Covid-19 Vaccine - Where, How & Costs

[Flyaway]

How the Johnson & Johnson pause could move the needle on vaccine fears

Transparency is important.

www.theverge.com

 

[edwest4]

I am quite tired of the editorial commentary when providing news to the public, like "vaccine fears." Who decided that? And based on what? It appears the goal was to create drama as opposed to inform. It should have included a message to talk your doctor and left it at that. Having worked at hospital, I am aware that patients want factual information that comes from a health-care provider, and not from some 'fear' piece on some website.

Transparency? Yes, from experts in the field. Not from some anxiety causing article.

 

[Flyaway]

I can’t post the link as it’s behind a paywall on Newsweek but a COVID-19 deniers event in Norway has left the host dead from the virus and a further 12 infected.

 

[TomcatViP]

EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry - paper

The EU Commission has decided not to renew COVID-19 vaccine contracts next year with AstraZeneca and Johnson & Johnson (J&J), Italian daily La Stampa reported on Wednesday, citing a source from the Italian health ministry.

www.reuters.com

Let's be clear, the one only vaccine that would be the most available for Europeans, a continent awfully late in his vaccination campaign, is now swept out in order to safeguard Europeans against a 1 in a million risk of side effect?

Mediator killed 2000 for 5 million users, a 400 per million ratio.

Astra-Zenaca is hence 400 time less lethal than a drug that was dully approved and on sale for years while at the center of a major scandal but get canceled despite having positive effects in over 90% of case.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...over-medical-scandal-in-which-up-to-2000-died

 

[starviking]

EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry - paper

The EU Commission has decided not to renew COVID-19 vaccine contracts next year with AstraZeneca and Johnson & Johnson (J&J), Italian daily La Stampa reported on Wednesday, citing a source from the Italian health ministry.

www.reuters.com

Let's be clear, the one only vaccine that would be the most available for Europeans, a continent awfully late in his vaccination campaign, is now swept out in order to safeguard Europeans against a 1 in a million risk of side effect?

Mediator killed 2000 for 5 million users, a 400 per million ratio.

Astra-Zenaca is hence 400 time less lethal than a drug that was dully approved and on sale for years while at the center of a major scandal but get canceled despite having positive effects in over 90% of case.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...over-medical-scandal-in-which-up-to-2000-died

This is a mixture of anti-British sentiment by the commission, a desire to reward the major EU-produced vaccine (Pfizer), and a hope thatby convincing people that viral vector vaccines are dangerous will allow them to dodge their earlier major mistakes.

Absolutely disgraceful.

 

[sferrin]

I am quite tired of the editorial commentary when providing news to the public, like "vaccine fears." Who decided that? And based on what? It appears the goal was to create drama as opposed to inform. It should have included a message to talk your doctor and left it at that. Having worked at hospital, I am aware that patients want factual information that comes from a health-care provider, and not from some 'fear' piece on some website.

Transparency? Yes, from experts in the field. Not from some anxiety causing article.

It makes it almost impossible to sift useful information from the tsunami of click-bait.

 

[sferrin]

EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry - paper

The EU Commission has decided not to renew COVID-19 vaccine contracts next year with AstraZeneca and Johnson & Johnson (J&J), Italian daily La Stampa reported on Wednesday, citing a source from the Italian health ministry.

www.reuters.com

Let's be clear, the one only vaccine that would be the most available for Europeans, a continent awfully late in his vaccination campaign, is now swept out in order to safeguard Europeans against a 1 in a million risk of side effect?

Mediator killed 2000 for 5 million users, a 400 per million ratio.

Astra-Zenaca is hence 400 time less lethal than a drug that was dully approved and on sale for years while at the center of a major scandal but get canceled despite having positive effects in over 90% of case.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...over-medical-scandal-in-which-up-to-2000-died

This is a mixture of anti-British sentiment by the commission, a desire to reward the major EU-produced vaccine (Pfizer), and a hope thatby convincing people that viral vector vaccines are dangerous will allow them to dodge their earlier major mistakes.

Absolutely disgraceful.

They should operate out of the US. Apparently big-pharma has been given immunity for any f--k-ups on their part.

