The use of the same control surfaces and wings as the Su-57 is rather interesting.

Speaking which, I've noticed that the edges of the Su-57's wings (and the LERX/LEVCONs) are considerably more blunt compared to the F-22 and F-35 edges. Why is that? I'd expect that the main benefit would be at subsonic speeds.
 
Have we seen a close up photo of the 'Checkmate' logo on the nose?
These images are the best I could find!
I couldn't find anything that let you read the script below (in grey) or see the detail of the logo.....
I have some pics I can't share where you can read the small text below, if I recall correctly it says "Turn the Chessboard". The logo has the knight chess piece at the bottom, and at the top a silhouette view of the Checkmate fighter from rear below chasing another fighter silhouette which was too small for me to identify but logically, probably an F-35?
Ah go on - why not share just a cropped piece of the pictures? In B&W if you like. Watermarked.
See private message. Its TURN THE CHESSBOARD in caps. In font Roboto Regular perhaps.
 
He's talking about the badge.

I already converted the SVG format logo from the page into a pdf.
 
I wish Ausairpower to be still active... i wonder what Carlo Kopp and Peter Goon might say about this aircraft.
At a wild guess - its a game changer and Australia really needs to buy some F-22s to counter it?
With the prices they're willing to pay for subs and frigates, they would get local NGAD production!
 
Is there a specific name for very slanted tails like on e.g. YF-23 and Boeing´s ATS (with absence of horizontal stabilizers)? Just 'V-tails'?
I believe the term butterfly tail is used for YF-23.

I was having Butterfly Tail in the back of my mind, but was afraid I would be wrong again...
Classic V-tails (e.g. Beechcraft Bonanza) are usually angled at 90 degrees from each other and 45 degrees from the vertical.
During the 1940s and 1950s, many competition sailplanes were built with V-tails. Sailplane pilots primarily wanted to keep tail surfaces above weeds during "out" landings. This was before T-tails became fashionable.
Since airplanes often need more vertical stabilizer than horizontal, a few V-tails (e.g. Monnet kitplanes) sometimes add a small vertical rudder below the regular angled fins.
OTOH Predator drones hang both sides of the V-tail and an extra vertical fin all below the fuselage.
Pazmany reminds us that V-tails do not save any of the tail-volume, so V-tails tend to be higher and broader than more conventional tails (e.g. cruxiform).
Dozens of V-tails were designed before electronic flight stabilization was ever invented. Control mixers are also comparatively easy to design. (see Davis DA-2A). One Soviet disco-plane used only control cables to "mix" rudder and stick inputs.

Angled 'at about'. It´s often a little more then 90 and 45 degrees, with regard to jets e.g. Fouga Magister where the angle in between is about 120 degrees. On YF-23 they´re angled at 50 degrees from the vertical and 100 degrees from each other, IIRC.
On F-117 it´s the opposite and the angles are less.
I know what a V-tail (Butterfly) is, I just thought there might perhaps be another specific name for those with 'a wide fuselage and an engine (or two) in between' and then got that confused with the Pelikan Tail.
 
I wish Sukhoi would release a 3 view drawing of this airplane, it is hard to tell with the pictures we have because they look distorted by the camera lenses.
 
LhFzMqkNC_E.jpg

This image was posted earlier but on another forum there was discussion that this shows a possible mockup of kh58 and grom. Might give a good idea of its size. I really think it is just a modified weapons bay from su57 except it is obviously just one instead of two bays. It is awesome.
 
I just had a stray thought regarding the intake.
Sorry if what I'm proposing is utter nonsense. It has been pointed out that the intake area is rather small for such a powerful engine, but isn't it possible that the nose of the aircraft is designed so that it directs the air hitting the nosecone inside the intake? I know, that usually this is the last thing you want, since usually you don't want to direct turbulent boundary-layer air inside the engine, but I'm pretty sure that the shape of the airframe around the intake influences the thickness of the boundary layer. For example, I remember reading that the YF23 got away with a diverterless inlet in part because the intakes were placed backwards with a long flat surface in front of them, which reduced the thinckness of the boundary layer that needed to be dealt with. Imo, that would explain the unusually pointy nose on this sub-Mach 2 aircraft.
 
