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Bf 110B less kown modification

AF

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Hello

I found theese photos of Bf 110B modification. Info from text - engines Jumo 210Ga, bombholders in center of gravity. This plane have emblem of school for instructors (Fluglehreshule) in Brandemburg-Briest. Nothing known about destignation. It could be mashine used for development of Me 210 or conversion for train pilots from Bf 110 to Me 210.

photos here :

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j296/honzaaf/110b1det1a.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j296/honzaaf/110b1det1b.jpg

text here:

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j296/honzaaf/110b1.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j296/honzaaf/110b.jpg

source here:

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j296/honzaaf/110bsourc.jpg

(magazine pages: www.letectvi.cz )

I hope it will be interesting for you :)
 

Apophenia

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Ah ... so no other pearls waiting for us on the LK page then. :(
 

Antonio

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I'm sure that we have Czech members here.
 

zerstorer1946

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wow never even heard of this! i agree, it definitely looks like a modification to train pilots to get used to flying 210s.
ive gotta find out more about this one!
 

Tomac

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zerstorer1946 said:
wow never even heard of this! i agree, it definitely looks like a modification to train pilots to get used to flying 210s.
ive gotta find out more about this one!

Sorry, but that's an Arado Ar.240A. Here's a drawing of one.
 

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spiteful21k

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Sorry I think you be wrong too, I think it is a Me210V-1 or other early prototype.

Image from Luftarchiv.de
 

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Apophenia

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The captions clearly identify this short-nosed aircraft as a modified Bf 110B
 

toura

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According to "LuftArchiv.de" this plane is the
Bf 110 V9 (GK+AS) aufgenommen (?) am 17.02.1944
in Brandenburg/briest
I don't know more...
Bye
 

toura

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Hi all
The ME 210 is the Me 210 V1 (D-AABF)
First fligth 5.09.1939
The only twin fins Me 210. The V2 has a single fin.
Bye
 

zerstorer1946

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it has to be a 110 modification, the wings, tail, motors, are definitely from a 110b. could have been a test plane to see how the canopy of the 210 fares against the 110, and used an old 110 airframe to test it out??
 
J

joncarrfarrelly

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The aircraft is the Bf 110 B-1/V9.
The second photo is on page 336 of Messerschmitt Bf 110 Me 210 Me 410 by Mankau and Petrick, Aviatic Verlag 2001
The Prototypen and Versuchsträger list in the book gives the following:
Bf 110 B-1/V9; Ju 210 G; GK+AS; 2.44 mit Me 210 ähnlicher Kanzel in Brandenburg/Briest

In other words, a Bf 110 B-1 with a canopy similar to the Me 210

Jon
 

zerstorer1946

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Cool, well thats that settled! Id really like to convert a model kit 110 into this type.
 

airman

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joncarrfarrelly said:
The aircraft is the Bf 110 B-1/V9.
The second photo is on page 336 of Messerschmitt Bf 110 Me 210 Me 410 by Mankau and Petrick, Aviatic Verlag 2001
The Prototypen and Versuchsträger list in the book gives the following:
Bf 110 B-1/V9; Ju 210 G; GK+AS; 2.44 mit Me 210 ähnlicher Kanzel in Brandenburg/Briest

In other words, a Bf 110 B-1 with a canopy similar to the Me 210

Jon
So this explain that there are a connection with Me-210 !
 
J

joncarrfarrelly

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airman said:
So this explain that there are a connection with Me-210 !

Not really, it says that it has a canopy similar to the 210 not that it is the same as the 210.
The canopy shapes are completely different.

Also as stated in the list and on the photo the configuration dates from February of 1944.
Mankau and Petrick are more specific, the photo in their book is dated February 17, 1944.
Four and a half years after the first flight of the Me 210 V1(Sept. 5, 1939).
So a direct connection with Me 210 development is doubtful.

Jon
 

Archibald

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To summarize: looks we have found the "missing link" between the 110 and the 210 ;D
 

r16

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just to show that ı am still around and haven't learned a single bit , ı would happily guess that it is indeed a mix of Me-110 / 210 with Arado 240 . While Messerschmitt was awarded a contract even before the first flight of 210 , the Arado was also a strong competitor in the search for the definitive Zerstörer the Luftwaffe was looking that would result in a "one type airforce " as many servicemen today would recognize . The different nose contours of the type compared to 110 are clearly inspired by the 240 which , in the shady and murky maze of development ideas , might have limited movement for nose weapons or the rear turrets to compensate for the lack of maneouvrability inherent in the design concept compared to any contemporary single seater . Speculatively in the case of 240 it would look like those weapon trays many German twins had . ( Americans could fire forward in the A-26 , why shouldn't Germans ? ) It might be remembered both 240 and 210 were unstable and probably Luftwaffe asked too much to match a 109 when writing the specifications . As far as ı can make it up from the text , the plane was modified in 1941 by Blohm Voss . As the 210s were being delivered starting from April 1941 a lower powered conversion might mean a less visible test programme . Which by 1944 would have petered out leaving the plane useful only as a training machine .
 

Grzesio

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As far as ı can make it up from the text , the plane was modified in 1941 by Blohm Voss .
Sadly, there's nothing like that written there. The text says, nothing is known about this particular aircraft and one can only speculate. It's also mentioned, Blohm & Voss converted five Me 210 A-0 into trainers with twin controls, and the author suspects, our Bf 110 could have been rebuilt by B&V in the same time.

By the way, both pictures were published already in 1999 in H.-J. Becker's Schwere Jäger und Zerstörer der Luftwaffe 1933-1945 by Motorbuch-Verlag.

Regards

Grzesio
 

r16

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thanks for the timely input , not knowing the language can definitely lead one to errors , so the claim for a test programme regarding moveable weaponry with this particular airframe is now unsupported from my perspective.
 

Bodmas

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Looks to me to be an Ar240 to me, altough i concede that the engine cowlings look to be from a Bf110B.This one has me a tad confused ???

consider myself TOLD!
 

Apophenia

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Re: Bf 110B less known modification

Jon has already identified this machine as the Bf 110 B-1/V9. Other than its odd, shortened nose, this aircraft has little but a passing resemblance to the Ar-240
 
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