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Breda Tebaldi-Zari

theponja

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Seems time to review Italian projects :)

About the Tebaldi-Zari:

"An engineer named Tebaldi designed the Tebaldi-Zari, which was a was a single-seat wooden sesquiplane with heavily staggered wings and a 142 kW (190 hp) Isotta-Fraschini water-cooled V6 engine driving a two-bladed tractor propeller. Its fixed, tail skid landing gear was of very unusual configuration; the main gear was of very wide track and had oversized main wheels with their axle incorporated into the lower wing. "
from wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tebaldi-Zari

I wonder why they designed the landing gear on that way. I've found just a couple of pictures online. Anyone has more information? a 3d view ?

Regards
Luis
 

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Grey Havoc

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It almost looks like it was intended for use from very rough airstrips. Perhaps the designers were originally aiming at some Italian requirement in the 1918/19 timeframe for a aircraft that could operate under colonial conditions? Just a guess.
 

frank

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I'm thinking drag reduction. It looks very sleek with the upper wing mounted so closely on top of the fuselage. Maybe some structural advantage to using the wheels' axle as the lower wing spar as well.
 

taildragger

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frank said:
I'm thinking drag reduction. It looks very sleek with the upper wing mounted so closely on top of the fuselage. Maybe some structural advantage to using the wheels' axle as the lower wing spar as well.
I'm sure drag was lower, but unless the wheel was internally sprung (doubtful given the date) the arrangement seems like a great way to damage the wing structure on the high quality airfield surfaces of the day.
 

theponja

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Retrofit and Lucamax thanks a lot for the pictures.

It's very interesting in the the 3d view for the Hispano Suiza engine shows some king of wheels cover but the pictures just shows the wheels in the same way than the first version.

Taildragger I agree with you: Why compromise the wing structure with the integrated wheels? So I keep wondering what they tough to design the undercarriage on that way.
 

lucamax

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Hi, sorry for the late post, but I didn't have enough time in theese days to read and make a search about the aircraft. However... The airplane was built in 1922 for a request for a new day-fighter single seater. In the official documents, the new plane should have an engine of at almost 300 hp, an orizontal speed at least of 255 km/h, a minimal speed of 110 km/h, a range of 3 hours and a strenght coefficient of 12. The Tebladi-Zari didn't reach the strenght requests, but a prototype was built by Breda, who reproposed the aircraft with a Hispano-Suiza HS.42, in the projects was proposed an Isotta Fraschini V6. Also the prototype was not accepted and the aircraft was lost.
 

Potawatomi13

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;D I'm a little surprised no one else thought of this.
To my sense of logic they eliminated the landing gear legs and bracing wires/struts along with all of its weight and aerodynamic drag by simply using large diameter narrow wheels. These larger wheels handled rough fields much better than smaller wheels most planes this size used. Also doing this lowered the front of the plane significantly giving the pilot a somewhat better view while grounded as he had to look over the wing.
Bill Kohler
 

Jan den Das

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It was first Tebaldi-Zari (Zari factory)
Later it was gone to Breda and it became Breda-Tebaldi, there they build a new version with smaller fuselage B-T
 

Jan den Das

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lucamax can you explain why I found that the airforce requested a fighter with a HS42 engine and you mention a isotta?
The first 2 fiats were powered with Hispano. Piaggio P2 HS, SIAI S.52 was to late for the contest but would be powered by a HS.
So ?????
The problem with the Tebaldi designs is that there were 2 versions and Tebaldi was working for Isotta so he would known which engined would be used!
 

riggerrob

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Looks like they wanted to improve the pilot's view forward and upwards, so mounted the cockpit rim in line with the top wing. Given the correct vertical spacing to the lower wing put the lower wing spar very close to the wheel axle, so they combined the two parts to simplify construction.
 

Jjr

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Some corrections, during the construction onf the Tebaldi-Zari there were part of wheel covers placed who later were removed.
The drawing from Aerofan was the Tebaldi-Zari so it has flown, but the engine was a Isotta Fraschini.
From the three drawings showed was the drawing on the right the Breda BT version, with a 300 Hispano-Suiza engine, as requested by the Airforce.
The drawing on the left was just a study/project, not build.
What is mentioned concerning the engines is incorrect.

Are there pictures taken during the 1923 fighter contest, which showed on the background parts of other aeroplanes?
Maybe it will showed a part of the Breda BT of which is mentioned there are no pictures.
I hope to find such a picture, because the drawing op the Breda BT is not complete (my opinion)
 

lucamax

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lucamax can you explain why I found that the airforce requested a fighter with a HS42 engine and you mention a isotta?
The first 2 fiats were powered with Hispano. Piaggio P2 HS, SIAI S.52 was to late for the contest but would be powered by a HS.
So ?????
The problem with the Tebaldi designs is that there were 2 versions and Tebaldi was working for Isotta so he would known which engined would be used!
Dear,
I don't know: I've just reported the article information!
I'll check better! ;)
Best regards.
 
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