I just had a stray thought regarding the intake.
Sorry if what I'm proposing is utter nonsense. It has been pointed out that the intake area is rather small for such a powerful engine, but isn't it possible that the nose of the aircraft is designed so that it directs the air hitting the nosecone inside the intake? I know, that usually this is the last thing you want, since usually you don't want to direct turbulent boundary-layer air inside the engine, but I'm pretty sure that the shape of the airframe around the intake influences the thickness of the boundary layer. For example, I remember reading that the YF23 got away with a diverterless inlet in part because the intakes were placed backwards with a long flat surface in front of them, which reduced the thinckness of the boundary layer that needed to be dealt with. Imo, that would explain the unusually pointy nose on this sub-Mach 2 aircraft.

I think whats often not factored is that the intake isnt completely a chin intake. it goes out a little bit to the sides too, so there's a bit more air coming in than one would think

i also see the intake as a giant DSI duct, and one can see a slight bump too. some of the early fan made CGI and drawings may miss this, but its noticeable like in this picture

1200px-Vladimir_Putin_in_MAKS_Airshow_2021_12.jpg
 
Considering the use of so many Su-57 parts (including literally the nose, apparently) in the mock-up it’s quite possible (probable?) that an actual representative aircraft will have the same general configuration of inlet but one that could differ considerably in final size and detailed shape.
I would have doubts about the current inlet size and geometry, at least in terms of what I have seen based on the current pictures.
 
Inlet looks plenty big enough to me - it only has to feed one engine. I think the tubbiness of the design make it look undersided.
 
View attachment 661753

This image was posted earlier but on another forum there was discussion that this shows a possible mockup of kh58 and grom. Might give a good idea of its size. I really think it is just a modified weapons bay from su57 except it is obviously just one instead of two bays. It is awesome.
1 J-58UShK anti-radar missile (Kh-58UShK in English)

1 missile of the GROM family
 

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I think whats often not factored is that the intake isnt completely a chin intake. it goes out a little bit to the sides too, so there's a bit more air coming in than one would think
Actually the Borisov model may be an early version, with a more straightforward DSI intake. This may be a further optimization where the nose is made thicker in the vertical plane for improved radar aperture. As a result, the intake is extended to the sides, and the result is an interesting DSI where the bump is in three planes at the same time. Also, the intake is brought forward for a less marked upside turning of the air duct, with the inled making part of that particular type of LERX. Not a trivial design at all...

length 17.25 m
span 12 m
height 4.7 m
So cross sectional area is 7.33 sqm? That is not small by any means...

engine compressor area- 0.67 m2
air intake area - 0.75m2
Much smaller than the Su-57... that reminds me of some discussions at the Su-57 thread xD

BTW, Paralay, are you using directly the landing gear of the Su-57? Does it fit? I mean, that landing gear is already big for a heavy fighter, for the LTS is pure monster truck style...
 
BTW, Paralay, are you using directly the landing gear of the Su-57? Does it fit? I mean, that landing gear is already big for a heavy fighter, for the LTS is pure monster truck style...

Russians have always been big on rough field take-off and landings though... they even put diverters in the Mig-29 and Su-27 to protect them from ingestion of debris.
 
BTW, Paralay, are you using directly the landing gear of the Su-57? Does it fit? I mean, that landing gear is already big for a heavy fighter, for the LTS is pure monster truck style...
I'm too lazy to draw , I changed the scale of the Su-57 chassis :)
 

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I just had a stray thought regarding the intake.
Sorry if what I'm proposing is utter nonsense. It has been pointed out that the intake area is rather small for such a powerful engine, but isn't it possible that the nose of the aircraft is designed so that it directs the air hitting the nosecone inside the intake? I know, that usually this is the last thing you want, since usually you don't want to direct turbulent boundary-layer air inside the engine, but I'm pretty sure that the shape of the airframe around the intake influences the thickness of the boundary layer. For example, I remember reading that the YF23 got away with a diverterless inlet in part because the intakes were placed backwards with a long flat surface in front of them, which reduced the thinckness of the boundary layer that needed to be dealt with. Imo, that would explain the unusually pointy nose on this sub-Mach 2 aircraft.