 

[Trident]

You mean it's anti-British sentiment which is driving them to weed out a vaccine developed in Belgium and manufactured in the Netherlands (I'm talking about J&J here, in case you were wondering...)? I doubt it- it's tempting to frame this in terms of a Brexit spat (something the British press and government certainly indulge in), but the explanation does not seem to stand up to scrutiny. Not only does it not compute, it's also decidedly unhelpful. Even in the case of AZ, we need to stop equating an objectively underperforming supplier with the UK as a country (again - no problem with the negotiating tactics of the latter, only with the brazen rhetoric which followed).

You cannot ignore the continued inability of AZ to deliver the contracted volumes, and age-specific health concerns which are legitimate (though perhaps not grave enough to warrant rejection). As I've pointed out earlier in this thread, while AZ *should* have been the mainstay of the EU vaccination campaign, its repeated production failures have thrust BioNTech/Pfizer into that role in practice (by quite a margin!). And, without any subjective bias at all, it is delivering - in fact rising to the challenge by exceeding what it promised: recently, it pledged to bring forward 50M (!) doses into the 2nd quarter. All the while AZ will be still be more than 50% (>100M) short.

Combine this with age-related clot concerns, once you've decided (rightly or wrongly) to restrict AZ and J&J to over-60s, how many unvaccinated people will be left eligible to receive these jabs come the 3rd quarter? The fact that AZ is unable to get its EU supply chain sorted out in time to participate while the market still exists is on it, and it only. By failing egregiously to honour its contract, it has put itself into the position of being a minor, almost dispensable player instead of the backbone of the effort. Now the consequences of entirely normal market mechanisms are catching up to it - no anti-British sentiment required to explain that.

 

[Zoo Tycoon]

Common sense is being over ruled by an irrational mass panic which in turn is denying people’s rights to life.

Please also consider that critical susceptibility to vaccination complications is most likely genetic. Tragically the same tiny percentage of young people who exhibit this are most likely the same equally tiny percentage of no pre existing medical conditions young people that will succumb to Covid.

When millions are dying, halting a exit plan for the sake of tiny minority that would probably die anyway is beyond nonsense.

The panic is created by elements in the media (who knows what their motive is) and exploit by selfish politicians.

 

[chimeric oncogene]

Most of the squawking I recall was because HQC was "too risky" and had "too many side effects". "We don't know the long-term effects" etc. And yes, there were studies showing it worked too.

My understanding is that the bigger studies eventually found out it didn't work.

Moderna Covid vaccine efficacy falls slightly to 90% in US trial

US biotech company Moderna announced Covid vaccine is 90 percent effective against all forms of the disease and 95 percent effective against severe disease.

news.yahoo.com

It's close enough to 100% to be astonishingly good. It's waaay better than your regular flu shot, and the performance was mind blowing.

The Chinese vaccines are honestly closer to what we usually expect from new flu vaccine type dealios. The Chinese were extremely conservative with the whole enterprise, and it shows.

I'm not too strongly opposed to the downselect myself; it's why they funded four different vaccines to completion in the first place. There was always a risk one or two wouldn't work very well, like Plutonium and Oralloy bombs, or implosion and gun type devices.

Limit the adenoviral vaccines to countries with a COVID infection rate of X and set an age limit and be done with it. That's why everyone bought extra vaccines. Typical numbers purchased were like twice total population. Use the AZs and JJs on high risk groups, and give everyone else mRNAs.

 

[Flyaway]

EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry - paper

The EU Commission has decided not to renew COVID-19 vaccine contracts next year with AstraZeneca and Johnson & Johnson (J&J), Italian daily La Stampa reported on Wednesday, citing a source from the Italian health ministry.

www.reuters.com

Let's be clear, the one only vaccine that would be the most available for Europeans, a continent awfully late in his vaccination campaign, is now swept out in order to safeguard Europeans against a 1 in a million risk of side effect?

Mediator killed 2000 for 5 million users, a 400 per million ratio.

Astra-Zenaca is hence 400 time less lethal than a drug that was dully approved and on sale for years while at the center of a major scandal but get canceled despite having positive effects in over 90% of case.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...over-medical-scandal-in-which-up-to-2000-died

This is a mixture of anti-British sentiment by the commission, a desire to reward the major EU-produced vaccine (Pfizer), and a hope thatby convincing people that viral vector vaccines are dangerous will allow them to dodge their earlier major mistakes.

Absolutely disgraceful.

