McDonnell Model 1

[Mark Nankivil]

Greetings All -

A few scans from the Gerald Balzer Collection.

Enjoy the Day! Mark

 

[circle-5]

Neat!

 

[Stargazer]

Amazing.

Plate reads: "Designed and built for G. L. Martin Co. by Lyle Farver - 1938"

Can we infer from this plate that the design was rejected by Martin and found favor with McDonnell?

 

[Antonio]

Please read this wikipedia entry about James McDonnell early career

James Smith McDonnell - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

J. McDonnell worked at the Martin Co.

See also Gerald Balzer's:

American Secret Pusher Fighters of World War II: XP-54, XP-55, and XP-56: Balzer, Gerald: 9781580071253: Amazon.com: Books

American Secret Pusher Fighters of World War II: XP-54, XP-55, and XP-56 [Balzer, Gerald] on Amazon.com. *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. American Secret Pusher Fighters of World War II: XP-54, XP-55, and XP-56

www.amazon.com

pg 18 and 19 for more info about McDonnell Model 1 which was entered at R40-C solicitation

 

[Jos Heyman]

This obviously evolved into the XP-67 Bat.

 

[Stargazer]

This obviously evolved into the XP-67 Bat.

... which was the Model 2 !

 

[Taranov]

This obviously evolved into the XP-67 Bat.

No, XP-67 - it's McDonnell Model 2A.

 

[Stargazer]

This obviously evolved into the XP-67 Bat.

No, XP-67 - it's McDonnell Model 2A.

Well, yeah. But I wasn't trying to be too specific here.

 

[eltf177]

I'm curious as to why the pusher layout. Looking at the design I can't see any reason why a tractor configuration couldn't have been chosen. Any information about this?

 

[Orionblamblam]

I'm curious as to why the pusher layout. Looking at the design I can't see any reason why a tractor configuration couldn't have been chosen. Any information about this?

Pusher props theoretically have slightly greater net thrust, since the props aren't blowing past the wing, where drag is created.

 

[Kryptid]

I quite like the extensive fuselage-wing blending. Seems that the concept isn't as new as I thought it was.


We need more modern aircraft featuring such blending.

 

[Justo Miranda]

more drawings...

 

[Tophe]

In "US Fighters" by Lloyd S. Jones, Aero Publishers1975, page 179 I read: "Late in 1939. Starting with a proposal to the Air Corps for an Allison V-3420 or Pratt & Whitney H-3130-powered long-range fighter, Mc Donnell inquired about a contract to construct the plane. The Air Corps wasn't too excited about the plan to bury the engine behind the pilot and drive a pair of pusher propellers through right angle extension shafts, but did permit the company to submit the design for proposal R-40C. The unconventional design, competing with what became the XP-54, -55, -56, did not fair well but did warrant an order for more engineering details. A revised proposal for a more conventional fighter was submitted to the Air Corps in June 1940, but again rejected. McDonnell returned on May 22, 1941, with a re-engineered design and received a contract for construction of two XP-67's."
EDIT: it was uncommon to see such a twin-propeller plane having a single engine, so I "repaired" that, inventing a what-if derivative with 2 engines (and 3 propellers, and 2 fuselages), ahem... (http://www.whatifmodelers.com/index.php/topic,20326.840.html)

 

[Mark Nankivil]

Greetings All -

A WWII era (Flying magazine, January 1943) McDonnell Aircraft ad featuring the Model 1.

Enjoy the Day! Mark

 

[Stargazer]

Great, Mark. Another one of the same era, with the Model 1 not quite so visible, but worth adding nonetheless.

Also a couple of pics previously unseen in this topic: a wind-tunnel model and the original patent art, cleaned up and restored by yours truly.

 

[Stargazer]

And the same patent plans reworked in poster fashion:

 

[Mark Nankivil]

Very nice Stephane - thanks!

Enjoy the Day! Mark

 

[Steve Pace]

Mark: Is there anything definitive on the name Bat or Moonbat for the Model 2A XP-67? Thanks, Steve

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

An article on Model 1.

McDonnell Aircraft Corporation Model 1

The McDonnell Model 1 was an unorthodox high-performance fighter. The 1940 design proved too advanced and did not progress beyond the design phase. However, it did inspire the McDonnell XP-67.

oldmachinepress.wordpress.com

 

[Stargazer]

An article on Model 1.

http://oldmachinepress.wordpress.com/2012/09/07/mcdonnell-aircraft-corporation-model-1/

Fantastic! Thanks a lot for this link.

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

No problem

 

[hesham]

Hi,

here is the McDonnel Model-1.

U. S. Warplanes of World War II

books.google.com.eg

 

[VictorXL188]

Not splitting hairs or anything, but I was always under the impression that the first McDonnell design was the Doodlebug of 1927, so why did that not get the Model 1 designation?

 

[Vahe Demirjian]

Not splitting hairs or anything, but I was always under the impression that the first McDonnell design was the Doodlebug of 1927, so why did that not get the Model 1 designation?
View attachment 642609View attachment 642610

Simple. The first company founded by James McDonnell, called J.S. McDonnell Jr. & Associates, manufactured the Doodlebug. When the Great Depression happened, McDonnell dissolved his firm and worked for Great Lakes and then Martin, before founding the McDonnell Aircraft Corporation in 1939. Thus, the Doodlebug was not designed by the McDonnell Aircraft Corporation that was created in 1939.

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

McDonnell Aircraft Model 1

A copy of the 3-view drawing and the McAir patent, dated 24 November 1942, and other articles and info on the proposed McDonnell Aircraft M...

aviationarchives.blogspot.com

 

[Apophenia]

Nice! Thanks Paul.

Not splitting hairs or anything, but I was always under the impression that the first McDonnell design was the Doodlebug of 1927, so why did that not get the Model 1 designation?

Not sure of the answer but perhaps because the Doodlebug was a joint design exercise? Although the new firm was named J.S. McDonnell & Associates, the Doodlebug was designed by McDonnell, James Cowling, Jr., and Constantine L. Zakhartchenko.

All three were aeronautical engineers who had left the Hamilton Metalplane Company to design and build a competitor for the Guggenheim Safe Aircraft Award contest. And all three would be re-united when the McDonnell Aircraft Corporation was formed in 1938.

 

[Silencer1]

Curiously, such configuration (two pusher props on the wings) have been studied as one of the possible XP-38 layouts.
#83 But obviously, XP-38 hasn't planned as such sophisticated combination of blended fuselage/wings, complex inlet/exhaust system. So McDonnell designed too advanced aircraft, which later realized in much more conventional jets, like FH-1

 

[Mark Nankivil]

Had the good fortune of seeing the wind tunnel model shown in the first post of this thread - see:

https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/martin-176-c.9599/post-635857

Enjoy the Day! Mark