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Iran military downs US RQ-170 Sentinel spy drone

crabanero

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http://www.presstv.ir/detail/213765.html

Iran military downs US spy drone Sun Dec 4, 2011 2:17PMLAST UPDATE
pirhayati20111204145914810.jpg
An American RQ-170 Sentinel unmanned reconnaissance aircraft (file photo)A senior Iranian military official says Iran's Army has shot down a remote-controlled reconnaissance drone operated by the US military in the eastern part of the country.

The informed source said on Sunday that Iran Army's electronic warfare unit successfully targeted the American-built RQ-170 Sentinel stealth aircraft after it crossed into Iranian airspace over the border with neighboring Afghanistan.

He added that the US reconnaissance drone has been seized with minimum damage.

The RQ-170 is a stealth unmanned aircraft designed and developed by Lockheed Martin Company.

The US military and the CIA use the drone to launch missile strikes in Afghanistan and in Pakistan's northwestern tribal region.

The unnamed Iranian military official further added that “due to the clear border violation, the operational and electronic measures taken by the Islamic Republic of Iran's Armed Forces against invading aircraft will not remain limited to the Iran's borders."

The report comes as the United States has beefed up its military presence in and around the Persian Gulf region in recent months in the wake of popular uprising in Bahrain.

The US Department of Defense says Washington is closely monitoring the developments in Bahrain, which is the headquarters of the US Navy's Fifth Fleet and holds some 4,200 US service members.

MP/HGH
 

Eagle2009

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This has been posted in the dedicated RQ-170 thread, probably the best place to keep this discussion.

EDIT: Nevermind, apparently the dedicated thread was accidentially deleted. So I suppose this is as good a place as any.

For starters, and this is a real shock, PressTV (as well as FarsNews) are using an incorrect photo of the RQ-170. That image is clearly a French UCAV demonstrator, the Petit Duc.

And no confirmation as of yet with photographic evidence and considering the possible propaganda value of such a thing, IF it really happened we should expect the supposedly intact wreckage to be shown publically.
 
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sublight

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Eagle2009 said:
This has been posted in the dedicated RQ-170 thread, probably the best place to keep this discussion.

Didn't that thread get accidentally deleted?
 

Eagle2009

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Reports from Iran's new agencies claim Iranian electronic warfare units "hacked" the Sentinel's controls and intentionally crash-landed it. This "in theory" explains how they "shot down" the drone and yet it was captured intact.

http://www.farsnews.com/newstext.php?nn=13900913001157

And as you might expect, many on the net are predicting the Chinese and Russians are hoping to see this drone IF it was really downed at all. Though technically, if I remember properly the Sentinel was deliberately designed with less sophisticated stealth technology/construction just in case it did fall into enemy hands.

Also, the US Military spokesman in Iraq was stated he doesn't know of any such operations of RQ-170s at the time it was supposedly shot down.
 

Deino

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crabanero said:
An American RQ-170 Sentinel unmanned reconnaissance aircraft (file photo)A senior Iranian military official says Iran's Army has shot down a remote-controlled reconnaissance drone operated by the US military in the eastern part of the country.

But why do this photo then show a French Petit Duc ???
 

blackstar

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http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2011/12/04/world/middleeast/AP-ML-Iran-Drone.html?hp

In January the Iranians claimed to have shot down two US drones, but never showed them. In July an Iranian lawmaker claimed that they had shot down another one, but the Revolutionary Guard claimed that they had shot down one of their own test targets.

So unless they actually display wreckage, I think we have to be wary of these claims.
 

flateric

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Eagle2009 said:
Reports from Iran's new agencies claim Iranian electronic warfare units "hacked" the Sentinel's controls and intentionally crash-landed it. This "in theory" explains how they "shot down" the drone and yet it was captured intact.
another One Thousand and One Nights story I guess
 
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sublight

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Eagle2009 said:
Reports from Iran's new agencies claim Iranian electronic warfare units "hacked" the Sentinel's controls and intentionally crash-landed it. This "in theory" explains how they "shot down" the drone and yet it was captured intact.
Total bullsh*t. They (DoD) use crypt key based comms to the Sentinel. Now I might believe the Chinese took some crypt keys from Lockheed through the RSA hack, but you can bet your ass Lockheed and the DoD went and loaded new keys on the drone. And if the Chinese managed to get keys I don't think they would be crazy enough to share them with Iran.
 

blackstar

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The latest update to a Washington Post article quotes an unnamed official stating that they lost touch with a drone a week ago in Afghanistan. So it looks like there is some truth to the story--a drone was lost. No indication of type.
 

AeroFranz

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considering all the incidents (unexplained explosions) that have been occurring inside Iran, the government must be eager to show that they are doing something.
 

quellish

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blackstar said:
The latest update to a Washington Post article quotes an unnamed official stating that they lost touch with a drone a week ago in Afghanistan. So it looks like there is some truth to the story--a drone was lost. No indication of type.

