Reacting to ET

uk 75

ACCESS: Above Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
27 September 2006
Messages
5,743
Reaction score
5,607
The generally pathetic and belated attempts of world governments to cope with Covid 19 and lack of cooperation or unity between them made me wonder, reading other threads, how they would cope with the news that an alien artifact was on its way to Earth showing signs of containing intelligent life?
 
Entirely too little information to make any sort of judgement. Is the thing visible to everybody, or only those with the most powerful scopes? Is it under power? Is it broadcasting? Is it trying to be seen, does it look like it doesn't care, does it look like it's hiding? Does it look like it's mere presence is an existential threat, such as a planetary mass heading into the inner solar system? Does it look like comprehensible tech such as a solar sail, or does it look like magic-tech?
 
Secretary of State from AAEG (Alien Advisory Experts Group)
Object has only been reported visually by Hubble and key observatories on Earth.
Emissions are being logged by Earth installations
No source of power or heat has been identified but configuration suggests artificial rather than natural origin.
Size and mass correspond to that of a Nimitz class aircraft carrier. Object is spear shaped.
Arrival on present course and trajectory in Earthspace is two weeks, but object has changed these twice, once to orbit Jupiter.
(best I can do off the top of my head-anyone else have a go?)
 
Last edited:
I think of the possibility of former visitors from our world leaving behind some spy devices, if so, where could they be?

Our planet it is not a good place to hide an alien artifact, the Earth's surface, the sea and the atmosphere are in continuous motion with earthquakes, hurricanes and tsunamis. Nothing remains unchanged for a long time under the erosion caused by wind, or the corrosive action of oxygen.

The geological processes of erosion and sedimentation make impact craters disappear in a few millennia and Earth has received more impacts than the Moon.

Few places escape the activity of mountaineers, divers, geologists, paleontologists, drilling engineers or construction equipment.

Some shrines may remain unchanged for centuries, but they can also be destroyed by a rival religion, or by war.

A fixed facility can only monitor a small part of our civilization, but if it were on the visible face of the Moon it could scan the entire planet as it rotates.

It would also be exposed to meteorite impacts, as it lacks mobility it should be protected by a force field that could end up being detected by future technology.

It could be below the surface, with some sensors installed on the outside, but it would still be vulnerable to a lunar earthquake caused by a close impact.

Orbiting around Earth or the Moon the object could be detected by optical telescopes looking for exoplanets, by plugging the light of the stars in its path, or by colliding with remains of satellites.

Some position in space, named Lagrange Points, might constitute convenient parking places for automated alien probes.

The Earth-Sun gravitational system had five Lagrange Points, labelled L1 to L5, where the gravitational forces produced enhanced regions of attraction and repulsion that can be used by spacecraft to maintain its position without using any kind of propulsion.

The Earth-Moon system also had two Lagrange Points that have been investigated since 1956 by means of telescopes, infrared seekers, radar beams and two space probes, without finding anything but large concentration of cosmic dust.

The Earth-Sun points L1 and L2 have also been investigated by 17 space probes with the same results.

L4 and L5 are in the same orbit as Earth in fixed positions within a 60 degree arc ahead and behind the planet, are the most stable sites but they are too far away and have not yet been investigated.

L3 is always on the other side of the sun with respect to Earth and there is no point in looking there.

In my opinion, if there is an alien probe, it should orbit around the Sun and be equipped with a force field, to protect against micro-meteorites, a propulsion system to dodge the larger ones, long-range sensors based on undetectable technology for our radio telescopes and an FTL communication system to inform its base in real time, it would not make sense to use the radio to send messages hundreds of light years away, which could be detected by us.

If there is an FTL device out there it would be worth any effort to try to examine it, but it will be difficult to find it in the vastness that surrounds us.

