• Hi Guest! Forum rules have been updated. All users please read here.

Copenhagen suborbitals - minimalist manned space rocket

FutureSpaceTourist

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Joined
Mar 11, 2010
Messages
589
Reaction score
0
Copenhagen Suboribtals (http://www.copenhagensuborbitals.com/) is an amateur effort to build a hybrid rocket and capsule just powerful enough to carry one person above 100km. It is funded through donations and sponsorship.

Mission statement from the website:

This is a non-profit suborbital space endeavor, based entirely on sponsors and volunteers.
Our mission is to launch a human being into space.

We are working fulltime to develop a series of suborbital space vehicles - designed to pave the way for manned space flight on a micro size spacecraft.

Two rocket vehicles are under development. A small unmanned sounding rocket, named Hybrid Atmospheric Test Vehicle or HATV and a larger booster rocket named Hybrid Exo Atmospheric Transporter or HEAT, designed to carry a micro spacecraft into a suborbital trajectory in space.

The mission has a 100% peacefull purpose and is not in any way involved in carrying explosive, nuclear, biological and chemical payloads.

We intend to share all our techninal information as much as possible, within the laws of EU-export control.
Programme has been getting a fair amount of press in the last week or so as they're about to do a first test launch of their booster (to about 30km). For example, see New Scientist 'human cannonball' article.

Some pictures from their website attached.
 

Attachments

Orionblamblam

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
7,317
Reaction score
182
Website
www.aerospaceprojectsreview.com
This is a non-profit suborbital space endeavor, based entirely on sponsors and volunteers.
Our mission is to launch a human being into space.
...
The mission has a 100% peacefull purpose and is not in any way involved in carrying explosive, nuclear, biological and chemical payloads.

So... they're only going to launch non-biological humans?
 

XP67_Moonbat

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Joined
Jan 16, 2008
Messages
2,154
Reaction score
10
Vaguely reminds me of The Volksrocket that Bob Truax built back in the 70's.
 

Matej

Multiuniversal creator
Joined
Feb 13, 2006
Messages
2,617
Reaction score
32
Website
www.hitechweb.genezis.eu
Orionblamblam said:
Peaceful, my eye... clearly, this is a Danish attempt at replicating the Redstone Transport Missile. Soon the Danes will be rocketing invasion forces into Sweden!
They dont need to. ...now :) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%98resund_Bridge
 

Michel Van

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
4,194
Reaction score
68
Matej said:
What about the crew resecue system? Is it that tiny toothpick on the top?
nope, look more like aerospike like on UGM-133 Trident II
i hope the spacecraft has a crew rescue system, I din't find any info about that, on there Homepage)
 

Orionblamblam

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
7,317
Reaction score
182
Website
www.aerospaceprojectsreview.com
Matej said:
Orionblamblam said:
Peaceful, my eye... clearly, this is a Danish attempt at replicating the Redstone Transport Missile. Soon the Danes will be rocketing invasion forces into Sweden!
They dont need to. ...now :) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%98resund_Bridge
Bah. The Danes are going to eventually have to blow up the bridge to prevent the brain-eating zombies from Malmo from crossing over.

Of course, if they *don't* blow up the bridge in time, the Danes might need to rockets to eject themselves out of Denmark... Hmmm....
 

FutureSpaceTourist

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Joined
Mar 11, 2010
Messages
589
Reaction score
0
Michel Van said:
i hope the spacecraft has a crew rescue system
I don't think it does, at least if you mean a launch escape system to quickly separate the capsule from the booster in an emergency. I guess they're limited to just separating the capsule and hoping they'll have enough altitude to use the parachutes.

Personally I think it's debatable how much such escape systems really improve safety. IIRC there's only ever been one occassion when such a system has been used (the failed Russian Soyuz T-10 launch).
 

FutureSpaceTourist

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Joined
Mar 11, 2010
Messages
589
Reaction score
0
The latest pre-test launch article at space.com (http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/private-danish-rocket-dummy-suborbital-space-100827.html) contains various details about the rocket and programme, including:

"We get three Gs half-sitting, half-standing," said Peter Madsen, cofounder of Copenahgen Suborbitals. "Higher G loads may occur during re-entry, but here the capsule is oriented in a sidewards position where the astronaut has excellent G tolerance."