What I don’t understand is AZ has proved seemingly more effective against the SA variant hence why that country is using it. That variant is now appearing in Europe so this decision seems even more illogical.

 

[Flyaway]

Another terribly consequence of the pandemic running riot in Brazil.

Why are so many babies dying of Covid-19 in Brazil? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-56696907

 

[PMN1]

'Mix and match' UK Covid vaccine trial expanded https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-56730526

Study shows that 1.35 million people in the U.K. have failed to take up the offer of being vaccinated so 19 in 20 have take up the offer. Those who have not taken up the offer it appears to be more likely suffering from lack of access to the vaccination program than being people refusing to have it.

COVID-19: More than 1.3 million people in England haven't yet taken up coronavirus vaccine offer, analysis suggests

Health officials have stressed that the offer of a vaccination is "evergreen" and does not expire.

news.sky.com

I have heard of two problems here in Wales with not taking up the offer, both of which were explained by an IT issue or incorrect contact details.

 

[Trident]

What I don’t understand is AZ has proved seemingly more effective against the SA variant hence why that country is using it. That variant is now appearing in Europe so this decision seems even more illogical.

I thought it was the other way round - didn't SA stop using AZ a few weeks back?

 

[Flyaway]

What I don’t understand is AZ has proved seemingly more effective against the SA variant hence why that country is using it. That variant is now appearing in Europe so this decision seems even more illogical.

I thought it was the other way round - didn't SA stop using AZ a few weeks back?

I am paraphrasing from a BBC news article I read yesterday.

 

[Flyaway]

Weekend curfew in Indian capital as hospitals see ‘chaotic’ surge

India reports 200,739 cases over last 24 hours as Delhi government announces weekend lockdowns in national capital.

www.aljazeera.com

 

[Flyaway]

A Different Theory of COVID-19’s Origin

A previously fringe suggestion is getting more mainstream consideration.

slate.com

 

[Trident]

I am paraphrasing from a BBC news article I read yesterday.

A cursory Google search turns up plenty of references to SA stopping rollout and later selling its stockpile of AZ. Apparently the decision was in response to this study: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2102214

I fear they may have acted rashly there, while the results look disappointing, I can see a couple of potential weaknesses with the study:

- it was relatively small, at only 2000 participants
- participants tended to be very young (median age 30), which I understand means there were only mild cases in both vaccine and placebo groups, so no judgement on efficacy against severe cases can be made on this basis

Still, not a good look when the corresponding Moderna & BioNTech/Pfizer studies reportedly found only a slight reduction in efficacy (which was already higher than AZ to begin with).

 

[chimeric oncogene]

AAAS

blogs.sciencemag.org

Some basics on the whole business.

Again, this kind of unexpected side effect was anticipated. It was a known unknown; it's why the Manhattan Project worked on two bombs, and why they rolled out four types of vaccines. A partial downselect is entirely reasonable. Save them for older age groups and high-risk nations with active outbreaks.

 

[Grey Havoc]

Europe passes one million Covid deaths

There have now been one million coronavirus deaths in Europe, the World Health Organisation has said.

www.telegraph.co.uk

 

[edwest4]

Comparing the US news media to gathering intelligence in the field by professionals and it is clear that there is an agenda. "This is what we want you to see, this is what you should be concerned about and these are the important - according to us - issues." In the specific case of vaccine and virus reporting, the level of fear creation, as opposed to balanced journalism, has been appalling. Shocking headlines followed by a less than shocking article erodes public confidence. Pointing the finger at politicians does not amount to presenting good, useful information for the average person.

As far as Europe, I am sure the average person is not privy to what goes on behind the scenes or contractual obligations.

 

[Flyaway]

Maybe I am off base here but I suspect a lot of people already guessed this would be the case going forwards.

Pfizer CEO reveals vaccinated individuals will ‘likely’ need a booster shot in 12 months

CEO Albert Bourla says the vaccine could also become an annual requirement

www.google.co.uk

 

[sferrin]

Maybe I am off base here but I suspect a lot of people already guessed this would be the case going forwards.

Pfizer CEO reveals vaccinated individuals will ‘likely’ need a booster shot in 12 months

CEO Albert Bourla says the vaccine could also become an annual requirement

www.google.co.uk

Why would they want to end the gravy train?

