• Hi Guest! Forum rules have been updated. All users please read here.

Idea: Private Project Detective

Orionblamblam

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
8,253
Reaction score
1,921
Website
www.aerospaceprojectsreview.com
Basic capitalist economics 101: find a need, fill it with a product. Well, how's this:

A lot of people would love to do research at such-and-such archive (Air and Space Museum, San Diego Aerospace Museum, etc.) but for whatever reason, can't do it. Largely due to the headaches involved with flying cross/intercontinentally.

Well... I want to step up my archival travelling and digging to research topics for my own interest. But now that I am doing this semi-professionally rather than just as a tertiary side hobby, I have much more time for this sort of thing. But it still costs money. So, how's this: if you want to reseach something at Archive X, but you can't go due to schedule conflicts, high international air travel costs, or because you're still locked in federal prison for that unfortunate incident with the whipped cream, the belly dancers and the small neutron bomb... you send me money, I go and do the research for you.

Typically private investigators get some standard rate plus expenses. In this case, "expenses" would include air travel, rental car and motel. But if you want research done at an archive I want to do my *own* research in... the standard rate could be "zero."


Does this sound remotely useful or interesting?
 

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,983
Reaction score
5,325
Its definitely interesting Scott - there's a number of archives I'd like you to visit. I don't think I can afford it though. It might be possible for a number of people to all give something and communally raise enough, but bear in mind when I took donations for the site only about 12 people actually donated.
 

Orionblamblam

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
8,253
Reaction score
1,921
Website
www.aerospaceprojectsreview.com
Shrug. Would anyone complain if Tony Buttler or Dennis Jenkins or Jay Miller posted stuff here, and mentioned their new publications? Anyone? Anyone? No?

Thank you and goodnight.
 

Pit

ACCESS: Confidential
Joined
Dec 29, 2005
Messages
145
Reaction score
10
What kind of archives do you visit?

I'm interested on avionics stuff...mostly old types (the ones that aren't in service, and nobody cares about)...I would like to know per example, what were the standards of radio-electronic equipment some 30-40 years ago...

Is that "forbidden" in the US?...I know at England there are museums or archives that holds some nice files...Paul know about that.
 

Orionblamblam

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
8,253
Reaction score
1,921
Website
www.aerospaceprojectsreview.com
Pit said:
What kind of archives do you visit?

So far, off the top of my head, the Boeing historical archives, NASA-Ames tech library, NASA-Marshall historical archives, U of Alabama library (vast quantity of Saturn stuff in Special Collections), NASM, USAF Museum archives, some others. In the near future I plan on hitting Jay Millers archives and the Bell museum in Niagara Falls. Eventually (within, hopefully, the next two years or so) I plan on getting to the Martin, Convair and McDonnell-Douglas archives. If someone was willing to help foot the bills, I could be persuaded to go to specific archives to look up various things. The one big quandry might be ITAR stuff. Hard to tell what the US Gubmint might decide htat them dirty furriners shouldn't be allowed to see...
 

Stormbreaker

ACCESS: Restricted
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
32
Reaction score
0
Very curious!

Pardon me for asking, but is there a reason why several postings have been edited from this thread?
 

sferrin

ACCESS: USAP
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Messages
14,017
Reaction score
2,441
Just a WAG but probably because there was an idiot here. Or maybe he got smart and removed them himself.
 

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,983
Reaction score
5,325
Some guy who registered months ago and only ever posted a single question declared he was fed up with Scott (and other people) posting things and wasn't going to visit again. Big loss I am sure...
 

TinWing

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2006
Messages
893
Reaction score
89
Stormbreaker said:
Very curious!

Pardon me for asking, but is there a reason why several postings have been edited from this thread?

I removed the two posts because of the content, which was neither relevant to the thread or appropriate to this forum.
 

Stormbreaker

ACCESS: Restricted
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
32
Reaction score
0
Mmmm,

There certainly seems to have been a few feathers ruffled by recent comments on this thread.

To Quote Overscan:

Some guy who registered months ago and only ever posted a single question declared he was fed up with Scott (and other people) posting things and wasn't going to visit again. Big loss I am sure...


Well, this is actually a bit misleading, because as I recall, the main complaint was that Scott Lowther was exploiting this site for his own financial benefit.

The second complaint concerned the continued posting of material by other members that was largely un-regulated.

I have no axe to grind with Scott Lowther and he can do whatever he likes as far as I'm concerned, but the second point should be of particular concern to those involved with running Secret Projects and we all need to be concerned about using other people's material without permission.

I'd like TinWing to explain why he feels the content of the removed messages was neither relevant to this thread or appropriate to this forum, because he does not seem to be taking this second point at all seriously.
 

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,983
Reaction score
5,325
As to the first complaint, about Scott's posts, he has freely posted a lot of material from his research on the site and greatly enriched the materials available here. If he wants to try an make a living from his research, he is welcome to post "infomercial" type posts as far as I am concerned. No one objects when Tony Buttler passes me info on his forthcoming books to post on the forum.

If people object to anything its easy to let me know - there is a facility to report a post to the admins built into the forum.

As to the second complaint about posting materials without permission, this really goes to the heart of the internet and forums in general. This isn't my full time job. It isn't possible for anyone to police every post, and verify the copyright status of each image. Therefore we have rules regarding "fair use" (restricted scan size etc) and a promise to remove any materials that breach copyright when alerted to such breaches. Indeed, when a publisher had a problem, I tried to deal with it as best I could. There are authors and magazine writers here on the site and I certainly don't want them to be unhappy.