There are three possible orbital configurations to look for: it could be in a very elongated elliptical orbit that allows you to visit the inner Solar System from time to time, as Comet Halley does, scan us for a few months to assess our evolution and return to deep space, it could be in a circular orbit within the inner Solar System and continuously evaluate us or in the outer Solar System approaching Earth only to study some interesting events, from an alien point of view.

They should be orbits perpendicular to the plane of the System to avoid impacts as much as possible. There are three regions relatively free of space objects: the area between the orbits of Venus and Earth, the one between Earth and Mars and the one between Saturn and Uranus.

Our most advanced optical systems can only locate objects larger than one kilometer but the object we should look for can be irregularly shaped, a size between a suitcase and a car, matt black surface, zero infrared emissions and stealth characteristics.

Perhaps the alien probe will discover its position when maneuvering to change orbit or to dodge an impact, or maybe we can detect the radiation emitted by its force field when it is hit by a rain meteorite as it crosses the trajectory of an ancient comet.

If we finally achieve reliable detection, it would be necessary to send a manned spaceship to investigate, but with the technology available, which does not even allow us to reach Mars, the journey could last for years.

We need to improve ionic propulsion, radiation protection and design some system that generates artificial gravity by rotation.

If all this were achieved, it must be noted that the alien probe detected the approach of our ship.

These four scenarios may occur: that you take an evasive action, initiate an attack, do nothing, or be scheduled to initiate a contact. Perhaps by demonstrating that we can locate her and go out to meet her, we will pass the test required by ET to enter the club of advanced civilizations.

In the third case I would have to try as aggressive a means of approach as possible, I think of a small robot with a transparent coating that says, 'I'm not hiding a gun.'

It should be parked halfway between the two ships issuing messages at all frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum, except for the X-Rays frequency because it could be interpreted as an attack.

And then, waiting as long as it takes, we should not start a war that we cannot win by a misunderstanding, nor claim sovereignty over a Solar System that we cannot defend.

Only if after a reasonable time did the alien probe to continue without react would it be possible to insert it into the ship in order to study it.

It is doubtful that we could disassemble it without breaking something, possibly only a compact circuit integrated into a protective coating. A superior technology did not use screws, it could be limited to print-layering any artifact.

But the only sure thing about ET is that to get to us you will have used FTL technology and knowing that it is possible would also cause chaos among scientific stablishment. That might be a good reason why they don't officially announce their existence and just study us as we do with abyssal wildlife.

Bathyscape-UFO?
 
Last edited:
We wouldn't quite be starting from first principles in working out what to do, NASA covered it in part of the Brookings Report in 1960 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brookings_Report) and the International Academy of Astronautics published its SETI Declaration of Principles in 1989, though that's primarily focused on interstellar detection (https://iaaseti.org/en/declaration-principles-concerning-activities-following-detection/).

See also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-detection_policy

SETI Declaration of Principles:
  • International consultations should be initiated to consider the question of sending communications to extraterrestrial civilizations.
  • Consultations on whether a message should be sent, and its content, should take place within the Committee on the Peaceful Uses of Outer Space of the United Nations and within other governmental and non-governmental organizations, and should accommodate participation by qualified, interested groups that can contribute constructively to these consultations.
  • These consultations should be open to participation by all interested States and should be intended to lead to recommendations reflecting a consensus.
  • The United Nations General Assembly should consider making the decision on whether or not to send a message to extraterrestrial intelligence, and on what the content of that message should be, based on recommendations from the Committee on the Peaceful Uses of Outer Space and from governmental and non-governmental organizations.
  • If a decision is made to send a message to extraterrestrial intelligence, it should be sent on behalf of all Humankind, rather than from individual States.
  • The content of such a message should reflect a careful concern for the broad interests and wellbeing of Humanity, and should be made available to the public in advance of transmission.
  • As the sending of a communication to extraterrestrial intelligence could lead to an exchange of communications separated by many years, consideration should be given to a long-term institutional framework for such communications.
  • No communication to extraterrestrial intelligence should be sent by any State until appropriate international consultations have taken place. States should not cooperate with attempts to communicate with extraterrestrial intelligence that do not conform to the principles of this Declaration.
  • In their deliberations on these questions, States participating in this Declaration and United Nations bodies should draw on the expertise of scientists, scholars, and other persons with relevant knowledge.
 