 

[edwest4]

Since there is a new flu shot every year then this will become the new yearly shot going forward. However, development of a nasal spray vaccine is ongoing so the shot may be replaced with a nose spray.

 

[Flyaway]

Maybe I am off base here but I suspect a lot of people already guessed this would be the case going forwards.

Pfizer CEO reveals vaccinated individuals will ‘likely’ need a booster shot in 12 months

CEO Albert Bourla says the vaccine could also become an annual requirement

www.google.co.uk

Why would they want to end the gravy train?

What an cynical way of looking at the hard fact of reality.

 

[Archibald]

The situation in Brazil is a complete disaster. I wish somebody could punch Bolsonaro in the testicles, hard enough to break him definitively. Geez that SON OF A BITCH is not only murdering his own people, he is also reponsible for the P1 to P4 variants playing havoc even with the vaccines.

I WANT to see that rotten bastard trialed at The Hague for crime against mankind.

To think his second name is Messiah. I'm going to vomit.

Roast in Hell, you brainless scum !

 

[Archibald]

How can a human being being criminally stupid to the point of his own military staff resigning in anger - because he had ordered them to break lockdowns organized at states level ?

Even Trump never pushed the dumbarsery THAT far. Which says something !!

Imagine Trump sending the Military breaking a state lockdown "because COVID doesn't exists" or "it is just flu with a different name".

Geez... to think Bolsonaro got COVID yet it was the virus that dropped dead. Speaks volume about that animal toxicity !

 

[sferrin]

Maybe I am off base here but I suspect a lot of people already guessed this would be the case going forwards.

Pfizer CEO reveals vaccinated individuals will ‘likely’ need a booster shot in 12 months

CEO Albert Bourla says the vaccine could also become an annual requirement

www.google.co.uk

Why would they want to end the gravy train?

What an cynical way of looking at the hard fact of reality.

The hard fact of reality is they make more money from treatments than cures.

"Pfizer dropping expansion packs for their vaccine like it's a video game"

 

[Flyaway]

The usual caveats apply with this data etc. Don’t forget this is only short term data, the test doesn’t come now but over time.

99.992% of fully vaccinated people have dodged COVID, CDC data shows

No vaccine is 100% effective. But the COVID vaccines seem pretty darn good.

arstechnica.com

By India doing this it says in the article that this could spell disaster for the COVAX scheme, and make for a bad times in some 60 countries relying on the scheme many in Africa.

Analysis: India shifts from mass vaccine exporter to importer, worrying the world

After gifting and selling tens of millions of COVID-19 vaccine doses abroad, India suddenly finds itself short of shots as new infections surge in the world's second-most populous country.

www.reuters.com

 

[Flyaway]

Maybe I am off base here but I suspect a lot of people already guessed this would be the case going forwards.

Pfizer CEO reveals vaccinated individuals will ‘likely’ need a booster shot in 12 months

CEO Albert Bourla says the vaccine could also become an annual requirement

www.google.co.uk

Why would they want to end the gravy train?

What an cynical way of looking at the hard fact of reality.

The hard fact of reality is they make more money from treatments than cures.

"Pfizer dropping expansion packs for their vaccine like it's a video game"

All immunity wanes over time and the virus isn’t going anywhere.

 

[starviking]

You mean it's anti-British sentiment which is driving them to weed out a vaccine developed in Belgium and manufactured in the Netherlands (I'm talking about J&J here, in case you were wondering...)? I doubt it- it's tempting to frame this in terms of a Brexit spat (something the British press and government certainly indulge in), but the explanation does not seem to stand up to scrutiny. Not only does it not compute, it's also decidedly unhelpful. Even in the case of AZ, we need to stop equating an objectively underperforming supplier with the UK as a country (again - no problem with the negotiating tactics of the latter, only with the brazen rhetoric which followed).

I think J&J is acceptable collateral damage for the Commission. This is, after all, an organisation that flippantly rocked the Irish Peace Process with threats of Irish border controls on vaccines - then hyperventillated on secret AZ Vaccine caches, e.g the 'secret cache' in Italy that the Commission had Italian Customs raid.

Big news, bad, bad AZ... then when it's discovered the 'secret cache' are for the EU and COVAX, let's not report that widely at all... almost as if the story was quashed.

Then AZ's brain clots story breaks, and suddenly Covid is not that an important thing to fight - AZ is.

