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Author Topic: 3D printing  (Read 26953 times)

Offline sferrin

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #60 on: August 03, 2015, 06:33:36 am »
The cost per gramme for sls powder, or photosensitive resin, can be quite high!

We looked at getting some rather large parts printed for training purposes (before our tooling was in-house and parts were made).  The quoted price for printed parts was more expensive than the composite parts themselves AND the tooling, labor, etc.
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Offline Skyblazer

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #61 on: August 03, 2015, 07:39:51 am »
Thanks a lot for your answers, Riverghost and sferrin.

I'm sure the costs will drop within 2-3 years, given the speed of technological advances and the success of this technology. Then perhaps the cost of the parts will make it more worthwhile to get your model done in photosensitive resin! I really can envision a future where most model kits will disappear from the stands, and instead people will purchase online a template to get their model printed at home. That can lead to a lot more personalization of the kits, because you will only purchase the rafts that are of interest to you, and also the feedback from users will enable the companies to constantly improve their models without having to reissue them. Plus think of all the packaging saved... neat for the planet too! (okay, the old model shops and opening of the model boxes have a flavor that online purchase will never match, but that's the way of progress I guess...).

Offline Riverghost

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #62 on: August 03, 2015, 08:08:29 am »
Perhaps a good way that model shops could survive in this brave new world would be if they also invested into 3d printing. clients come to them with the CAD/Model data, they then print and clean up for a fee.

I truly am interested in how the SLA style systems are going to develop. FDM has to a degree reached its 'peak' in terms of your quality vs speed of print, trying to get any toolhead moving over 500mm/s whilst retaining accuracy is going to start to become cost counterproductive imho,  whereas there is no such hard limit with these SLA systems due to the lack of any moving 'head'. 

What's going to make these SLA printers truly a hobby device is making them as user friendly as current FDM printers. SLA is MESSY, and SMELLS FUNKY. it requires you to use suitable protective gloves etc, and you will find that sticky resin residue everywhere. the company that allows you to just fill it up, and take out a relatively 'clean' part, with integrated odor control / sealed vat area  - that will make someone a pretty penny.


Offline Skyblazer

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #63 on: August 03, 2015, 08:35:07 am »
Perhaps a good way that model shops could survive in this brave new world would be if they also invested into 3d printing. clients come to them with the CAD/Model data, they then print and clean up for a fee.

Interesting you should say this, because that is close to the way I initially envisioned the world of music stores when the first CD burners appeared. I imagined people would soon be going to their favorite store, and if they didn't want to buy the entire albums, but only a selection of songs, or if they wanted to make a compilation of their favorite songs from different albums, they'd go to the counter and get their own personalized CD burnt for them on the spot. Of course I had no idea that the manufacturers would make this technology readily available to all... I'm sure that if this scheme had been pursued instead of allowing just anyone to make digital copies of their CDs at home, the music industry would not have been in such a mess, because people would have continued to buy the stuff.

Offline PlanesPictures

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #64 on: August 03, 2015, 09:56:30 am »
Only a few minutes ago I sent it to print. I look forward

Offline Hobbes

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #65 on: August 03, 2015, 11:06:26 am »
Perhaps a good way that model shops could survive in this brave new world would be if they also invested into 3d printing. clients come to them with the CAD/Model data, they then print and clean up for a fee.


It'd be difficult for them to compete with large-volume 3D print houses like Shapeways.

Offline Sundog

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #66 on: August 30, 2015, 04:28:05 pm »
It'd be difficult for them to compete with large-volume 3D print houses like Shapeways.


My guess is they would link with businesses like Shapeways, have their own store front there, since anyone is able to, and you would basically pay to have their model printed and shipped to you.


To me, what makes this interesting, is you could have option pricing. One for the basic airframe, one for a weapons kit, flight crew, support vehicles. They could even make it so you could easily buy different variant options.

Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #67 on: August 30, 2015, 05:54:36 pm »
Yes- it would be no more costly (aside from the initial modelling) to have lots of versions, like P.1121 prototype, production, 2 seat naval strike, etc.
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Offline riggerrob

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #68 on: June 23, 2018, 06:16:19 pm »
Yes, merely e-mailing print files to a local fab shop is the future. 3D printers are still too fussy for casual home users.