No communication to extraterrestrial intelligence should be sent by any State until appropriate international consultations have taken place. States should not cooperate with attempts to communicate with extraterrestrial intelligence that do not conform to the principles of this Declaration.
And private yahoos taking it upon their "fundamental right to express themselves" shoud be allowed to run amok for decades ?
 
No communication to extraterrestrial intelligence should be sent by any State until appropriate international consultations have taken place. States should not cooperate with attempts to communicate with extraterrestrial intelligence that do not conform to the principles of this Declaration.
And private yahoos taking it upon their "fundamental right to express themselves" shoud be allowed to run amok for decades ?
God, no. But that's not the kind of argument an international body can make if it wants to get the US on board without rattling the cage of the 1st Amendment trolls.
 
And how exactly do you prevent "private yahoos" from talking to the flying saucer that lands in their pasture? Or if a SpaceX asteroid mining craft 40 years from now stumbles across an ancient communications node on some rock?
 
If they landed in our pastures, then they have already found us. Not the point discussed.
The yahoos who run amok and endanger us are those who do METI, send Arecibo messages, and the like.
 
If they landed in our pastures, then they have already found us. Not the point discussed.
The yahoos who run amok and endanger us are those who do METI, send Arecibo messages, and the like.

We have been sending messages to extraterrestrial civilisations ever since the very first radio stations started broadcasting in the early twentieth century, so any extraterrestrial civilisation that is within range of the first radio signal will be hearing us loud and clear if they have the appropriate equipment.
 
Hopefully any life capable of scooting around interstellar space/time that did notice us decided that trying to talk to a bunch of urchins scuttling around the bottom of a nitrogen/oxygen/hydrogen sea is really a waste of time and likely don't taste good anyway.
 
They may swim in liquid methane oceans, breathe a mixture of chlorine and ammonia, see the heat, communicate by means of luminous pulses, or develop senses that we cannot understand such as telepathy, very useful in small Gestalt organisms such as colonies of insects with a powerful collective mind.

They could be like gigantic jellyfish floating in the toxic atmosphere of their world, or worm-like beings carrying an incomprehensible underground existence, or aquatic creatures that have evolved into an ocean-planet, with no possibility of access to fire, metals and technology but with great abstract intelligence and interesting musical culture.

They may live in space cities, away from the inconveniences of a planetary surface with earthquakes, volcanoes, hurricanes, tsunamis and problems with local wildlife, or simply live in the interstellar space feeding on ionising radiation.

A very advanced society can achieve immortality by transferring the personality and memory of its individuals to eternally self-repairable quantum devices, as time crystals or spheres of energy.

In that case they would prefer to inhabit the cold outer regions of the galaxy and even intergalactic space, away from stellar disturbances, supernovae and gravitational waves, which could cause interference in their computer systems.

They may despise societies made up of biological organisms and avoid any contact, as we do with mites. Why would those higher entities bother to establish a communication with us? what could we tell them?
 
They may despise societies made up of biological organisms and avoid any contact, as we do with mites. Why would those higher entities bother to establish a communication with us? what could we tell them?

Curiosity. Any civilization that managed to master space travel must be similar to us in curiosity; desire to knew more, to find what's on the next star.
 
Alien life is very possible due to the abundant variety of amino acids found by radio astronomers in interstellar clouds.

Intelligent alien life is statistically probable (Frank Drake equation).

Intelligent alien life interested in interstellar travel is less probable. It would have to be an energy rich culture, with the curiosity of a young civilization (in ours, it only lasted 40 years) or with the conquest spirit of some mad individuals. Difficult that all these factors coincide in the same society.