I think anti-British sentiment is certainly a factor.

 

[shedofdread]

Hardly "news" but had an AZ jab yesterday. Felt a bit stiff in the afternoon, quite feverish in the evening (dealt with effectively by paracetamol as per 'Green Book' - https://assets.publishing.service.g...978187/Greenbook_chapter_14a_v7_12Feb2021.pdf) and now just feel a little tired but no more than the after effects of a Good Night Out
The real reason for the post is to praise the efficiency of the Primary Care Network run vaccination centre. A more well drilled operation would be hard to find.

 

[Flyaway]

The ethics of living long term with COVID-19. Balancing freedoms and how many deaths as a society we are willing to accept. But it’s even more complicated than that. I have to say I think this article is based on a bit of a false premise in that it was never going to be possible to eliminate the virus, so putting forward the idea that having it as an endemic in the U.K. was a deliberate choice by TPTB is a bit unfair in my view as you cannot expect the whole country to live as a high security prison for possibly years in an effort to eliminate it which would probably fail anyway. This applies to numerous other countries like the US etc.

Learning to live with COVID – the tough choices ahead

As a society, we have to choose between liberty, equality and mortality. We can’t have all three.

theconversation.com

 

[Flyaway]

COVID-19: Indian double mutation variant arrives in Britain and has 'hallmarks of very dangerous virus'

As yet, it is unknown what impact the two mutations would have on the effectiveness of existing vaccines.

news.sky.com

 

[Trident]

I think J&J is acceptable collateral damage for the Commission.

So the FDA across the pond doing the same thing is also indicative of anti-British inclinations? It just doesn't add up - Occam's Razor and so on.

This is, after all, an organisation that flippantly rocked the Irish Peace Process with threats of Irish border controls on vaccines - then hyperventillated on secret AZ Vaccine caches, e.g the 'secret cache' in Italy that the Commission had Italian Customs raid.

Not going to defend the Commission's rhetoric, which also leaves a lot to be desired, for sure. In practice there have been neither export bans nor border controls though, so in terms of actions (if not words) things still seem to be moving along a sensible trajectory.

Big news, bad, bad AZ... then when it's discovered the 'secret cache' are for the EU and COVAX, let's not report that widely at all... almost as if the story was quashed.

Well, AZ *is* grievously short on its delivery targets for a product shortfalls of which can be counted in lives lost. I think it is perfectly valid for the EU to meet any suspicion of foul play with a robust response to clarify the situation, which is what that raid was at face value. You can't blame authorities for taking an intense interest in the workings of AZ's supply chain, given the continued inability to meet obligations - why did AZ not come forward with the relevant info? Isn't the fact that it took a raid to discover the truth the root cause of the problem?

As for the press coverage, I don't know which media you read, but the sources I watch reported the findings of the raid promptly and with suitable prominence - credit where it's due.

 

[edwest4]

This is a wartime situation. The virus has no concern for personal freedoms. And how do viruses spread? So, let's live without checkpoints in the US and I still see license plates from various states entering my state. Test and trace? How? When? These people get out of their cars and go wherever they want. And if they infect one or 30 people, how will anyone know? They will just get back in their cars and drive off.

Aside from vaccines, 'antibody treatments' for those with mild to moderate sympotms are being released. Similar work for more effective defense is ongoing. Scientists have families and friends. This is a concern for them as well.

And the variants "arriving" in Britain. By plane or boat?

 

[edwest4]

From the CBC:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/moderna-delay-1.5990166

 

[sferrin]

The ethics of living long term with COVID-19. Balancing freedoms and how many deaths as a society we are willing to accept. [/URL]

Like cars, swimming pools, airplanes, cigarettes, junk food, etc.

 

[sferrin]

This is a wartime situation. The virus has no concern for personal freedoms. And how do viruses spread? So, let's live without checkpoints in the US and I still see license plates from various states entering my state. Test and trace? How? When? These people get out of their cars and go wherever they want. And if they infect one or 30 people, how will anyone know? They will just get back in their cars and drive off.

Maybe you should just seal yourself up in a plastic bubble at home and call it good (and wear 2 masks). The rest of us have lives to live.

 

[edwest4]

An unexamined reply. This is a situation involving certain scientific facts. Unlike bombs falling on the UK during World War II, this situation can only be ignored at personal risk. Something I would never recommend.