The individual posted a complaint about a user with 500+ interesting and informative posts, without having contributing anything himself, and then threatened not to come back here again. Well, frankly, I don't really feel its a great loss to the forum.

If you wish to have a debate on copyright, try "Website Feedback". If you want a debate on posting "adverts" please start one in "Website Feedback".
 

flateric

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Staff member
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2006
Messages
9,177
Reaction score
1,393
Regarding copyright issues - I would say that for me seeing interesting picture or article crop is always a motivation to buy a paper copy. Say, I never think that scan can be substitute for original paper. So, I hope, it must be for you. But - should be hanged a man posting a tiny article scan from 1965 AvWeek with Boeing's artists rendering - is it violation of (c)? Where the hell can I obtain it even if I desperately want to? Where Pometablava for example can the hell get AVICO-PRESS monograph on VVA-14 published in 1991 with total 500 books issued?
 

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,983
Reaction score
5,325
Actually, I believe there was a copy in "The Aviation Bookshop" in Tunbridge Wells, if anyone wants it ;D
 

Antonio

ACCESS: Top Secret
Staff member
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2006
Messages
3,552
Reaction score
360
Where Pometablava for example can the hell get AVICO-PRESS monograph on VVA-14 published in 1991 with total 500 books issued?

I've got a copy ;). I'm one of that 500 happy owners in the World. I purchased it from Midland Counties Publications in 1992.

But there are lots of items that are out of reach for me.


I agree with posts from Overscan and Flateric.

This is one of the most respectful fora I have found in internet. A place for gentlemen compared with other places I've visited.

We try to be fair with copyright. The forum policy is clear.
We encourage people to buy books and subscribe to magazines giving information and links.
We support writers.
We try to identify sources whenever is possible. (there are few places where you'll see it)

Visiting the forum is free and nobody is forced to sign so those who don't feel confortable just leave and try to find a better place.

Constructive criticism always help to be better but I'm not interested on empty words.

And now for the topic, I think that "Private Project Detective" it's a product for my needs. I love Aerospace History but I can't spend my holidays on the USA researching that topic. If more people is interested, please count on me. That's all.
 

SOC

I look at pictures all day
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2006
Messages
1,206
Reaction score
64
Orionblamblam said:
Basic capitalist economics 101: find a need, fill it with a product. Well, how's this:

A lot of people would love to do research at such-and-such archive (Air and Space Museum, San Diego Aerospace Museum, etc.) but for whatever reason, can't do it. Largely due to the headaches involved with flying cross/intercontinentally.

Well... I want to step up my archival travelling and digging to research topics for my own interest. But now that I am doing this semi-professionally rather than just as a tertiary side hobby, I have much more time for this sort of thing. But it still costs money. So, how's this: if you want to reseach something at Archive X, but you can't go due to schedule conflicts, high international air travel costs, or because you're still locked in federal prison for that unfortunate incident with the whipped cream, the belly dancers and the small neutron bomb... you send me money, I go and do the research for you.

Typically private investigators get some standard rate plus expenses. In this case, "expenses" would include air travel, rental car and motel. But if you want research done at an archive I want to do my *own* research in... the standard rate could be "zero."


Does this sound remotely useful or interesting?

If you could provide an itinerary in advance of your next few visits, I think its a great idea. That'd give people some time to think up "well I might want info on X project from that site". I'd certainly love to take advantage of you in this fashion ;D
 

Orionblamblam

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
8,253
Reaction score
1,921
Website
www.aerospaceprojectsreview.com
SOC said:
If you could provide an itinerary in advance of your next few visits, I think its a great idea.

Well, there's not only providing info on what archive visits *are* coming up, but if someone needs something from Archive XYZ, but can't go themselves, then if they've got the funds, they can pay *me* to go there. Or... they could pay ANYONE ELSE to go there. I would not be the slightest bit surprised to find that there are forum members near any archive that needs raiding. I'm just ready willing and able, and have some experience with such things.

Another idea that occured was a "trip underwriter." Let's say I plan to head off to Jay Miller's archive to root through it for a few days. An underwriter would pay some percentage (my preference: 100) of the planned trip expenses... and would get copies of *everything* I get. To give an idea, the last time I hit the Boeing archives I spent only two days there, but came back with a stack of photocopies 4+ inches thick. Is that worth perhaps $600? Well, it was to me. Might be to someone else.

A specific possibility that occurs: some months back links were posted to the various online finding aids that the National Air and Space Museum has. Well, I went through the aids and foudn dozens of items that I wanted, so I fired off an email to the help desk, saying, as politely as I could, "gimme." The end result was that out of the dozens I wanted, I could only get two, because they simply don't have the time/manpower/resources to dig 'em out for requesters. The suggestion made to me was "come here and get 'em yourself." If people wanted a bunch of things from the finding aids, but haven't been able to get 'em... someone could go there and get 'em.
 

Orionblamblam

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
8,253
Reaction score
1,921
Website
www.aerospaceprojectsreview.com
Private Project Detective: first mission

Fairly soon I'll be venturing cross-continent to visit a private aerospace archive. Current plans are to spend a *week* digging through the archive, and I'm to understand that that will provide only enough time to just barely start scratching the surface. This promises to produce a bucketload of return, but the trip itself will be expensive. I am consequently looking for what you might call "investors" or "underwriters." It'll be expensive, but they will get copies of *everything* I dig up... photocopies, scans, photos.

If you are interested, PM me.
 

Similar threads

Top