Chronologically speaking, it is not very probable that two civilizations evolve at the same time and are ready for contact. A few thousand years are not much for a galaxy and a too long period for the UN, NATO or the Roman Empire.

There's the theory of cyclical history as proposed by Oswald Spengler (and developed in fiction by A.E. van Vogt, Robert A. Heinlein and Isaac Asimov). According to that theory, a civilization can be ‘young’ and even barbaric, and yet high-tech, since civilizations comes and goes, though most of the technological progress done by the previous civilizations aren't forgotten.

There is the widespread belief that such an extraterrestrial technologically advanced civilization should not be aggressive, but even so they can do us a lot of harm.

It would be unbearable for us to feel we are treated with the same patronizing attitude we deploy towards dolphins and chimpanzees. Just that feeling could destroy our societies, and their opinions on racism, democracy, religion or monarchy might encourage sympathizers and imitators to end the system.

They might not be so benevolent and not consider reprehensible the collection of biological samples, including us, or that they do not like what they find here and decide to exterminate us as we do instinctively with insects (many legs and hairy appearance) without considering whether it is a dangerous species or not.

They may simply consider us proteins (the intelligence of cephalopods, cetaceans and primates is not at odds with cannibalism) or have an imperial pulse, after all the first man-made object to leave the Earth's atmosphere was launched from the Third Reich.
 
They may despise societies made up of biological organisms and avoid any contact, as we do with mites. Why would those higher entities bother to establish a communication with us? what could we tell them?

Curiosity. Any civilization that managed to master space travel must be similar to us in curiosity; desire to knew more, to find what's on the next star.
Yeah, but... any species that gets so advanced and powerful that individual members of the species are powerful on the level of a Q would see the likes of humans as, like Justo said, mites. And how much effort do *you* go to to communicate with the mites in your eyebrows? You know they're there. And how enthralled do you think you'd be communicating with such tiny minds? That's how a species a mere ten thousand years more advanced than us would see us. Now imagine a species with a million year head start. Or a billion.
 
There is a branch of biology which deals exclusively with the study of mites: acarology.
 
They may despise societies made up of biological organisms and avoid any contact, as we do with mites. Why would those higher entities bother to establish a communication with us? what could we tell them?

Curiosity. Any civilization that managed to master space travel must be similar to us in curiosity; desire to knew more, to find what's on the next star.
Yeah, but... any species that gets so advanced and powerful that individual members of the species are powerful on the level of a Q would see the likes of humans as, like Justo said, mites. And how much effort do *you* go to to communicate with the mites in your eyebrows? You know they're there. And how enthralled do you think you'd be communicating with such tiny minds? That's how a species a mere ten thousand years more advanced than us would see us. Now imagine a species with a million year head start. Or a billion.
Our galaxy is old enough to house BILLIONS of years older civilizations so Earth that they may have evolved to develop telepathic capabilities. If so and they are communicating with other civilizations by this means, we will not be able to grasp their thoughts and we will continue to ignore their existence.

Until the 1960s it was thought that the best place to find advanced civilizations was the central nucleus of the galaxy where stars are very close to each other facilitating communications, Science Fiction writers fantasized about galactic empires. Today we know that this area is a hell of radiation and the home of a monster, an insatiable black hole that devours stars incessantly.

We also know that these stars, called Population II class, are made up solely of hydrogen and helium, lack metals and any other elements and are useless for life creation.

Extraterrestrial creatures may have visited our world in the past, conducting a mapping study and collecting DNA samples for some galactic database.

Maybe they left behind robot probes to monitor our evolution and may come back if they don't like the latest reports.

Perhaps internet inventors received some ET inspiration, which would have made it extraordinarily easier to snoop into our lifes as we do when installing cameras in bear and beaver shelters to study their family life, although it would be much more effective to give them a mobile phone.