It's probably just screening its calls.
 

blackstar

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Watched ABC Evening News an hour ago and they had at least one "senior U.S. military official" confirming that a drone was missing. But the U.S. is not commenting on the type of aircraft.

I suspect that this could be a case where the U.S. lost contact with the aircraft and did not know where it went down. They spent a week looking for it, hoping that it did not go down in Iran. It's possible that it was simply flying over Afghanistan and not targeted on Iran, but contact was lost.

Right now, the U.S. military is following the standard practice of not confirming anything and waiting until the Iranians tip their hand.
 

Abraham Gubler

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That the Iranians have failed to display any photographic evidence of the downed UAV is highly dubious. Especially as they claim they controlled its downing via a hacked data link. Which would imply they know where it crashed and since they have helicopters could have at least taken a single photo even if it come down in inaccessible terrain. They didn’t wait a week or so to get photos of the Eagle Claw wreckage onto the news wire…

This sounds like an opportunistic media flash that has succeeded on all scores. That is having heard the US is looking for a lost drone somewhere in western Afghanistan as they would via US forces asking local villagers if they had heard or seen a UAV crash. They have then prepped up a press release claiming a kill and sent it out on the world media fax stream. Media outlets pick it up and run it without any supporting evidence and Iran gets a propaganda win. Sure it will be exposed as BS later on but the Arab Street and Regular Joes of the west won’t ever hear about that.
 

blackstar

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Abraham Gubler said:
This sounds like an opportunistic media flash that has succeeded on all scores. That is having heard the US is looking for a lost drone somewhere in western Afghanistan as they would via US forces asking local villagers if they had heard or seen a UAV crash. They have then prepped up a press release claiming a kill and sent it out on the world media fax stream. Media outlets pick it up and run it without any supporting evidence and Iran gets a propaganda win. Sure it will be exposed as BS later on but the Arab Street and Regular Joes of the west won’t ever hear about that.

That's certainly feasible. I've always been amazed that even really inept propaganda can be effective. At least some people will believe this, even if the Iranians never display any wreckage.
 

unclejim

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Effort to divert attention from the explosion at their rocket works.
 

UpForce

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unclejim said:
Effort to divert attention from the explosion at their rocket works.

Frankly the Iranian ... regime has so much to divert attention from these days that they needn't bother. They're losing leverage fast in Syria (and thus the wider region, many in the Arab league won't mind this at all), are probably woefully unprepared to bolster the Assad clan in any meaningful way (outright intrusion), and are almost guaranteed to run out of time in developing their nukes capability (let alone means of delivery) to compensate for the eventuality of their closest allies' fall. The mood among Tehran's elite must've shifted from paranoid to ... I don't know, what comes after that? Delusional, psychotic? To me it seems that their propaganda remains effective only in the sense that the repression (Basij, secret police, the usual) prevents most citizens from laughing out loud at the obviously ludicrous concoctions, so only fear remains ... with only one side, the young majority, being afforded the possibility of ridding themselves of that. The elite will know no such luxury and they know it; in that, whether an RQ-170 has crashed on Iranian soil or not makes no difference whatsoever.
 

rousseau

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Without jamming, all so-called stealth tech is rubbish. This case teach lot.....
 

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consealed said:
Without jamming, all so-called stealth tech is rubbish. This case teach lot.....

Can't believe you've made it to 288 posts with "insight" of that quality. ::)
 

ikke666

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This is the official statement of nato:

http://www.isaf.nato.int/article/isaf-releases/isaf-releases-statement-on-missing-unmanned-aerial-vehicle-dec-5-2011.html
 
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AAAdrone

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I'll believe that we've lost an RQ-170 to Iran's military when I see pictures.

Oh and consealed, F-117s have been operating without substantial off-board jamming support back in the days of Gulf War and Allied Force. The only loss was a fluke due to flying a predictable route. The same is said for the B-2s and the only loss was caused by rain. ;)
 
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sublight

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http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/12/05/us-military-sources-iran-has-missing-us-drone/

I didn't see this one coming......
 

blackstar

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http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story.jsp?id=news/awx/2011/12/05/awx_12_05_2011_p0-401894.xml&headline=Downed%20UAV%20Technology%20Already%20Dated&channel=defense

Downed UAV Technology Already Dated
Dec 5, 2011

By David A. Fulghum, Bill Sweetman

Even if Iran has, as it claims, shot down a Lockheed Martin RQ-170 unmanned aerial system (UAS), the single-channel, full-motion video capability that made the stealthy flying wing so invaluable when it debuted in Afghanistan about two years ago is considered outdated, potentially limiting the intelligence fallout.
For now, U.S. intelligence- and surveillance-related sources only will say the downed aircraft was “possibly” the RQ-170 Sentinel. One source tells Aviation Week there is a “50-50” chance it is the Sentinel.
 

