Douglas DC-4 Bomber developments

Schneiderman said:
Interesting. Given the large number of archives in the country, and the variable ease of access to these, it will be a task of epic proportion. I wish whoever is leading this the very best of luck and they have my full support, for what it is worth. I am a volunteer at the Royal Aero Club Trust archive which contains a significant amount of material relating to aircraft and projects unrelated to the Club and I am slowly drawing this together in a catalogue, of sorts.
Click to expand...
My assumption is that it will be for the smaller and independent collections and perhaps where some the larger 'national' archives can deposit things. Air Britain for example is involved, they have a ton of stuff it seems but no real archive as such that is regularly accessible. I can't see BAE Systems for example consolidating all their material yet, though I suspect in the long-term it might prove difficult to keep several sites going. If Leonardo ever closes Yeovil then the Westland/Fairey material would need a place to go, so some future proofing would be sensible. Whether it can happen on an achievable timescale and effort who knows? Getting more collections onto the TNA's Discovery catelogue (as some of Aerospace Bristol's are) would be a welcome start.
 
I guess one of the biggest stumbling blocks is that many use access to their archive material as a useful source of income, and hence will be loath to give that up
 
Above illustrations created by and copyrighted to me, Alan Griffith. Probably not a bad idea to mention that when posting one's own or someone else's work.

That said, I'd love to see someone build a model of either of those projects. I've created 1/72-size drawings of the Model 412 if there is anyone out there who wants to give it a shot.

AlanG
 
OK my dear Antonio,

but from this magazine,someone sent a drawings from it during the last years,and no one object,alright
if you want to delete it no problem.
 
Antonio, thank you for the offer, but the size of the reproductions are such that not much can be obtained from them. Just leave them up.

Hesham, can you post a link to the drawings to which you refer? Were they drawings from my articles? I suppose it is even possible that I posted some earlier drawings, but the article was submitted long enough ago that I don't recall doing so. And Hesham, if someone else DID post drawings/photos/etc. from a publication earlier does NOT give blanket permission for anyone else to. I would be especially cautious posting items from a publication that is relatively recent (say the past 24 months or so) and is available in back issues from the publisher as you are possibly violating the publication's copyright, the artist's copyright and could be costing the publication sales that help pay guys like me who dig this stuff up.

AlanG
 
At first,sorry my dear Alan,

I didn't know they were from you,and for the link,it was from The Aviation Historian No.28 itself.
 
Wile reading the excellent article by Allan G in TAH No 28 I saw that the sideview of the
Douglas DS-300B was strongly looking like that of the so called Douglas 100ton bomber project.
Was there any relation between these designs ?
 
Lark, there may be. While I've gathered up as many images of the so-called 100ton bomber project from online that I could, to date I've found absolutely no official (military or corporate) documentation referring to such a project. I suspect it was an idea run wild in the press of the time, built upon an imaginative envisioning of the DC-4E and the actual bomber version proposal.

Glad you like my article!

AlanG
 
Allan , Your article in TAH 28 was indeed one of the better...

I found the drawing and info in the Dutch prè WW II magazine 'Vliegwereld '-free translated as Flying World.
(magazine collection of the military library Brussels)
This magazine was often well informed for the time and it took over information from foreign publications.

With the 3 view was this bit of info.

Machine sould have 6 Wright double row Cyclone engines total Hp 12.000
Span :75 m.
lenght :55 m.
speed at sea level : 320km/h
speed at 7500m. : 485km/h
bombload : 20.000kg
range :9.600km

from the Dutch text : schetces show the influence of the DC-4 .

Later DC-4E. There was also a sideview showing the interior of the proposed 100 ton bomber.

Perhaps this info is usefull for you....
 
Lark, thank you for both your kind words and the information you shared.

Would it be possible for you to email me the drawings and information to which you refer? I'd love to see it. It will also give some more ammunition with which to approach the Douglas Archivists. Having said that and gathered what I think are all the appropriate bomber contest specifications, etc. for heavy bombers in the late 1930's and early 1940's, I'm still having a very hard time seeing this as anything more than a wonderful and imaginative creation with little basis in real facts. It occurs to me that it could be a "project" created for discussion to throw off both domestic and foreign competitors.

I look forward to being wrong!

Alan
 
ACResearcher and Lark, thanks for sharing interestion information!
Looks, like Douglas company always trying to implement bombing capabilities to their "DC" series of airliners.
Altough, most of them remains as projects or prototypes.

Famous Disney's movie "Victory through Air Power" contains small fragment, demonstrating Douglas XB-19 (in comparison with Wright "Flyer").
Narrator mentioned, that in 1943 this "experimental bomber" has been a 7-years-ago-built "forerunner" of much modern heavy bombers.
I think, that movie correctly demonstrate public' impressions on the Douglas bomber.

- on time 22:44. Sorry, YouTube prevents posting the link correctly

XB-19.jpg
 
No problem ACR ,
Send me a P.M with your E-mail address.

L.
 
bit more...

Douglas aimed far higher ../.. the desgn team at Santa Monica - led by Sky (real name Schuyler) Kleinhans
later important on post-war DC-7 and 8 -planned the biggest aeroplane in the world ,with designation XBLR-2.
It was to have ' six engines of no less than 2000hp each ' and it was expected that these should be available
ready for first flight not later than 1939...

found in : Giants of the Sky ,Bill Gunston, PSL 1991 UK ( page 159)
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Both of airman's references above are either written by me or reviews of articles written by me. If you're interested in the whole story, might just be easier to order a copy Aviation Historian Issue 28 from Kalmbach/FInescale.

Alang
 
ACResearcher said:
Both of airman's references above are either written by me or reviews of articles written by me. If you're interested in the whole story, might just be easier to order a copy Aviation Historian Issue 28 from Kalmbach/FInescale.

Alang
Click to expand...
i am interested to a digital copy instead printed (copy). :)
 
Maybe this can help...

In March 1938 the Boeing model 316 and Douglas DB-4 were offered as
four engined longrange bomber projects with tricycle landing gear.

The Douglas ship, based on the DC-4 transport was to weight 71.000 gross , have
a crew of 9 and six .50 caliber guns in four powered turrets and
two waist portals.

Estimated performence included 260 mph at 15.000 ft and 4000 miles range with 4500 lb of bombs, and
1000 miles wit 20.000 lbs of bombs.....

So far : Ray Wagner in ' American Combat Planes '
Revised edition. Doubleday New York 1968. page 113
 
Lark,

Given the date (1938) of these offerings I assume (am pretty sure) the DC-4 referenced here was the original DC-4 which became the DC-4E. Is that correct?

I believe I have documents analyzing these entries, but I will have to do some major digging to make sure.

Regards,

AlanG
 
Schneiderman said:
In 1939 the DC-4 was also suggested as a suitable lower component for a civil Mayo composite aircraft carrying a new high-speed, long distance, upper component aircraft of 32,000lb gross weight. Although not specified in the note military application would have been considered too, Mayo made many such proposals around this time.
Click to expand...
Sorry, it was the DC-4E or the later DC-4?
 
Antonio said:
Sorry, it was the DC-4E or the later DC-4?
Click to expand...
Pre-war mentions of a "DC-4" always refer to the large three-fin prototype that was later known as the DC-4E.
That is the plan from which bomber variants were drafted.
I have never heard of any bomber derivatives of the DC-4 airliner we all know.
 

Similar threads

Please donate to support the forum.

Back
Top Bottom