But the only sure thing about ET is that to get to us you will have used FTL technology and knowing that it is possible would also cause chaos among scientific stablishment.

That might be a good reason why they don't officially announce their existence and just study us as we do with abyssal wildlife.

Bathyscape=UFO?
 
There is a branch of biology which deals exclusively with the study of mites: acarology.
And how enthralled do you think you'd be communicating with such tiny minds?
 

Attachments

  • 268.jpg
    268.jpg
    142.3 KB · Views: 31
  • 269.jpg
    269.jpg
    196 KB · Views: 31
Last edited:
Hundreds! What size alien civilization do you propose?
 
That's how a species a mere ten thousand years more advanced than us would see us. Now imagine a species with a million year head start. Or a billion.

I'm not sure on that. Spiders have been going around for 386 million years, I didn't notice the one on my wall the other day sending radio messages to Alpha Centuri nor did it enthrall me with a conversation about historic aircraft or how tasty flies are. In fact they haven't even learned to cook their food or make fire, but they do spin good webs (even in zero gravity).

Mites go back at least 480 million years recorded, and much further probably. So really the mites in your eyebrows are using you, you are a nice habitat, nothing more. Just as you don't ask every blade of grass how its feeling today before you step on it.

Some meat-eatin' dinosaurs were apex predators, but among their distant fowl offspring the chicken ended up being farmed by smart apes for food, heck they even had the gift of flight and blew it.

Actually there might be no advantage in long species life at all. Most life on this planet has been around for millions of years and while there might be quite diverse species springing up fairly regularly to take advantage of niche conditions as they find it, generally 99.9% of life on this planet is dumb, as we would define it. Most are intelligent enough to get by to life, find/build a safe home, eat and procreate. Most of these species will go on until sun crisps the earth in its final death throes and will have never developed much further than their original design.

Maybe the only advantage we have is a large brain and useful brain structure and body that is mobile and dexterous enough to do something with.
We have the spare brain capacity and time on our hands to think about space flight, while 99.9% of the critters on this planet have little or no concept of outer space and get along just fine without it. It might be the same across the universe, in which case only a very few alien lifeforms are likely to even worry about the problem, let alone set out to solve it. And even if you built a FTL spacecraft and met an alien, those mites are still happily chomping on your eyelashes without a care.
 
Last edited:
That's how a species a mere ten thousand years more advanced than us would see us. Now imagine a species with a million year head start. Or a billion.

I'm not sure on that. Spiders have been going around for 386 million years, I didn't notice the one on my wall the other day sending radio messages to Alpha Centuri
Sigh. OK, I'll spell it out. Humans may not have physically evolved much in the last 5,000 years, but our technology has gone gangbusters just in the last 50. Eventually the tech will start dragging us along (see: "Singularity"). Dull old natural evolution will be as nothing compared to what will happen to humanity at that point. If we cannot quite comprehend what mankind will become in a few hundred more years - with at least some of our descendants being genetically engineered "supermen," some being heavily cyborged, some being uploads, and some being purely AI constructs - then even further down the line becomes exponentially more difficult to imagine.

Some species could hang around a trillion years and not amount to anything more than a gender studies major. The smartest fish or octopus in the universe, evolved, say, on a world warmed internally by radioactive decay but orbiting at some distance from its star so that the world-ocean is covered in ice a mile thick, is unlikely to ever see the stars, never mind invent warp drive. But other species who evolve on worlds where the gravity is just right so that the planet holds an atmosphere but still allows economically viable space launch, where fire is conveniently possible and metals can be forged, and where they've lucked out and evolved something sufficiently like hands to let them manipulate their material world with force and precision... they stand a chance. If they come up with the intellectual triumverate of science, capitalism and democracy as well, they could well set out for the stars. And once they get to the point where they can not just live but thrive off-world, they've passed the hump, and from there it's a race to eternity with ever-expanding knowledge, scope and power.

