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Author Topic: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower  (Read 77157 times)

Offline sferrin

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Re: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower
« Reply #435 on: February 06, 2019, 05:23:43 am »
I wish somebody in Congress would ask about that cancellation

They did actually.

Quote
Additionally, the committee is concerned by the termination of the Torpedo Warning System (TWS),
which addressed a critical capability gap. Accordingly, not later than January 1, 2019,  the committee
directs the Chief of Naval Operations to provide the congressional defense committees with a
report on the specific capability gap or gaps that the TWS was rapidly fielded to address, the
performance of the TWS in addressing such gap or gaps, the warfighting risk that will be accepted
without the TWS deployed, and the Navy’s plans to address the specific capability gap or gaps without
the TWS deployed.

https://budget.dtic.mil/pdfs/FY2019_pdfs/SASC/Procurement_CRPT-115srpt262.pdf

I wonder if they'll make the answer public.  Hopefully it's not, "it was too hard so we quit".   Anything short of "we HAVE something better" is unacceptable.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2019, 05:53:28 am by sferrin »
"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.

Offline bobbymike

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Re: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower
« Reply #436 on: February 07, 2019, 10:51:17 pm »
Books are the quietest and most constant of friends; they are the most accessible and wisest of counselors, and the most patient of teachers.

Charles W. Eliot

Offline marauder2048

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Re: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower
« Reply #437 on: February 08, 2019, 04:35:02 pm »
I wonder if they'll make the answer public.  Hopefully it's not, "it was too hard so we quit".   Anything short of "we HAVE something better" is unacceptable.


https://www.navy.mil/navydata/people/cno/Richardson/Speech/20180307__HACD_DoN_Posture_FY19.pdf


The claim in the testimony was that the false alarm rate was excessive. So it really sounds like they need
an adjust sensor like say towed LIDAR.

Though I'm wondering if they just had the sensitivity jacked up to 11 to detect the slow and quiet threat torpedo types.


Offline sferrin

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Re: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower
« Reply #438 on: February 08, 2019, 09:04:04 pm »
I wonder if they'll make the answer public.  Hopefully it's not, "it was too hard so we quit".   Anything short of "we HAVE something better" is unacceptable.


https://www.navy.mil/navydata/people/cno/Richardson/Speech/20180307__HACD_DoN_Posture_FY19.pdf


The claim in the testimony was that the false alarm rate was excessive. So it really sounds like they need
an adjust sensor like say towed LIDAR.

Though I'm wondering if they just had the sensitivity jacked up to 11 to detect the slow and quiet threat torpedo types.

It does make one wonder if they were able to detect wake-homers buried in all the turbulence. 
"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.

Offline moonbeamsts

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Re: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower
« Reply #439 on: February 09, 2019, 09:34:58 pm »
The problem of the TWS  system is they are trying to eliminate the sonar operator and make it a totally standalone system. They have made progress but are throwing it out due its taking to long , The navy did the same thing with new sonar fire control AnBSY-1 back in the 80"s 90"s.

Offline sferrin

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Re: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower
« Reply #440 on: February 10, 2019, 06:09:32 am »
The problem of the TWS  system is they are trying to eliminate the sonar operator and make it a totally standalone system. They have made progress but are throwing it out due its taking to long ,

Don't worry.  I'm sure it will get done sooner if they do nothing long enough. 
"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.

Offline jsport

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Re: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower
« Reply #441 on: February 10, 2019, 09:07:12 am »
The problem of the TWS  system is they are trying to eliminate the sonar operator and make it a totally standalone system. They have made progress but are throwing it out due its taking to long ,

Don't worry.  I'm sure it will get done sooner if they do nothing long enough.

Always the same... when is anyone held accountable ..contractor-civilian- service.
 When do we hear "your fired" early in a program.
RWRs used have excessive falses, for instance.
Commenters like to say in the modern world things are so complicated it is hard to discern who is culpable. It is funny after somebody gets fired the problem usually finds a way to get fixed.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2019, 09:13:32 am by jsport »

Offline marauder2048

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Re: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower
« Reply #442 on: February 11, 2019, 07:29:32 pm »
The problem of the TWS  system is they are trying to eliminate the sonar operator and make it a totally standalone system. They have made progress but are throwing it out due its taking to long , The navy did the same thing with new sonar fire control AnBSY-1 back in the 80"s 90"s.

Not so unreasonable given that in the more chaotic acoustic environments a human operator will tend towards
false negatives due to task saturation.

Unless at-sea reload is impossible (or a CAT has the range to hit one of the escorts) a
highish false positive rate might be tolerable.

Offline jsport

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Re: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower
« Reply #443 on: February 12, 2019, 10:17:33 am »
If not a multi-spectral synthetic aperture sonar, magnetic anomaly and LIDAR then it will have high falses.

Offline sferrin

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Re: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower
« Reply #444 on: February 12, 2019, 10:42:46 am »
If not a multi-spectral synthetic aperture sonar, magnetic anomaly and LIDAR then it will have high falses.

Would any of those work in a wake-homer situation.  Where you have a lot of bubbles mixed in with the water, for a significant distance, it would seem to be a perfect place for such a torpedo to hide as it's sneaking up.  The MAD might work (if the torp wasn't degaussed) but I don't see how either of the other two could penetrate the wake.
"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.

Offline jsport

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Re: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower
« Reply #445 on: February 12, 2019, 06:15:08 pm »
If not a multi-spectral synthetic aperture sonar, magnetic anomaly and LIDAR then it will have high falses.

Would any of those work in a wake-homer situation.  Where you have a lot of bubbles mixed in with the water, for a significant distance, it would seem to be a perfect place for such a torpedo to hide as it's sneaking up.  The MAD might work (if the torp wasn't degaussed) but I don't see how either of the other two could penetrate the wake.


Are not all these Sensors change detection sensors and wakes sure cause sized quantifiable change.

Offline marauder2048

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Re: Navy Seeks Rail Guns, Lasers, Cruise Missiles To Improve Pacific Firepower
« Reply #446 on: February 13, 2019, 01:23:42 pm »
Would any of those work in a wake-homer situation.  Where you have a lot of bubbles mixed in with the water, for a significant distance, it would seem to be a perfect place for such a torpedo to hide as it's sneaking up.  The MAD might work (if the torp wasn't degaussed) but I don't see how either of the other two could penetrate the wake.

Aren't the towed arrays typically towed at depths below (and maybe beyond) the wake?