Sukhoi T-75 LTS (CheckMate)

[helmutkohl]

Why the EOTS is still covered?

totally did not notice the EOTS there the whole time. thought it was just a shadow lol.
i kept wondering why people were referring to the slightly off center wheel

on a related note..I wonder if this aircraft would be more appropriate for a Russian carrier than the Su-57 due to its more compact size.

 

[Dreamfighter]

so which was everyones favorite unveil so far this year? the KF-21 or the Checkmate?
the only major thing remaining is the new Chinese bomber

B-21

Hello time traveller from the future. How was the the B-21 unveiling?

With first flight of B-21 now scheduled for 2022, are you 100% sure B-21 could not be unveiled (somewhat) this year?
(B-2 first flight 17 July 1989, B-2 unveiling 22 November 1988)

Key keyword from original post: "so far this year"

I regard 'B-21' in the reply by trose213 as a reaction to the phrase containing 'only major thing remaining' and 'Chinese bomber', not as a reply to the question about 'the favorite so far'.

 

[Scar]

Personally, I interpret 'unveiling an aircaft' as 'to show the aircraft', and 'a roll-out' to me is 'rolling the aircraft outside the hanger'.
But I might be wrong.

Show such an important aircraft without a show is not the true Murican way of doing business.

File:B-2 Sprirt Rollout - 22 November 1988.jpg - Wikimedia Commons

commons.wikimedia.org

 

[trose213]

I regard 'B-21' in the reply by trose213 as a reaction to the phrase containing 'only major thing remaining' and 'Chinese bomber', not as a reply to the question about 'the favorite so far'.

There's no guarantee the Chinese will actually unveil a bomber and it's not like the individuals speculating about Chinese development haven't been hilariously wrong in the past.

 

[Galvars]

...I think even the ruskies are doing wrong in comparing it to f35. It is truly a light weight stealth fighter.

Indeed. But being the only other single engine new gen plane with at least this mock-up/demonstrator ect. comparing it with F-35 will be natural, wrong but natural. This is a light/medium tactical fighter, F-35 is... strike, medium heavy'ish something. They should rather take the approach of comparing it to F-16, JAS-39 ect. but of new gen.

But it will be as always fight of uncomparable, F-35 is better! No THIS is better! ect.

 

[TMA1]

...I think even the ruskies are doing wrong in comparing it to f35. It is truly a light weight stealth fighter.

Indeed. But being the only other single engine new gen plane with at least this mock-up/demonstrator ect. comparing it with F-35 will be natural, wrong but natural. This is a light/medium tactical fighter, F-35 is... strike, medium heavy'ish something. They should rather take the approach of comparing it to F-16, JAS-39 ect. but of new gen.

But it will be as always fight of uncomparable, F-35 is better! No THIS is better! ect.

Good post fren. Yeah I got a soft spot for the Russian aircraft. They are still about a generation behind in some of their kit but they sure are bringing their best and it is pretty damn awesome to see. With the new engine, uppowered GaAs modules for their radar arrays, qwip electro optical sensors, upgrades in their weaponry, in stealth tech, etc, this new fighter is looking to be pretty awesome. Luckily we still have the edge. We rested on our laurels tho I think so we absolutely must re-establish our total overmatch.

 

[TomcatViP]

Why the EOTS is still covered?

totally did not notice the EOTS there the whole time. thought it was just a shadow lol.
i kept wondering why people were referring to the slightly off center wheel

on a related note..I wonder if this aircraft would be more appropriate for a Russian carrier than the Su-57 due to its more compact size.

And the wing tips are probably removeable (and/or actuated).
I think that's why they went with a somewhat delta wing.

 

[tequilashooter]

So this confirmed on size yet? https://naukatehnika.com/russkij-f-35-kakim-budet-novyij-samolyot-«suxogo».html

Judging by the shape of the nose, behind it is a radar similar to that on the Su-57, which hides an elongated radio-transparent dome. Recall, the PAK-FA received a radar with AESA and 1526 receiving and transmitting modules. Also on the layout is visible optical-electronic complex, which can also repeat the decisions of the Su-57, equipped with the 101KS "Atoll" system.