Your spiders, though, plateaued at a level *far* below space exploration, or even the faintest notion of science. Humans have grasped and successfully applied science, so we're well on the way to exponential growth. The only plateaus in our future are those of our own stupid making.
 
Last edited:
That's how a species a mere ten thousand years more advanced than us would see us. Now imagine a species with a million year head start. Or a billion.

I'm not sure on that. Spiders have been going around for 386 million years, I didn't notice the one on my wall the other day sending radio messages to Alpha Centuri nor did it enthrall me with a conversation about historic aircraft or how tasty flies are. In fact they haven't even learned to cook their food or make fire, but they do spin good webs (even in zero gravity).

Mites go back at least 480 million years recorded, and much further probably. So really the mites in your eyebrows are using you, you are a nice habitat, nothing more. Just as you don't ask every blade of grass how its feeling today before you step on it.

Some meat-eatin' dinosaurs were apex predators, but among their distant fowl offspring the chicken ended up being farmed by smart apes for food, heck they even had the gift of flight and blew it.

Actually there might be no advantage in long species life at all. Most life on this planet has been around for millions of years and while there might be quite diverse species springing up fairly regularly to take advantage of niche conditions as they find it, generally 99.9% of life on this planet is dumb, as we would define it. Most are intelligent enough to get by to life, find/build a safe home, eat and procreate. Most of these species will go on until sun crisps the earth in its final death throes and will have never developed much further than their original design.

Maybe the only advantage we have is a large brain and useful brain structure and body that is mobile and dexterous enough to do something with.
We have the spare brain capacity and time on our hands to think about space flight, while 99.9% of the critters on this planet have little or no concept of outer space and get along just fine without it. It might be the same across the universe, in which case only a very few alien lifeforms are likely to even worry about the problem, let alone set out to solve it. And even if you built a FTL spacecraft and met an alien, those mites are still happily chomping on your eyelashes without a care.
In 2017, Swiss scientists from the Blue Brain Project managed to create a digital simulation of the human brain using Neuron software. A mathematical analysis of the model revealed that some of the activity of our neural networks develops, at the quantum level, in one multidimensional universe. That explains why a brain of such limited volume can do so many things using only a few watts. You go to sleep with a problem in your head and wake up with a solution without knowing where it came from... how in the world is that possible?

What the Swiss discovered is that the brain uses other dimensions where time does not exist, or where times goes by at different speed, to solve complex problems. It was possibly a desperate measure of evolution to prevent humanity from extinction half a million years ago.

The brain reacts to a stimulus by building a temporal structure with multidimensional blocks, starting with rods (first dimension), planks (second dimension), cubes (third dimension) and then more complex geometries with 4D, 5D until +11D and when the problem is solved the entire logical structure disintegrates to allocate for other uses the neurons used.

Do superior brain functions take place in Hyperspace? can that be the scientific definition of the soul?
 
That's how a species a mere ten thousand years more advanced than us would see us. Now imagine a species with a million year head start. Or a billion.

I'm not sure on that. Spiders have been going around for 386 million years, I didn't notice the one on my wall the other day sending radio messages to Alpha Centuri nor did it enthrall me with a conversation about historic aircraft or how tasty flies are. In fact they haven't even learned to cook their food or make fire, but they do spin good webs (even in zero gravity).

Mites go back at least 480 million years recorded, and much further probably. So really the mites in your eyebrows are using you, you are a nice habitat, nothing more. Just as you don't ask every blade of grass how its feeling today before you step on it.

Some meat-eatin' dinosaurs were apex predators, but among their distant fowl offspring the chicken ended up being farmed by smart apes for food, heck they even had the gift of flight and blew it.

Actually there might be no advantage in long species life at all. Most life on this planet has been around for millions of years and while there might be quite diverse species springing up fairly regularly to take advantage of niche conditions as they find it, generally 99.9% of life on this planet is dumb, as we would define it. Most are intelligent enough to get by to life, find/build a safe home, eat and procreate. Most of these species will go on until sun crisps the earth in its final death throes and will have never developed much further than their original design.