Abraham Gubler

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blackstar said:
For now, U.S. intelligence- and surveillance-related sources only will say the downed aircraft was “possibly” the RQ-170 Sentinel. One source tells Aviation Week there is a “50-50” chance it is the Sentinel.

Call me old fashioned but wasn't a 'source' someone who actually knew what happened? Rather than someone making a guess?
 

blackstar

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Abraham Gubler said:
blackstar said:
For now, U.S. intelligence- and surveillance-related sources only will say the downed aircraft was “possibly” the RQ-170 Sentinel. One source tells Aviation Week there is a “50-50” chance it is the Sentinel.

Call me old fashioned but wasn't a 'source' someone who actually knew what happened? Rather than someone making a guess?

You noticed that, huh?
 

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http://worldnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/12/05/9226787-drone-that-crashed-in-iran-risks-secret-us-technology

If this crashed/landed in the remote mountains of Iran, how was Iran aware of its presence and able to search/locate it? I would assume they would not have been able to see it with radar at any point due to the stealth technology, and I would think that aerial surveillance of a remote area would be unlikely. Did they find it because it landed near a village in the remote area? Or, was Iran made aware of the recovery operation via signal or human intelligence? Or, are there other possibilities?
 

quellish

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Contrary to the first paragraph of the article, RQ-170 was operational over Afghanistan in 2007.

Photos or videos of wreckage are going to be the closest thing to ground truth we're going to get considering where this (supposedly) happened. NATO has not given a type for the lost UAV, which is interesting.
 

blackstar

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http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/drone-belonged-to-cia-officials-say/2011/12/05/gIQAylYGYO_story.html?hpid=z2

Drone belonged to CIA, officials say

By Greg Miller, Published: December 5

The unmanned surveillance plane lost by the United States in Iran was a stealth aircraft being used for secret missions by the CIA, U.S. officials said Monday.
The officials said Iran’s military appears to be in possession of one of the more sensitive surveillance platforms in the CIA’s fleet, an aircraft that was shaped and designed to evade enemy defenses.
 

Gridlock

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Would they confirm type if it were an acknowledged airframe, which I believe the 170 counts as? Or is their reticence to do with breaching sovereign airspace? (falls over laughing)
 

blackstar

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Gridlock said:
Would they confirm type if it were an acknowledged airframe, which I believe the 170 counts as? Or is their reticence to do with breaching sovereign airspace? (falls over laughing)

My suspicion is that the U.S. has a policy in place that calls for confirming only the basic information and providing nothing more.

If you think back to the U-2 incident in 1960, one of the screw ups in that situation was that the U.S. government actually put out a cover story that was then proven to be false--they said that it was a NASA weather aircraft that had gone off course. They said this thinking that the plane would be in tiny little pieces and the pilot would be dead. When the Soviets revealed they had the pilot, and Powers confirmed that he worked for the CIA, and then the Soviets revealed that they also had reconnaissance film, this made the White House look very bad.

So in this case, my suspicion is that U.S. officials suspect that the Iranians have the aircraft, but they don't know if that is true. It is entirely possible that the aircraft is in tiny little pieces on the side of a mountain and the Iranians don't have any wreckage at all, but just know that it crashed. So the U.S. government is not going to provide any details that it doesn't have to.
 

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Mat Parry

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Meh, the oft quoted 6 million dollar price tag and the apparently out dated stealth technology (engine inlet grills etc) suggest that this was an asset that was designed with the expectation that it may be lost at some point.

The line often quoted about Quartz was, if the aircraft was lost the crash site and surrounding area would have to bombed back to the stone age to protect the technology. The sensible approach here seems to have been to only risk the level of technology required to get the job done. The loss of at least one of these birds was therefore very likely, hey at least it got the OBL job done (which may have been it's original design goal).
 

Zeppelin

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Could Iran actually cyber attack a drone, and get it to land in one piece?
I'm sure its unlikely to surface from a US military source - and if Iran could actually do this, they probably would keep very quiet about it too.
Most likely it's put out to scare off future incursions and potential other losses in unmanned craft.


http://jeffreycarr.blogspot.com/2011/12/how-iran-may-have-captured-rq-170.html


and back to some 2009 articles, re drone intercepting drone video feeds
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB126102247889095011.html
and
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5gVfpsQcogZoD0Bx0efyryW0QK63Q


Regards..
 

flateric

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_uv6Welnco&feature=channel_video_title
 

chuck4

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sferrin said:
And here I was accused of being stoopid for suggesting they were over Iran. :p


The atmosphere in this thread suggests entheusiasts of American prowess learned even less than nothing from Eisenhower's colossal blunder of falling straight into Kruschev's trap after Gray Power's U-2 was shot down.
 

CJGibson

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Must've cost a fortune to get Gerard Butler and Robert de Niro to appear in that film.

I'll get me coat...
 

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