Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II Joint Strike Fighter (JSF)

Rusty iron oxide is poor conductor ,kinda opposite of what stealth coating should be , so you can take the claim that its of no consequence with a grain of salt.
 
Mr.T said:
Naval enviroment sure is rusting up the stealth paint

View attachment 779236View attachment 779237
Click to expand...
Something I wonder and someone please correct me if I'm wrong here. But as far as I understand the coating utilizes ferrite particles which are suspended in a medium in order to absorb incoming radar waves and dissipate the absorbed radiation as heat.

But if the particles are suspended in a medium (I assume some form of paint or epoxy resin like stuff), how do moisture and air get to said particles in order to get such levels of corrosion? Is the coating "open pore" like untreated wood? So lacking a protective top coating (which would presumably influence RAM properties?).
 
EmoBirb said:
Something I wonder and someone please correct me if I'm wrong here. But as far as I understand the coating utilizes ferrite particles which are suspended in a medium in order to absorb incoming radar waves and dissipate the absorbed radiation as heat.

But if the particles are suspended in a medium (I assume some form of paint or epoxy resin like stuff), how do moisture and air get to said particles in order to get such levels of corrosion? Is the coating "open pore" like untreated wood? So lacking a protective top coating (which would presumably influence RAM properties?).
Click to expand...
The coatings are just getting abraded from regular wear, and possibly degraded from UV exposure as well. You can tell just how recently a civilian airliner has been to the shop by how shiny the paint is. All bright and shiny, it's fresh out of the shop. If you're starting to see grime on the belly it's been a year or two. If the paint looks kinda dull, it's time to go back to the shop.
 
TomcatViP said:
Not really: Mig29, F-18 and Mirage 2000 have shown us that having the ability to trade aggressively some speed for large alpha is a serious threat constantly in the mind of any opponent with an aspiration to survive the fight. It impacts the way they have to manage the fight, pushing them away from their performance corner.
F-35 large alpha offset is also comfortably done in yaw allowing the fighter to increase its turn rate at a very low G (the pedal turn), at any moment. Good luck dealing with that while blasting any cognition out of your brain at 9g.
Click to expand...
with 50G short range missile, is it usefull?
 
Who knows... It's not like the codding industry as shown us any kind of rigorous anticipation when it comes to real world physics.
 
TomcatViP said:
Abrasion from Salt (sea spray), superficial degradation by grease and fuel vapor, direct erosion by jet blast, contamination by foot steps... There are plenty of factors on an aircraft carrier at sea for anyone baby skin to get pealed.

View attachment 779272
Click to expand...
When I was on CVN-65 (80-84), we transitioned from the brightly colored scheme to the all gray you see now, the gray paint had kind of a flat surface texture and sopped up all liquids, oils, solvents, etc so all of our F-14s, A-6/EA-6, A-7s, S-3s and SH-3s looked severely mottled in appearance, hard to clean and basically looked like crap.
 
Told y'all!

US Envoy to Syria Tom Barrack on Türkiye's F-35 crisis:

We will find a solution.

This issue dates back to 2017 and was a misunderstood matter. A decade later, we're in a very different environment and moving toward a solution.

The F-35, F-16, S-400 issue — which was a political dispute — all of them have solutions.

I hope we see a resolution in the short term. I believe we're getting closer
Click to expand...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1950617505413861391
View: https://x.com/clashreport/status/1950617505413861391?t=NIhK9fctM8E9LJVIVpDObQ&s=19
 
BonPlan2 said:
with 50G short range missile, is it usefull?
Click to expand...
Anything that increases your range of potential manoeuvres is potentially useful, there's always going to be edge cases where a manoeuvre changes the scenario from just inside the missile's kinematics to just outside. The problem with high-alpha, slower-speed manoeuvres is that even if you avoid the first guy, you're just setting up an easy shot for his wingman. (I'm slightly paraphrasing one of the Typhoon test-pilots, who was actually talking about why VIFFing Harriers were still dead meat, but slow is slow).
 
