Why is the P1121 so popular?

[Trident]

If I had to guess it's because of its exotic look. Ventral intakes were almost unheard of back then.

Exotic/modern is one aspect of this, but the P.1121 was simply sleek and clean too. Looks matter a great deal in an unbuilt design gaining a "cult following", futuristic and/or brutish can work just as well as elegance, but it better not be downright ugly (F-32, looking at you!).

The main problems that I don't see being addressed are: it's too big/expensive to compete with F-104 or Mirage on the export market, and it's not as capable as the Phantom which set the gold-standard for it's contemporaries among those countries who could afford it.

Well, thinking outside the box a bit, there is a precedent. In terms of size, the MiG-23/27 is roughly similar, and that family sold well into the quadruple digits! This would seem to indicate that fundamentally an airframe adaptable to both A/A and A/G roles, sized in the bracket between the Mirage III and F-4, is a militarily useful thing. A market niche should therefore exist, though of course the P.1121 could not compete for the same customers (except, notably and repeatedly, in India!). Perhaps as with the Flogger this would take the shape of distinct A/A and A/G versions rather than having both capabilities in the same airframe, so a Jaguar-style chisel-nose variant?

Maybe some of the sales which the F-4 or Mirage III gained only came to pass because there was nothing in between available? It's an assumption that they were optimally sized in every case.

 

[Archibald]

Well said. May i add the fact that the MiG-23 was a flying piece of junk. It manoeuvered like a Stratolaunch carrying an An-225.

 

[zen]

If you wanted a common aircraft of fighters and attack machines. Then your choice was down to.
Vantour
Lansen
F104 Starfighter
Mirage III
Mig 23 and 27
Mirage F1
Phantom II F4

But remember that there ought to have been the Mirage F2 and F3.
The F107 and the developments of Mig21....and of course the troublesome P1154 "Harrier".

Of these P1121 is somewhat like an earlier F2 /F3 like solution.

 

[Archibald]

"Vautour"

Dassault had once a twin-Atar Mirage IVC that was only allowed to survive as...a bomber.

 

[Hood]

Two provocative questions spring to mind from reading the above replies:

a) Camm was criticised numerous times by the MoS for not thinking in terms of a weapons system. But here a few people are saying that the plug and play approach would have given a decent fighter. So was the MoS just talking bollocks when it came to weapon systems and would they have been better to listen to Camm and Petter (indeed opening up an EE P.17 rather than the TSR.2 mashup design) and just stick to the old method of the airframe manufacturer bunging in kit they wanted any way they wanted to?

b) how good was the Airpass/Firestreak set up for a proper fighter rather than a 'Bear' or 'Bison' hunting interceptor? As a good Hunter replacement for the FGA role, some kind of good dogfighting ability was needed. The export Mirages had Sidewinder (which was by no means perfect at all in the early 1960s). Would lugging a couple of Firestreaks with a worthwhile bomb and fuel load even be possible? Of course in this era the prime GA weapon was Red-bearded instant sunshine, by the later 1960s that was a one trick pony.

 

[Archibald]

The Israelis (and later Argentina AF pilots) tested the Magic 1, AIM-9B and Israel own IR missile (Yahalom, from memory) on the same Mirage IIIC / Mirage V / Nesher. End result: they were equally bad.
The first large IR missile fight happened two months before the Six days war, on April 7, 1967. Between IDF/AF Mirages and a bunch of Arab Migs. The Israelis carried the day (as usual), thanks to the DEFA guns and pilot skills, rather than IR AAMs. Which went chasing clouds rather than MiGs.

Less than a month later was Robin Olds Operation Bolo over Vietnam - missiles fared not much better.

 

[zen]

Good questions, but no easy answers for them.

After 5 attempts on my horrible smartphone while being constantly distracted, I can honestly say it might take days to bash out the sort of essay that gives you an honest evenhanded answer .