What type of aircraft is this? - Martin T3M/T4M

[nemo85]

Hi guys,
I sought help from the experts who are here.
Do you know what kind of plane that is?
If anyone knows this, do you have a source for it?

Thanks for the help.
Best regards
nemo85

 

[Jemiba]

Welcome on board !
I would say, it's a Martin T4M, as first flown in 1927, see attached 3-view from
Swanborough/Bower "United States Navy Aircraft since 1911"

 

[nemo85]

Thanks Jemiba,
the thing about the Martin T4M is a good tip and is certainly true.
But who built the tail unit on the plane? Could it be a DETROIT TE?
The picture comes from: http://naval.aviation.museum/emuwebdoncoms/objects/common/webmedia.php?irn=54724, unfortunately the website has been down for a long time. And I didn't save the information about the picture.

 

[riggerrob]

A US Navy torpedo bomber with 3 crew.
The prototype first flew in 1927 and it entered service in 1938 to serve for a decade, making it the last biplane torpedo bomber in USN service. Most of that service was on wheels, flying from the decks of aircraft carriers.

 

[Scott Kenny]

Welcome on board !
I would say, it's a Martin T4M, as first flown in 1927, see attached 3-view from
Swanborough/Bower "United States Navy Aircraft since 1911"

Tail is different, though. Forward fuselage looks about right. Might have been built at a different plant to mostly Martin specs.

 

[Apophenia]

The Cleveland factory producing T4Ms was sold to Great Lakes Aircraft. Might this photo be of a Great Lakes TG-2 variant (or simply an alternative rudder experiment)?

 

[Scott Kenny]

The Cleveland factory producing T4Ms was sold to Great Lakes Aircraft. Might this photo be of a Great Lakes TG-2 variant (or simply an alternative rudder experiment)?

Could be. The (expletives deleted) USN naming system makes it difficult to nail down exactly which model this mystery plane is...

 

[Arjen]

The T4M was developed from the T3M.
Martin Aircraft 1909-1960 by John R Breihan, Stan Piet and Roger S Mason, Narkiewicz//Thompson 1995 has this on some differences between the two:

Compared to the T3M-2, the new model's fuselage structure employed lighter chrome-molybdenum steel alloy framing; its rudder was now horn-balanced and made of duralumin, and its wings were shortened by three feet. The crew arrangement was the same, though round windows replaced square ones in the fuselage compartments.

I'm guessing the image from the start of this thread shows an earlier balanced rudder, tried before Martin settled on the T4M-1's definitive shape of balanced rudder.

 

[Arjen]

Martin modified the first T3M-2 to take a P&W R-1690 Hornet, the result was designated XT3M-3. It went to the NAF where the R-1690 was replaced by a Wright R-1750 Cyclone, becoming the XT3M-4.
Image shows XT3M-3, note the rudder's shape and square fuselage window.

Martin XT3M-3

 

[nemo85]

Thank you guys for your input.
You haven't seen the photo yet either. It would be interesting to see what the guys from the naval.aviation.museum have written about it.

I'm guessing the image from the start of this thread shows an earlier balanced rudder, tried before Martin settled on the T4M-1's definitive shape of balanced rudder.

That seems plausible to me.