Rolls Royce Griffon 130

JFC Fuller

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Seems to be the ultimate evolution of the Griffon intended for fighters; rated at 2,420hp, over 2,000hp at 20,000ft- would have driven a contra-prop and probably would have made it into further evolutions of the Spiteful/Seafang


This 3 page flight article is pretty good: http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1946/1946%20-%200062.html
 

tartle

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As far as I have found out in researches so far the 101 never flew.. but I like to think it would have made the Seafang Mk 32 that flew with the Griffon 89 even livelier!
 

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JFC Fuller

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My understanding was that the 101 did in fact power at least one, if not two, Spitefuls but the variants after that, through to the 130, never flew?
 

tartle

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Two aircraft had griffon 101s -RB516 and 518.. I think 518 was the fast one which is referred to in this ad (attached below).
Flight reported a few weeks later in their 6th June edition:

"P0SSIBLY due to security restrictions in force at the time,
the attainment by a Thunderbolt of over 500 m.p.h. in
level flight, as long ago as August 4th, 1944, was not widely
reported. The absence of publicity subsequently led to more
than one manufacturer claiming to have built "the fastest
piston-engined fighter in the world," though the speeds quoted
were less than that of the Thunderbolt. Thus, in perfect good
faith, Vickers-Supermarine announced a few months back that
the Spiteful XVI was the fastest piston-engined machine extant,
having attained 494 m.p.h. at 28,500ft during official
A. and A.E.E. trials. The engine was a Rolls-Royce Griffon
101 with a three-speed blower."
It would be useful to locate the original trials report to see if we can estimate the effect of contra props, and the boost levels used- probably 25lb/sq in., etc.
 

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Spark

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Hi S,

Good find, thanks, interesting thought the Fairey P24 Monarch (Ford America proposal ) with screws less mass and double the power at 35,000ft, about the same at 20,000ft.
giving comfortable 500mph plus at altitude and I would guess similar comfortable 500mph for MB5 and Fury.

sealordlawrence said:
Seems to be the ultimate evolution of the Griffon intended for fighters; rated at 2,420hp, over 2,000hp at 20,000ft- would have driven a contra-prop and probably would have made it into further evolutions of the Spiteful/Seafang


This 3 page flight article is pretty good: http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1946/1946%20-%200062.html
 

tartle

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I have a copy of the P24 spec for the moderately supercharged engine:
Summarising it specifies
rated power: 1,500 bhp @ 2,600 rpm
max Take off power: 1,540 bhp @ 2,300 rpm
rated altitude: 9,500 feet
normal rpm: 2,600 rpm not normally exceeded for continuous cruising at any altitude.
max permissible rpm: 3,000 not to be used for more 5 minutes consecutive running.
diving rpm: 3,150 rpm at not more than 1/3rd throttle opening.
max permissible boost: +3 lbs/sq in.(for not more than 5 mins)
rated boost: +2lbs/sq in.
fuel: DTD 230 [ I think is 87 octane]
bore: 5.25"
stroke: 6.0"
capacity: 3118 cu. in (51 litre)

The flight engine rating data is:
rated altitude: 10,000ft
rated boost: +1/2 lb/sq in
max permissible boost: +3 lb/sq in
normal rpm: 2,400
take off rpm: 2,
bhp @ 2,400 rpm @ 10,000 ft - 1,275
bhp @ 2,750 rpm @ 10,000 ft - 1,425
bhp @ 2,130 rpm @ +3 lb/sq in boost - 1,300

-------------------
A G Forsythe refers to 5 hours running at 2,000 to 2,300 bhp and 20 hours at 2,000 to 2,100 bhp.; I guess these must be the results from test bed running at high boost and/or 100 octane fuel.

In 'Rod' Banks book ' I kept no Diary' he refers to " Fairey's [D12] initiative stirred things up and one result was the Rolls-Royce Kestrel..... Later put in hand the design of a vertical H type, liquid-cooled, poppet valve, double crankshaft (unconnected) engine, each shaft driving one half of a contra-rotating propeller - rather on the lines of the Zerbi Fiat racing engine. Graham Forsythe had the design responsibility and engineering development of this 1,800 bhp engine, the Prince, and I helped him with advice on valve and piston design. But the engine received no support from the Air Ministry, perhaps rightly so in view of the number of engine manufacturers already existing, though in my opinion, it had the makings of a reliable high-power unit."
 

tartle

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In an article by A Harvey-Bailey, W Smith and M Houston they write of the three-speed Griffon:

"The final version of the two-stage Griffon was the RG3SML, which featured a three-speed supercharger having a first stage impeller of 14.3 in diameter, second stage of 12.25 in diameter and gear ratios of 5.752 (LS), 6.735 (MS) and 7.7 (FS). This engine was proposed for several applications under consideration at that time, for example the Martin Baker MB5 (Griffon 103, single rotation 0.451 ratio), Spitfire Mark 24 (Griffon 101 and 102, single rotation 0.451 ratio, Griffon 105, single rotation 0.51 ratio and Griffon 121, contra-rotating 0.4423 ratio) and Hawker F2/30 (Griffon 130, contra-rotating 0.4423 ratio), but none of these projects went ahead. Just prior to the end of the war, Supermarine were developing an improved version of the Spitfire to Air Ministry Specification F1/43 named the Spiteful, featuring a laminar flow wing, wider track undercarriage, and improved visibility for the pilot. The engine for this aircraft was originally the Griffon 70, a two-stage two-speed variant similar to the 60 series Griffon, but some of the seventeen aircraft built were fitted with the Griffon 101. In March 1949 the Spiteful prototype, powered by a Griffon 121, flew at the record speed for a piston engined aircraft of 494 mph. Development of the aircraft was overtaken by the arrival of the jet age and the RG3SML never saw active service. The laminar flow wing of the Naval version of the Spiteful (the Seafang), however, entered service on the Supermarine Attacker, the first Fleet Air Arm carrier borne jet fighter, powered by the Rolls-Royce Nene." and added "The Griffon 121 powered Spiteful achieved 494 mph in level flight, while the Griffon 66 powered Spitfire XIX achieved Mach 0.92 (620 mph) in a dive."
 
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