack, antiship cruise missiles due to a sense of urgency over the Chinese military, which is pushing to modernize itself in tandem with its maritime advancement. If the missiles are deployed, Japan’s ability to attack vessels approaching remote islands or ground forces landing on such islands will significantly increase. If vessels or aircraft equipped with the missile are deployed near enemy bases, they can be used to attack bases.
However, the government takes the stance that Japan is allowed to have the capability to attack enemy bases under the Constitution, but will not possess the capability as a policy decision from the perspective of the country’s exclusively defense-oriented policy. Within the government and the Liberal Democratic Party, there is the opinion that Japan should have the capability to attack enemy bases given the situation surrounding North Korea. However, the government will promote the development of the new cruise missile focusing on the defense of remote islands.
Among defense equipment developed by the Japanese government in the past, its antiship missiles can be categorized as cruise missiles, such as vehicle-mounted Type 88 surface-to-ship guided missiles; Type 90 ship-to-ship guided missiles, which are an improved version of the Type 88 missile; and Type 93 air-to-ship guided missiles.
sferrin said:Sounds like a customer for JASSM-ER / LRASM.
Hood said:This sounds very much like the earlier solid-fueled 300km weapon linked earlier (August 2016). Could it be journalistic inaccuracy making both sound like separate programmes or have the JSDF simply looked at the range of options and found the cruise-missile is the better option as being more flexible and offering the advantages of additional range and multiple platforms?
Grey Havoc said:The IRBM is currently scheduled to enter service in 2023, while, based on it's known/inferred development schedule, the cruise missile won't be entering service before 2025 at the earliest, barring a crash program.
Grey Havoc said:sferrin said:Sounds like a customer for JASSM-ER / LRASM.
The Japanese appear to have a pretty poor opinion of that missile family, though this may be somewhat coloured by the ongoing difficulties they are having with Lockheed Martin re. the F-35J.
Grey Havoc said:The GSDF's IRBM is intended as a rapid response, MTCR compliant
Perhaps they can purchase the data and IP on Northrop-Grumman's ill-fated TSSAM (AGM-137A/BGM-137B)?sferrin said:Sounds like a customer for JASSM-ER / LRASM.
elmayerle said:Perhaps they can purchase the data and IP on Northrop-Grumman's ill-fated TSSAM (AGM-137A/BGM-137B)?sferrin said:Sounds like a customer for JASSM-ER / LRASM.
kaiserbill said:Or maybe they will, you know, develop their own missile.
sferrin said:Sounds like a customer for JASSM-ER / LRASM.
kaiserbill said:sferrin said:Sounds like a customer for JASSM-ER / LRASM.
Yes, for real.
Not everything has to turn XXX-centric as some like to push.
Japan has developed a few of their own turbojet powered anti-ship missiles with ranges approaching 200km. (ASM-1 and ASM-2)
They are also busy bringing the ramjet powered ASM-3 to fruition.
Postwar, Japan has designed and built turbojets, and low and high bypass turbofans.
The type of cruise missile intimated in the press reports are well within their scope, and fits in with their other munitions/weapons development.
Maybe they will develop their own missile, as they're intimating in the press reports.
Personal wishlists of what others want them to buy are neither here nor there.
kaiserbill said:Anyway, below is an edit from my previous post"
EDIT: In the original post, it indeed seems to be that they are wanting to develop an anti-ship missile, with a land attack derivitive. I'm not sure where this leaves a Tomahawk type cruise missile, nor indeed the upcoming ramjet powered ASM-3 in the scheme of things.
marauder2048 said:Grey Havoc said:The GSDF's IRBM is intended as a rapid response, MTCR compliant
An MTCR compliant, conventionally armed IRBM is practically a contradiction in terms.
Reposting slide: Japan's evident interest in LRPF co-development/co-production is potentially relevant here.
kaiserbill said:Starviking, that was basically what I was thinking too, hence why I mentioned the ASM-1 through to 3 regarding range.
These are approaching 200km already, so when the article in the original post stated ranges required of around 300km, and then toward the end intimated a link with an anti-ship variant, I immediately thought of a longer ranged ASM-3.
But could a ram-jet powered vehicle really be described as a "cruise" missile? ;D
kaiserbill said:But could a ram-jet powered vehicle really be described as a "cruise" missile? ;D
mrmalaya said:oh, look here is an article which may have some bearing on the topic:
https://asia.nikkei.com/Politics-Economy/International-Relations/Japan-and-UK-to-collaborate-on-missile-development
sferrin said:mrmalaya said:oh, look here is an article which may have some bearing on the topic:
https://asia.nikkei.com/Politics-Economy/International-Relations/Japan-and-UK-to-collaborate-on-missile-development
That's for an air-to-air missile.
A former Air Self-Defense Force general said that "if the U.K. hands engine technology over to Japan,
we can use it to develop anti-ship missiles and other weapons as well."
marauder2048 said:sferrin said:mrmalaya said:oh, look here is an article which may have some bearing on the topic:
https://asia.nikkei.com/Politics-Economy/International-Relations/Japan-and-UK-to-collaborate-on-missile-development
That's for an air-to-air missile.
That's what I thought but from the article:
A former Air Self-Defense Force general said that "if the U.K. hands engine technology over to Japan,
we can use it to develop anti-ship missiles and other weapons as well."
sferrin said:Hmmm. One would think Japan would already have suitable small turbofan technology. (The engine used in the UK's Storm Shadow is French.) ???