So dead meat that they wiped out the entire AF of the Argies with Panache.

Sorry but an argumentation based on false precincts is at least dubious.
 
Because of the way trade works between the two counties and the fact the Swiss public just aren’t that interested in many US products, plus there’s only nine million Swiss. That the only way the Swiss can respond to such huge tariffs is to go the retaliatory route of pulling Swiss investment in the US, and cancelling big orders with the US including their F-35 order this article indicates.

Confusion and anger in Switzerland - hit by highest tariffs in Europe https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c987l633zdgo
 
fightingirish said:
The first three F-35B Lightning II STOVL jets for the Japan Air Self-Defense Force (JASDF) were seen during a refueling stop in Hawaii and are currently heading to Japan. They’re expected to arrive at Nyutabaru Airbase on August 7, 2025.
Source:
https://theaviationist.com/2025/08/02/first-japanese-f-35b-spotted-en-route-to-japan/
Click to expand...
Air SDF? Odd, I was expecting them to be part of the MSDF. Or is everything that flies Air SDF, even if it's an ASW helicopter that is operated off of ships?
 
Scott Kenny said:
Air SDF? Odd, I was expecting them to be part of the MSDF. Or is everything that flies Air SDF, even if it's an ASW helicopter that is operated off of ships?
Click to expand...

JMSDF flies its own helicopters (ASW and MCM) and fixed-wing aircraft (MPAs, some SAR/transport aircraft, and trainers). They don't have any sort of fast jet training pipeline, so it makes sense to place that capability in the JASDF. Plus, there are potential roles for the F-35Bs aside from shipborne operations.
 
I agree EmoBirb, it is a strange situation that the UK are in with the RAF being the first with the 617 getting the F-35B then 809 Naval Air Squadron. Getting them to fly of the QE carriers that are operated by the Navy.
 
Deltafan said:
https://www.reuters.com/business/ae...f-35-fighter-jets-el-pais-reports-2025-08-06/
Click to expand...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1953063434758640057
View: https://x.com/Helofresh/status/1953063434758640057


Looks like Juan Carlos I will be without an fixed wing fighter past 2030...weirdly the Spanish Navy is looking at 2 larger LHD to replace JC1 post 2037. Surely they'll have to revisit then? As the UK found out though its hard (and vey expensive) to regenerate a naval fixed wing capability...
 
Last edited:
FighterJock said:
I agree EmoBirb, it is a strange situation that the UK are in with the RAF being the first with the 617 getting the F-35B then 809 Naval Air Squadron. Getting them to fly of the QE carriers that are operated by the Navy.
Click to expand...
And the OC of 617 is a Royal Marine....
 
I had forgotten that the OC of 617 is a Royal Marine Hood, this whole joint force structure gets weirder and weirder. :rolleyes:
 
I would not be surprised if Spain reversed that decision in the future especially if a right-leaning government is elected in two years. In fact, Sánchez's government might not even last that long given the ongoing corruption scandal(s).

And if Trump were to approve the sale of F-35s to Morocco (or if Algeria gets the Su-57)... they might have a change of heart.

I could be wrong but IMHO we havent heard the last of the F-35 in Spain.
 
It's a terrible decision, like before or, let's say, too many others when politics take the horn of defense procurement.
Defense is beyond partisanery. That the USA have a special turn in internal and foreign politics should be transparent to Spain defense posture.

Now it's a long way to the end of the tunnel for those poor F/A-18 and surviving AV-8 (although way less dramatic for them as the type being retired by the USMC leave plenty of opportunities to patch the airframe).
 
Iran Operation Leaves US Longing for Israeli F-35 Upgrade

Re: F-35 CFTs
Article dated 7/8/25 but I didn't see this posted.