[...]

Liquid oxygen serves as the oxidizer part of the propellant, and polyurethane acts as the rocket fuel propellant. That allows the HEAT-1X booster to burn for 60 seconds and create almost 9,000 pounds of thrust (40 kN).

[...]

An aerospike on top of the plexiglass should hopefully blunt the full shock and thermal effects acting on the dome, the designers said. The capsule also has an iron plate shell with a cork lining to serve as the heat shield.
 

Matej

Multiuniversal creator
Joined
Feb 13, 2006
Messages
2,617
Reaction score
32
Website
www.hitechweb.genezis.eu
FutureSpaceTourist said:
Personally I think it's debatable how much such escape systems really improve safety. IIRC there's only ever been one occasion when such a system has been used (the failed Russian Soyuz T-10 launch).
The main idea always was to separate enough the cockpit or the cosmonaut/astronaut himself from the rocket. For example early Vostok and Gemini had ejection seats, but imagine to use them when a few meters under you is a really big fire bobble that has 1500 degrees Celsia. Also space shuttle Columbia had during its first flights ejection seats, but once again imagine to use it when in a split of second the shuttle with the engines on the full power passes nearby. Okay, launch escape system has a big disadvantage that it can be used only during the launch and is not available during the reentry and landing, but the crew has at least something. The Soyuz T-10 is the example that it works. I cant remember any other situation when the LRS was used and failed.

Back to Copenhagen suborbitals - I generally don't like their idea. Its like to strip a car from everything (seat belts, airbags, reinforcers) and than make a 300 km/h rally. Even the craziest race drivers don't do that.
 

Lauge

CLEARANCE: Secret
Joined
Jan 30, 2008
Messages
437
Reaction score
0
Orionblamblam said:
Peaceful, my eye... clearly, this is a Danish attempt at replicating the Redstone Transport Missile. Soon the Danes will be rocketing invasion forces into Sweden!
Damn......he's on to us :-X

Regards & all,

Thomas L. Nielsen
Luxembourg (Danish citizen)
 

SAustin16

Bravo to All Brave Test Pilots
Joined
Jan 13, 2008
Messages
128
Reaction score
0
Apart from the extreme danger of the rocket below, the clear dome caving in, and the parachutes failing (I envision a big lawn dart), I think it would be a REALLY fun way to travel into space. Of course with my luck, the G's would pull my head down below the dome so I wouldn't see anything except for the ground coming up when the chutes failed...Woo Hoo. Talk about your "E-Ticket Ride" (in Disney-speak).
 

FutureSpaceTourist

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Joined
Mar 11, 2010
Messages
589
Reaction score
0
SAustin16 said:
I wouldn't see anything except for the ground coming up when the chutes failed...Woo Hoo.
Look on the bright side, the capsule makes a pretty good padded coffin :)
 

FutureSpaceTourist

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Joined
Mar 11, 2010
Messages
589
Reaction score
0
A stuck LOX valve meant no launch today http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-11178034, no news yet on when the next attempt might be (although they have use of the launch range until 17th September).

A quote on future plans from the BBC article:

"We're not going to change the dummy for a real person until we've seen the rocket fly to the final height, the final apogee; and many times so we can feel secure about riding it ourselves," said Kristian von Bengtson from the Copenhagen Suborbitals group.

"That may take more than three years; it may take less than 10 years - it's difficult to say because we're not trying to kill ourselves here; we're just having fun. We'll do it when we're ready to do it."
 

FutureSpaceTourist

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Joined
Mar 11, 2010
Messages
589
Reaction score
0
The next launch attempt will now be June 2011. The LOX valve problem this week is easily fixed but other problems with the launch platform etc means that they've decided not to rush another attempt.

[quote author=http://www.cphpost.dk/news/scitech/92-technology/49905-rocket-dreams-fail-to-ignite.html]
Rocket builders Peter Madsen and Kristian von Bengtson confirmed last night at a press conference that it was their by now infamous hairdryer that resulted in the rocket not achieving lift-off. The pair, along with a team of volunteers, had kept the country in suspense all weekend as they sailed the rocket off the coast of Bornholm using their self-built submarine.