 

[Trident]

Nice pair of CGIs from Rostec:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1417589153022283781

View: https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1417589153022283781

 

[helmutkohl]

^ nice! beautiful plane.. i kind of like its looks more than the Su-57 even

if anything I do wish the intake was moved a bit further back
like this (sorry for the crude photoshop).



but I understand it cant be done due to the bay and wheel issues

 

[Sundog]

WRT to the 8G rating, because I've seen many people bring this up on various platforms, it's most likely due to it being a mostly tailless fighter. I say mostly, because the canted out vertical tails can still provide some pitch authority, but being mainly a tailless design, it's going to have limited pitch authority compared to a tailed design. I know back in the late 70's early 80's, that was something noted on Northrop tailless designs that used only TV for pitch control. They were generally limited to 7G as a result of limited control power. It wouldn't be any different for this design.

It has the elevators at the sides of the nozzle in the end.
Do you mean, that the existing surfaces are not sufficient to provide 9 g despite being an unstable design and maybe corner speed being higher than in a tailed design?

Those are quite small, so they might operate to trim the aircraft. Or they might be air-brakes just as on the F-16. I've yet to see any evidence either way yet. They definitely don't have a lot of control power, given their area.

 

[UpForce]

Sigh. I almost miss that thread.

Considering I took a couple of looks at that and hightailed out, I can't quite say the same thing but can appreciate the sentiment.

Sadly I stayed longer for this party. Things seemed to evolve from pre-event hyping through giddy cacophony towards decreasing intoxication, associated with at least somewhat incoherent brawling and scuffling. A fairly standard arc of events, then, even down to the DJ/event organizer having all the typical technical and logistic troubles and local authorities showing up to perform some mostly random but ultimately futile and pointless enforcement. The only thing missing, really, was making out with sketchy strangers and Sukhoi really could've arranged for that also by setting up an LTS OnlyFans page (if only to gather the "kompromat" tradition requires of arms fair reps and visiting dignitaries; also, this is not an endorsement and I do not recommend visiting "OnlyFans").

It's early days still but the best write up I've seen yet is by Hush-Kit, by Justin Bronk and Jim'Sonic' Smith:

What we know about Russia’s new ‘Fleabag’ stealth fighter: Sukhoi Checkmate Q&A with RUSI Thinktank’s Justin Bronk & update from Jim ‘Sonic’ Smith

Russia reveals what is described as a prototype of a new fighter aircraft at the MAKS 21 airshow. We caught up with Justin Bronk (Research Fellow at the RUSI think-ta…

hushkit.net

 

[Sundog]

It's a nice looking design, IMHO, but I have trouble believing it can be operated for around $5000 USD/per flight hour or less (1/7 the flight hour cost of an F-35). What will be more interesting is to see who, if anyone, buys it.

 

[tequilashooter]

Considering I took a couple of looks at that and hightailed out, I can't quite say the same thing but can appreciate the sentiment.

Sadly I stayed longer for this party. Things seemed to evolve from pre-event hyping through giddy cacophony towards decreasing intoxication, associated with at least somewhat incoherent brawling and scuffling. A fairly standard arc of events, then, even down to the DJ/event organizer having all the typical technical and logistic troubles and local authorities showing up to perform some mostly random but ultimately futile and pointless enforcement. The only thing missing, really, was making out with sketchy strangers and Sukhoi really could've arranged for that also by setting up an LTS OnlyFans page (if only to gather the "kompromat" tradition requires of arms fair reps and visiting dignitaries; also, this is not an endorsement and I do not recommend visiting "OnlyFans").

It's early days still but the best write up I've seen yet is by Hush-Kit, by Justin Bronk and Jim'Sonic' Smith:

Darn I was hoping for information as to weapons comparisons between both aircrafts, radar dome sizes with specs, engine capabilities, fuel maintenance costs, production order numbers almost the same information I get from the drivel(the drive). Never mind I just found out its a cope blog and not an article.

 

[Sundog]

Sigh. I almost miss that thread.

It's early days still but the best write up I've seen yet is by Hush-Kit, by Justin Bronk and Jim'Sonic' Smith:

What we know about Russia’s new ‘Fleabag’ stealth fighter: Sukhoi Checkmate Q&A with RUSI Thinktank’s Justin Bronk & update from Jim ‘Sonic’ Smith

Russia reveals what is described as a prototype of a new fighter aircraft at the MAKS 21 airshow. We caught up with Justin Bronk (Research Fellow at the RUSI think-ta…

hushkit.net

It's not a bad write up, but it has some contradictions and glaring errors.