Sellers of CNC plywood boat kits are currently reluctant to e-mail out cutting files until copyright law catches up to tooling. They are afraid that a customer will buy cut files (and a licence to build one) then re-sell them to hundreds of black market customers.

I can foresee a future where you bring your favourite garden gnome - to your local UPS Store - for scanning. Tomorrow your distant aunt receives an exact copy printed in any one of dozens of stock colours. For an additional fee, UPS will “fix” cracks and faded paint on the printed copy.

Offline Foo Fighter

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #69 on: October 14, 2018, 07:56:16 am »
At which point do the home use 3d printers become a credible threat for the likes of Airfix etc.  What can they do to hang on to their business?  At some stage there will have to be a sea change in rights and it can only cut the freedoms of modelers everywhere.  With the use of 3d scanners this will be even more convoluted rather like the digital music rights etc.

Offline Richard N

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #70 on: October 17, 2018, 10:04:45 pm »
3D printed parts are useful for prototypes or small part runs, but have nowhere near the surface finish or quick production cycles of injection molded parts. 

The surface finish of injection parts can be smooth as glass with fine panel lines and rivet detail while printed parts are covered with grow or printing lines and have to be hand or chemical finished to get a surface that is smooth but nowhere near the quality of an injection part.

Injection part cycle times are measured in seconds to minutes where the mold closes and is injected with molten plastic, cooled with water run through passages in the mold, and finally ejected from the mold.  Printed parts take from hours to days.  3D printing is okay for a single part or prototype, but impractical for most production.

Printed parts for production are practical for small runs of large parts where the run is too small to be worth investing in molds or tooling that would be feasible  for a larger number of parts.

Airfix has nothing to fear from 3D printers.

Offline merriman

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #71 on: October 18, 2018, 09:05:19 am »
… Airfix has nothing to fear from 3D printers.

Not yet.

But, within a short time robot printing/cutting of parts will equal the finish and production time of injection molding (with the ability to 'pre-paint' those parts already demonstrated on printed parts). In SF circles they refer to such machines as, Replicators.

The day is quickly approaching when no one will have the ability or inclination to use their hands or brains. And on that day the lights go out, so will we. No craftsmen, no survival. There won't even be a spoke-shave to save us.

Brave new world, indeed.

David
We're the extra fuel they may need, Stanton...

Offline Orionblamblam

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #72 on: October 18, 2018, 01:41:14 pm »

The day is quickly approaching when no one will have the ability or inclination to use their hands or brains.

Not necessarily. When 3D printers/fabber/replicators can truly replace pretty much any other means of making something, the urge to create will still exist; it will just be expressed differently... via creating stuff on the computer. I've seen a lot of artists who "sculpt" some pretty amazing digital figures, and with modern and projected input devices, the techniques are actually not dissimilar from sculpting in clay. With augmented reality glasses and input gloves that feature sensory feedback, it will be a *lot* like physical sculpting... just with the ability to hit "undo."

And, sure, if the computers go down, there will be trouble. But if there's a massive EMP strike or a Carrington Event, we'll have bigger things to worry about than a lack of new spaceship model kits.

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Offline sferrin

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #73 on: October 18, 2018, 05:30:20 pm »

The day is quickly approaching when no one will have the ability or inclination to use their hands or brains.

Not necessarily. When 3D printers/fabber/replicators can truly replace pretty much any other means of making something, the urge to create will still exist; it will just be expressed differently... via creating stuff on the computer. I've seen a lot of artists who "sculpt" some pretty amazing digital figures, and with modern and projected input devices, the techniques are actually not dissimilar from sculpting in clay. With augmented reality glasses and input gloves that feature sensory feedback, it will be a *lot* like physical sculpting... just with the ability to hit "undo."

And, sure, if the computers go down, there will be trouble. But if there's a massive EMP strike or a Carrington Event, we'll have bigger things to worry about than a lack of new spaceship model kits.

Yep.  The stuff they can do in ZBrush is pretty mind-blowing.
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Offline royabulgaf

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Re: 3D printing
« Reply #74 on: October 18, 2018, 07:29:12 pm »
Orionblamen- Regarding the artist.  There was an SF short story written 50+ years ago about an artist that worked with a voice-controlled 3d printer.  He created sculptures that were anti-gravity, but only when inebriated.