The hairdryer, one which they bought in Føtex for under 100 kroner, was supposed to have kept a valve for the liquid oxygen hot, so that it did not freeze and become stuck. However, due to some necessary last minute alternations, the power to the hairdryer was cut off, Madsen stated last night.
[/quote]

From this ing.dk article (using google translate) it appears that power to the hair dryer was cut longer than planned due to time taken to clear the launch pad.

A couple of launch pictures from http://ing.dk/artikel/111700-se-billeder-fra-raket-fuser-i-stersoeen#0 attached.
 

Attachments

surfinblackbird

CLEARANCE: Restricted
Joined
Jan 27, 2011
Messages
15
Reaction score
0
Wow. Sign me up for a trip! Even the risk of exploding in a ball of flaming LOX, or anything else, is worth it for me.
 

SAustin16

Bravo to All Brave Test Pilots
Joined
Jan 13, 2008
Messages
128
Reaction score
0
I certainly hope that they are successful, and their design proves worthy. This is a very fun project to watch evolve.
 

surfinblackbird

CLEARANCE: Restricted
Joined
Jan 27, 2011
Messages
15
Reaction score
0
The whole thing looks well designed and serious. I think it can do what it advertises, even if i laughed at the re-entry shield made of Cork. I know it works for the ~200c it will experience in re-entry. Aaah, i wish i had the money. Only thing i wouldn't trust is a sea recovery...
 

Orionblamblam

CLEARANCE: Above Top Secret
Top Contributor
Senior Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
7,317
Reaction score
182
Website
www.aerospaceprojectsreview.com
surfinblackbird said:
i laughed at the re-entry shield made of Cork. I know it works for the ~200c it will experience in re-entry.
Cork, if bonded on adequately, can make a marvelous heat shield even for orbital re-entry (would need to be kinda thick, though).
 

surfinblackbird

CLEARANCE: Restricted
Joined
Jan 27, 2011
Messages
15
Reaction score
0
Now i would like to see the bottle of champagne to go with a Cork as big as that ;D
They are supposed to launch any time now!
http://bambuser.com/node/1788939
One Hour ago they where preparing the Sputnik barge before sailing off. God be with them!

And the more i look at the thing, the more i find it looks like a TOW missile

 

Michel Van

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
4,194
Reaction score
68
they had Liftoff! at 16.32 local time
The rocket soared about 2 miles into the air

http://ing.dk/artikel/119777-raketten-floej-styrtede-og-samlede-vaerdifuld-data-ind
 

Attachments

blackstar

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
1,682
Reaction score
12
I wonder what some of the more serious companies, like Virgin Galactic and XCor, think of these kinds of projects. This thing looks like it's going to kill somebody. Is that any good for the other companies that are trying to do this? I suspect that they worry that it will bring a regulatory hammer down on them.
 

trekkist

CLEARANCE: Restricted
Joined
Aug 27, 2009
Messages
23
Reaction score
0
How many gees can one take in that position and remain conscious? How many will the passenger experience? Be a helluva note you paid and rode and came back OK but saw nothing due to acceleration blackout.
 

mz

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Joined
May 28, 2007
Messages
683
Reaction score
1
blackstar said:
I wonder what some of the more serious companies, like Virgin Galactic and XCor, think of these kinds of projects. This thing looks like it's going to kill somebody. Is that any good for the other companies that are trying to do this? I suspect that they worry that it will bring a regulatory hammer down on them.
When I followed ARocket a couple of years ago, these Danes were seen as a little adventurous by the folks there. I remember the first thing noted back then of their hybrid with a person in it was that with no active guidance you'll probably get shallow trajectories.

I guess it's nice that some people do things while others think more and don't achieve that much. It's not as if some governments' projects were technically very sound either.
 

blackstar

CLEARANCE: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
1,682
Reaction score
12
mz said:
I guess it's nice that some people do things while others think more and don't achieve that much. It's not as if some governments' projects were technically very sound either.
We can revisit this subject after their first success. Or otherwise...
 

Grey Havoc

The path not taken.
Senior Member
Joined
Oct 9, 2009
Messages
8,970
Reaction score
174
With regards as to wood/cork being used in spacecraft:
 
Top