 

[kaiserbill]

Justin Bronk.
He basically, in my experience, does subtle and not so subtle hit pieces on a country beginning with an "R".

 

[Avimimus]

Has anyone seen a comparison between S-70 Okhotnik-B and T-75 LTS?

Outwardly they have a comparable engine, comparable war-loads, comparable weights... but the T-75 is expected to carry a pilot and do more (e.g. higher gee loads and speeds, more sensors) at the cost of lower range. I thought a rigorous comparison of the two would be interesting - maybe even bringing in CFD to estimate the basic aerodynamic efficiency at speeds of both platforms to try to infer if the T-75 needs a larger engine etc.

 

[helmutkohl]

the only two happy 5th gen aircraft

via girchenko twitter

 

[Avimimus]

It's a nice looking design, IMHO, but I have trouble believing it can be operated for around $5000 USD/per flight hour or less (1/7 the flight hour cost of an F-35). What will be more interesting is to see who, if anyone, buys it.

I'll be quite surprised if it doesn't come in more expensive, at a higher weight, and possibly with some avionics features indefinitely postponed... that seems to be almost inevitable when it comes to aircraft development. Given how much low cost and low life-cycle costs are central to the 'pitch' for this aircraft - it'll be interesting to see how much they succeed.

The whole idea of combining 'mig diplomacy' with producing an 'accessible' 5th-ish generation fighter, and bringing in enough funding to help sustain Russia's domestic air defence capacity is an interesting gamble.

This might be the closest we'll see to an 'AK-like' concept applied to fifth generation fighters. I could definitely see some regional arms races - nearby countries being unsettled by their neighbours having procured the JSF, and seeking some kind of counter (both practically, and for reasons of prestige). I can definitely see it being attractive.

All-in-all the claims about logistics and modular avionics are probably the most significant ones.

 

[NamedUser_]

the only two happy 5th gen aircraft

via girchenko twitter

This jet... exudes a smugness I have never seen before. Now there are two of them.

HUE HUE HUE HUE!!

 

[ADC411]

Well, I think we can at least say with confidence that this plane takes the award for "best looking jet aircraft designed in a year".

Seriously, I know they claim to have used "supercomputing technologies" to aid in the design work, but high powered computing and software assistance has been the industry standard for a long time now. The fact that they managed to present a product this far along in development after only a single year is very impressive, even accounting for borrowed technology from it's older sister.

If Sukhoi can actually manage to get this thing flying by the end of 2023, and ready for export before 2027, that would truly be an unprecedented accomplishment for an advanced fighter aircraft in the 21st century. How realistic those timeframe a actually are though, and how much is simply marketing hype, that remains to be seen.

 

[Anduriel]

I have a strong feeling this is not, of course, a real flyer, but not a mockup, in its traditional way, as well. It looks like an eggshell of the real airframe, without any expensive components and systems. After all, first prototypes are always using for static/ground tests. And this may explain why LTS maiden flight is scheduled to 2023.
View attachment 661156

View attachment 661157

Slysar outright said that they would have to finish it before ground tests and first flight after.
Also, @GARGEAN may be right, it does looks like they indeed took parts directly from T50. Maybe they disassembled a burned 055 airframe.
Plus if my eyes don't decieve me, engine control stick is actually two-piece one from T50, despite LFS having only one engine.

Continuous supersonic flight.

Is this meant as supercruise?

View attachment 661153

Likely yes, because continuous AFB supersonic flight is not for light jets, even not for all of heavy ones. The only plane in service for which it is normal is MiG-31, and even then MiG-31 is flying tank and it'e engines specifically made to allow that.
Otherwise it's a wase of fuel and engine lifetime.

It's a nice looking design, IMHO, but I have trouble believing it can be operated for around $5000 USD/per flight hour or less (1/7 the flight hour cost of an F-35). What will be more interesting is to see who, if anyone, buys it.

Yeah, I could believe 15000 (1/2) or even 10000(1/3), but 1/7? That is straight up wishful thinking.