I think whats often not factored is that the intake isnt completely a chin intake. it goes out a little bit to the sides too, so there's a bit more air coming in than one would think

i also see the intake as a giant DSI duct, and one can see a slight bump too. some of the early fan made CGI and drawings may miss this, but its noticeable like in this picture

1200px-Vladimir_Putin_in_MAKS_Airshow_2021_12.jpg
Are you suggesting that the entire bottom half of the nose-cone is a fixed, inlet, shock cone (ala. CF-104)?
 
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Seems like a combination of F-35 and F-32 fixed inlets? I think Boeing's F-32 was a fixed inlet design with no transitioning inlet lip like the X-32?
 
@AleDucat
That looks very nice indeed, if I can give some constructive feedback, the ventral bay does not extend backwards beyond the main landing gear, maybe you want to check that and use it also as a way to check overall dimensions
 
@AleDucat
That looks very nice indeed, if I can give some constructive feedback, the ventral bay does not extend backwards beyond the main landing gear, maybe you want to check that and use it also as a way to check overall dimensions
Thanks, I'll take that in consideration. I made the basic shapes out of the first, covered pictures prior to official unveiling, and took the main landing gear's wheel for sizing (diameter, 0.84 cm), but also the known tractor dimensions and Su-57 parts frankensteinaized (lol) as a basis for overall length and width. Maybe I draw the landing gear much ahead of where it had to be, and main bay door too behind of the real position..
 
Thanks, I'll take that in consideration. I made the basic shapes out of the first, covered pictures prior to official unveiling, and took the main landing gear's wheel for sizing (diameter, 0.84 cm), but also the known tractor dimensions and Su-57 parts frankensteinaized (lol) as a basis for overall length and width. Maybe I draw the landing gear much ahead of where it had to be, and main bay door too behind of the real position..
Out of curiosity, how did you know the size of the wheel?
In general I think the sizing of the plane both based in the pictures with the tarp (it makes difficult to determine the scale using known parts since they are covered) and the pictures form the presentation (big distortion) is difficult to be made with precision, but I think the estimations between 17 and 18 m should be reasonable.
Another reference that can be used for placing the bay is that the engine needs to be afterwards, it measures ca. 5 m.
 
Out of curiosity, how did you know the size of the wheel?
In general I think the sizing of the plane both based in the pictures with the tarp (it makes difficult to determine the scale using known parts since they are covered) and the pictures form the presentation (big distortion) is difficult to be made with precision, but I think the estimations between 17 and 18 m should be reasonable.
Another reference that can be used for placing the bay is that the engine needs to be afterwards, it measures ca. 5 m.
I read it somewhere, if I can found it again I'll link it here
 
Designed by supercomputer.

Assembled with a sledgehammer?

View attachment 661332
Looking more and more like a quick-and-dirty mock up assembled from parts of a written off Su-57 prototype....
I'd partially agree. Ruskies make prototypes fairly rough and it indeed uses su57 parts which is clever. But this wasn't just bolted together without thought. The aerodynamics and signature reducing shapes were well thought out. Say what you want about russian MIC but they don't just build toy mockups on the fly (you can't really as they literally wouldn't fly) for propaganda like the iranian mockup(not bashing Iranian military capabilities here which are often scoffed at; tho at their opponent's own peril). Remember they are every old and respected design bureau. It is based upon a pretty classic signature reducing layout that we even see from northrop designs in the 90s and early 00s. Also they seem to build fighters on different principles. We build them seamlessly with very low observability in a couple radio wavelengths. I think they are building them to be low observable but with techniques that will make it so that it requires much less labor and artifice and could potentially take the place of all 4th gen fighters.