Sorties averaged about 1,000 miles (one way) and, at least in one case, stretched to 1,400 miles to bomb an Iranian Air Force aerial refueling tanker at Mashhad Airport.
Click to expand...
A portion of those flights were made by the F-35I, or “Adir” (Hebrew for “mighty”), the Israeli-customized version of Lockheed Martin’s F-35A Lightning II fighter jet.

According to reports cited by Maariv, Israel was able to increase the range of its planes by using external fuel tanks and conformal fuel tanks—extra fuel tanks fitted closely to the aircraft’s profile—without compromising its stealth capability.
Click to expand...
Israel’s F-35Is flew over Turkey, Jordan, Syria and Iraq without being detected, Maariv reported. They utilized two types of fuel tanks: a 425-gallon external fuel tank made by Israel’s Elbit Systems, which is suspended under the wings and ejected before entering enemy territory; and an 800-gallon conformal tank, developed in collaboration with Israel Aerospace Industries and Lockheed Martin.
Click to expand...
The latter is installed next to the fuselage without compromising its stealth profile.
Click to expand...

I cannot speak to the credibility of the source, but this seems quite specific.
 
TomcatViP said:
It's a terrible decision, like before or, let's say, too many others when politics take the horn of defense procurement.
Defense is beyond partisanery.
Click to expand...

No, defense is pure politics through and through, and in this instance it's foreign policy as well. Meaning politics are always at the horn with regards to procurement. Procurement that's politically not viable (creating jobs, developing the industry, forging alliances) are doomed to fail.
 
Last edited:
VishnuOsiris said:
I cannot speak to the credibility of the source, but this seems quite specific.
Click to expand...

As far as we know there are no attachment points, or fueling routes for a conformal tank on any F-35 variant. There is some serious engineering, structural reinforcement and testing to be done for a conformal tank to be flight ready...let alone combat capable....and Israel has 1 x F-35I test aircraft.....Let alone the design effort to build a LO conformal tank that actually works in conjunction with an LO airframe (can you imagine the interdependencies around signature management??).

800 gallons of JP-8 is 5,440 lb.'s.....that's 2,467 kg....2.5 tonnes, and that's not including the tank structure....

You don't just bungee cord that weight on an aircraft....

Put me in the very, very sceptical group for conformal tanks....
 
Last edited:
in collaboration with Israel Aerospace Industries and Lockheed Martin.
Click to expand...

Shouldn't the US be aware of it for several years then though? Why hasn't there been a push by LM to sell these to other customers, or at least a sales pitch to the US military?
 
EmoBirb said:
Shouldn't the US be aware of it for several years then though? Why hasn't there been a push by LM to sell these to other customers, or at least a sales pitch to the US military?
Click to expand...

Exactly...the USMC has them on their wish list as well...so you can guarantee they would have been seen on test in the US at least...
 
Last edited:
Deltafan said:
https://www.reuters.com/business/ae...f-35-fighter-jets-el-pais-reports-2025-08-06/
Click to expand...
Point of correction: How can you cancel something that doesn't exist? While I believe the F-35A would make a good replacement for the Spanish EF-18 Hornets (currently planned to remain in service until ~2037), there has been no order placed and as far as I am aware, not even any discussions. More likely in the nearer term would be a F-35B order to replace their AV-8Bs. If the Spanish Navy wishes to remain in the fixed wing game they have no real options other than the F-35B.
 
GTX said:
Point of correction: How can you cancel something that doesn't exist? While I believe the F-35A would make a good replacement for the Spanish EF-18 Hornets (currently planned to remain in service until ~2037), there has been no order placed and as far as I am aware, not even any discussions. More likely in the nearer term would be a F-35B order to replace their AV-8Bs. If the Spanish Navy wishes to remain in the fixed wing game they have no real options other than the F-35B.
Click to expand...

It's been a fairly constant back and forth since 2021, with some official expression of interest (but not classified level briefs) back then, coupled with an official denial of plans to procure F-35. Then in 2023 another denial, and a third round of denials today. Possibly more related to the shakiness of FCAS/SCAF?
 

Similar threads

Back
Top Bottom