 

[Dr.Snufflebug]

Okay, after the initial hype has settled a bit...

I am a bit disappointed that after this PR operation, all the bold "checkmate" talk and what not what we have is essentially a bunch of re-used PAK-FA components glued together in a new package that while it does look pretty neat still has a less than impressive finish in places. I like the underlying concept behind this machine, but not the presentation.

I can understand the reasoning behind these most of these things, frankly, but those are my initial thoughts. Happy to provoke some backlash.

 

[Anduriel]

Okay, after the initial hype has settled a bit...

I am a bit disappointed that after this PR operation, all the bold "checkmate" talk and what not what we have is essentially a bunch of re-used PAK-FA components glued together in a new package that while it does look pretty neat still has a less than impressive finish in places. I like the underlying concept behind this machine, but not the presentation.

I can understand the reasoning behind these most of these things, frankly, but those are my initial thoughts. Happy to provoke some backlash.

I would say it's a boon, not a disadvantage. If they indeed can use parts of Su-57 wilt little changes as it showed at presentation, it does make dev time significantly faster and lowers overall development and production costs via sheer commonality with already ramping up Su-57 production.
And unfinished KNS is still better then fiberglass mockup.

 

[Bounce]

I was really only hoping for the tail to fold in flight, rest of the my expectations were met and exceeded. Would love to see it in a more western colour scheme however.

 

[GARGEAN]

It's not a bad write up, but it has some contradictions and glaring errors.

It is quite bad, thinktanks and all that shit. But this is overall quality of this blog, so expectable.

 

[tequilashooter]

Okay, after the initial hype has settled a bit...

I am a bit disappointed that after this PR operation, all the bold "checkmate" talk and what not what we have is essentially a bunch of re-used PAK-FA components glued together in a new package that while it does look pretty neat still has a less than impressive finish in places. I like the underlying concept behind this machine, but not the presentation.

I can understand the reasoning behind these most of these things, frankly, but those are my initial thoughts. Happy to provoke some backlash.

I just feel that there should be at least a little more info on it, which I think might or might not be presented this week. Such as where the RWRs placed or info on bands they cover, does it have a tail EW system like the Himalayas or what name is it atleast? is the radar nose size somewhere between the N036 or fga-35 is it using existing or a we have a planned new radar model for it before fly testing it? are the side bays for SRAAM or MRAAMs excluding whats already in the main weapons bay? Hows the MAWS coverage? Will modernization plans from the Su-57 in 2022-2024 get thrown onto this aircraft?

I like that it seems to have a smaller more refined inlet duct than the X-32 along with the feature of no horizontal stabilizers and EOTs seems new, with a cheap proposal for flight costs and buying the aircraft.

 

[totoro]

It's a nice looking design, IMHO, but I have trouble believing it can be operated for around $5000 USD/per flight hour or less (1/7 the flight hour cost of an F-35). What will be more interesting is to see who, if anyone, buys it.

I don't find the 5000 figure per hour necessarily incredible.
35k for f35 is the USAF cost. It includes USAF personnel, working and earning their USAF wages.

5k for LTS might very well be russian user cost. Low wages for everyone, operating the plane. Or any other country with a similar low wage. Of course, if UAE uses it, then the wages would be higher, resulting in higher costs than 5k.

(Smaller) Part of the difference is not just wages but the fact LTS is a low cost plane with lower performance. A budget 5th gen plane. Whereas f35 aims to match f22 in certain regards.

 

[TMA1]

Okay, after the initial hype has settled a bit...

I am a bit disappointed that after this PR operation, all the bold "checkmate" talk and what not what we have is essentially a bunch of re-used PAK-FA components glued together in a new package that while it does look pretty neat still has a less than impressive finish in places. I like the underlying concept behind this machine, but not the presentation.

I can understand the reasoning behind these most of these things, frankly, but those are my initial thoughts. Happy to provoke some backlash.

the opposite for me. I am amazed by the reuse even seemingly of wings and vvertical stabilizers and many other bits. It is extremely clever and it is obvious at this (granted very early) stage of development that it is aerodynamically sound and seemingly functional. Sukhoi isn't full of idiots by any stretch. It is also very lovely. So I totally disagree with you. I think this, with typical flaws along the way, will succeed, and that this was a good first step.