Edit: had to add extra thought.
 
The very low cost mentioned is certainly to mitigate embargo enforcement. Not something representative.
 
Using as many Su-57 parts as possible is the right way forward. Leveraging that previous investment in design, tech and manufacturing is paramount in making this aircraft 'affordable'.

The more assemblies and tooling you use from already existing and paid for products and processes the lower your upfront setup and long lead item costs. Whilst you may end up having to buy more sets of tooling (either due to build rate - a good thing, or because the previous sets of tooling were contracted in such a way that they can only be used for one product - a bad thing) you can pretty much just ask for the suppliers to make you more of what they already did.
Exactly, I actually think this strategy is every bit as important as the layout chosen in order to get a reduced final price and I am not sure it is not being properly appreciated. It simply eliminates fixed costs from all the industrial effort involved and therefore may reduce substantially the overhead per produced unit, which can be high because fighter jets are not consumer goods. To be able to make a single engine plane with for instance the wings of the twin engine big brother is remarkable, I don't know if it is unprecedented but I at least don't know any other examples.

Complicating factors would be contract based - so you may have to port your models to new drawings in this project (cheap, no problem) or someone may have insisted that tooling used to make the tooling be destroyed at end of contract (annoying). Those aren't really hypotheticals - I worked for one tier 1 who spent time and effort looking for production cost savings, and the prime expected to be handed a percentage of those cost savings. So the prime can be rather overbearing regardless of whether they are a corporate or government entity.
I am starting to think that several of the illnesses that affect the Western industry are not so widely spread or at least so out of control in the Russian state run MIC. That is a key to them actually getting things done at a low fraction of the cost we would expect them to have, they seem to be much more oriented to productive economy, they still have relatively many managers which actually know what they are talking about and so on. If they pull off a program like this one with success and meet their target price it would be frankly impressive, I will be keeping an eye on the process indeed.

Looking forward...for those parts which are not directly derived from the Su-57 program, do we think we can expect some change? It appears the Su-57 had a nose structure update, so can we see that moving over to checkmate too? What could a production representative checkmate look like?
I am not aware of any modification in the nose for the Su-57, there was one weird radome seen at the production line but it never seemed to be a real part and the first serial was essentially identical to the prototypes.

1. Update to serial production Su-57 components - biggest change would appear to be the forward fuselage?
2. Perhaps 1. would lead to minor changes to the intake?
As said above, I see no significant changes in the serial Su-57 compared to late prototypes like 10 an 11.

3. Losing the central strake in the intake
Shouldn't that act as a reinforcement of that structure? The nose landing gear seems heavy duty indeed, I can imagine the supporting structure needs to be up to the task. Maybe a potential naval version (even compatible with cat launching) would need indeed that area to be very robust.

4. Potentially auxiliary intakes to reduce FOD issues
The intake being in front of the wheels, what FOD issues would you find concerning?

5. Fairing in of the main bay with the fuselage sides - lose the step?
Not sure I got that one...
In general, I am under the impression that the design should be pretty much final, of course I expect some small refinements but nothing very substantial. One they have come to this point, I can imagine they have done a lot of optimization already.

What I definitively don't exclude is the VKS demanding several modifications in order to buy the plane. To me izd. 30 will be requested almost for sure and it should allow a fully 9 g cleared airframe with internal gun. Maybe even some foreplanes are adopted later, for a naval version or to improve a future supercruising capability they would make sense, and for a Sukhoi they would be hardly surprising.
 
1. I may be wrong, but the nose on the Checkmate doesn't look quite like the nose on the Su-57 to my eyes. The profile looks a little more rounded overall and the side profile doesn't seem to turn up at the front like the Su-57s seems to. I don't think I've seen it, but has Paralay, or anyone else, overlaid the checkmate on the Su-57, aligned at the tip of the nose to see if there are any differences? There was mention that that this checkmate used parts from an early static test or engineering demonstrator Su-57 so there may be differences compared to the latest Su-57 airframes. That was the point I was trying to make - what will checkmate look like with production Su-57 forward fuselage structure - exactly like this or slightly different?
Yeah, the nose is definitely different. I think it makes sense, considering the position of the intake and the mutual influence of both structures. I have not seen any Su-57 with a different nose, beyond as said one production plane which carried what seemed to be some temporary cover. Also no real change in the nose cone from T50-1 to the series. The nose of the LTS seems a bit narrower and the profile shows a more marked curvature at the top of the nose than at the bottom. I would risk saying the vision angle over the nose is a bit more restricted in the LTS. Paralay's nose cone is not 100% exact, it seems as he took that from the F-22.

3. The vertical strake doesn't reinforce that structure against landing loads. If anything its a purely aerodynamic feature aimed at flow straightening. All nose landing gear loads are directed in to the frames of the main structure rather than in to skins, at least initially. The strake seems to have a profile rather than being a flat plate, so I wondered if this was doing useful work in managing flow in to the inlet. It seems a little odd to need it.
I believe the F-16 had a strut in similar position to provide additional rigidity to the intake tunnel, I don't know if it was going to help with landing loads, but apparently the tunnel did expand and contract due to pressure changes around that strut. I would not see it helping airflow, rather introducing further disturbance and a boundary layer in the middle of the intake, but maybe I am wrong. The Eurofighter also has one, I am not sure why.

4. Ingestion of FOD isn't particularly limited to what's kicked up by the nose wheel - there will be a low pressure region in front of the intake which has the potential to 'hoover' up everything in its path. We've seen in the past significant steps taken to protect against this in Sukhoi and MiG designs presumably to meet an operational requirement. Will we see this again in the checkmate?
I would think this is uncritical, as you say the mesh it is not even present in the Su-57, and there I see real ingestion risk, and the new versions of the MiG-29 also don't have the dorsal intakes. No Western planes bother with that either...

5. For want of a better word, Checkmate has a slightly 'pregnant' look when seen from underneath. Maybe we might see the ventral bay faired a little better in the production version...
Now I see what you mean. The bay both in the Su-57 and LTS is remarkably big and regular, I think this is some kind of "out of bounds" structure in the plane that needs to be respected to provide more freedom to the weapons designers to work. Carrying missiles like Kh-69 has a price I guess, the rest of the aircraft will need to provide for the required area ruling somehow. Nevertheless that picture has a strong perspective effect, I think a proper plan view from below would should a rather slender fuselage, that was definitely the idea when they chose that layout instead of parallel bays at the sides of the engine as in the F-35.

Again, I'll state that I would think that this aircraft isn't quite the final shape to maintain some secrecy of the more interesting features to specialists for a bit longer.
It maybe is, but even if not, I see enough secrecy in the empty weight of this plane, since the structure and capabilities of an izd. 30 equipped domestic version for the VKS may differ significantly from the export specs that we have seen. I think that the fuselage is quite big for the propulsion available for export, so that may have been a strong design constraint. Russians never state such value if you notice.
 
Coanda,
It's fairly clear to see that this is a first article - for engineering development and display. Nothing wrong with that!

Using as many Su-57 parts as possible is the right way forward. Leveraging that previous investment in design, tech and manufacturing is paramount in making this aircraft 'affordable'.

The more assemblies and tooling you use from already existing and paid for products and processes the lower your upfront setup and long lead item costs.
The problem with that is that you're using parts and sub-assemblies sized, optimised and stressed for a heavy, twin-engined fighter for what's meant to be a lightweight single engined tactical fighter.

When Teddy Petter created the Gnat, he did not start out by using the outer wing panels from a flaming Javelin.

You couldn't create a useful lightweight fighter from the nose, fins and wing of an F-15. And even if we could, it would be vastly inferior to a purpose designed aircraft.
 
Moreover, the T-7A shows that designing and manufacturing a new airframe design is easy and cheap - the T-7A beat the T-50 on price!
 

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