 

[Rolead]

I do hope that Sukhoi and UAC keep us updated with the progress of this aircraft as it seems to be a very important to them as they look at it as being a 'export' item. If Russia commits to buying this aircraft it would kick start the whole program, which would give confidence to other friendly countries.

On the presentation it is a shame that the side weapons bays were not deployed as was seen when the aircraft arrived all wrapped up.

Looking forward to its first flight.

 

[Scar]

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Hmmm...

 

[Anduriel]

I think it's is so because it was quite unexpected but pleasant event. Yes, there were rumors about "something special" at MAKS'21, but they were just rumors, w/o weight.
Then UAC announces a new infinite power source new lithweight plane, and while there were info about it's dedvelopment, no one expected it this fast and that it's not just theoretical work. This raised quite a lot of hype, because, for example, KF-21 program was much more open, so we knew what to expect, unlike LFS situation where we knew almost nothig at all, almost like in Soviet times, when we see new a plane at 7 november parade.

 

[Egor Zverev]

New photo and render

 

[LMFS]

(Smaller) Part of the difference is not just wages but the fact LTS is a low cost plane with lower performance. A budget 5th gen plane. Whereas f35 aims to match f22 in certain regards.

That can be the beginning of a nice narrative... but where do you see the lower performance vs. F-35? They have the idea to make it configurable, but the capacities of the airframe and propulsion are not inferior. The sensors, EW suite and computing are there in theory at least, too. Not clear where the gap is exactly.

 

[jeffb]

Okay, after the initial hype has settled a bit...

I am a bit disappointed that after this PR operation, all the bold "checkmate" talk and what not what we have is essentially a bunch of re-used PAK-FA components glued together in a new package that while it does look pretty neat still has a less than impressive finish in places. I like the underlying concept behind this machine, but not the presentation.

I can understand the reasoning behind these most of these things, frankly, but those are my initial thoughts. Happy to provoke some backlash.

the opposite for me. I am amazed by the reuse even seemingly of wings and vvertical stabilizers and many other bits. It is extremely clever and it is obvious at this (granted very early) stage of development that it is aerodynamically sound and seemingly functional. Sukhoi isn't full of idiots by any stretch. It is also very lovely. So I totally disagree with you. I think this, with typical flaws along the way, will succeed, and that this was a good first step.

It's pretty brilliant I think, assuming it's not some sort of maskirovka. They're using a lot of the PAK-FA production line to now build two aircraft. That offers a lot of advantages in terms of production line training, capacity and redundancy as well as simplifying a lot of their supply chain as well. They've standardized engines, wings, sensors, vertical stabs, cockpits and any number of other doodads under the skin. They get a high-low mix based on re-mixing essentially all the same parts.

We'll have to see how it plays out of course, but it seems like a pretty smart move to me.

 

[Tass]

@

LMFS​

It will have a lower performance in the critical categories of 'Hubris' & 'Chest Beating'

 

[Galvars]

It's pretty brilliant I think, assuming it's not some sort of maskirovka. They're using a lot of the PAK-FA production line to now build two aircraft. That offers a lot of advantages in terms of production line training, capacity and redundancy as well as simplifying a lot of their supply chain as well. They've standardized engines, wings, sensors, vertical stabs, cockpits and any number of other doodads under the skin. They get a high-low mix based on re-mixing essentially all the same parts.

We'll have to see how it plays out of course, but it seems like a pretty smart move to me.

Not to mention it lower the development costs as most are already done. It could be a very solid contender for '29 replacement and looks like Sukhoi invest in to that time and money, with campaign to get government support.

And VVS do need such plane, if it will be truly lower spectrum of production and maintenance cost, deliver at least most of what they presented in show, well clear winner. If MiG will not show even better own design, but with simple models in scale as the only thing they present, I would not put my bets on them.

 

[Egor Zverev]

First day. More photo

 

[totoro]

so which engine is portrayed in the plane/mockup/whatever it is during the presentation?

It has sawtooth edges. Do any of the AL41F1 engines have that?

That one interview with Rostec official said LTS will use first stage engine from su57 program, which made the relatively fast development of the whole plane possible.