Maybe the only advantage we have is a large brain and useful brain structure and body that is mobile and dexterous enough to do something with.
We have the spare brain capacity and time on our hands to think about space flight, while 99.9% of the critters on this planet have little or no concept of outer space and get along just fine without it. It might be the same across the universe, in which case only a very few alien lifeforms are likely to even worry about the problem, let alone set out to solve it. And even if you built a FTL spacecraft and met an alien, those mites are still happily chomping on your eyelashes without a care.
In 2017, Swiss scientists from the Blue Brain Project managed to create a digital simulation of the human brain using Neuron software. A mathematical analysis of the model revealed that some of the activity of our neural networks develops, at the quantum level, in one multidimensional universe. That explains why a brain of such limited volume can do so many things using only a few watts. You go to sleep with a problem in your head and wake up with a solution without knowing where it came from... how in the world is that possible?

What the Swiss discovered is that the brain uses other dimensions where time does not exist, or where times goes by at different speed, to solve complex problems. It was possibly a desperate measure of evolution to prevent humanity from extinction half a million years ago.

The brain reacts to a stimulus by building a temporal structure with multidimensional blocks, starting with rods (first dimension), planks (second dimension), cubes (third dimension) and then more complex geometries with 4D, 5D until +11D and when the problem is solved the entire logical structure disintegrates to allocate for other uses the neurons used.

Do superior brain functions take place in Hyperspace? can that be the scientific definition of the soul?
So I'm not sure zbout all that but I fo recommend reading Roger Penrose's Emperors New Mind and Shadows of the Mind. Which would partially tally with such pieces.
If he's right, it's not the neurons, but the cytoskelatons that are key to quantum sourced consciousness.....though strictly it's some coherent non-algorithmic process.
 
They may despise societies made up of biological organisms and avoid any contact, as we do with mites. Why would those higher entities bother to establish a communication with us? what could we tell them?

Curiosity. Any civilization that managed to master space travel must be similar to us in curiosity; desire to knew more, to find what's on the next star.
Yeah, but... any species that gets so advanced and powerful that individual members of the species are powerful on the level of a Q would see the likes of humans as, like Justo said, mites. And how much effort do *you* go to to communicate with the mites in your eyebrows? You know they're there. And how enthralled do you think you'd be communicating with such tiny minds? That's how a species a mere ten thousand years more advanced than us would see us. Now imagine a species with a million year head start. Or a billion.
I don't believe in big quantum jumps in evolution like there's dust mites and then a big gap and then the Q Continuum. Likely there are so many planets and systems capable of life that its more like a pyramid with life all over the evolutionary scale.. Lots of low evolutionary worlds and a few extremely high ones with everything in between. So someplace out there is a world or worlds close to ours that has mastered interstellar travel.

Assuming aliens are real and have visited or are visiting earth, how advanced are they really when there are so many reports of crashed vehicles?

I was friends with a retired general who had nukes in his command at one point who adamantly told me he believed the US had had contact with ETs. Personally I don't think its as far fetched as others. In fact I don't even think its a big deal. I would find more strange if alien life had interstellar travel and never bothered to stop by our world.

But on the opposite side of things I know people who refuse to entertain the idea entirely because of religion.

The whole subject has been mucked up and intelligent debate is nearly impossible.
 
I don't believe in big quantum jumps in evolution...

A "big" quantum jump is a contradiction in terms, since a quantum jump is the *smallest* *possible* *step.*


I was friends with a retired general who had nukes in his command at one point who adamantly told me he believed the US had had contact with ETs.

Lots of people believe lots of things. Belief without evidence holds precisely zero value.
 
The ancient Greek philosophers Democritus of Abdera and Epicurus argued that countless inhabited worlds existed through an infinite cosmos.

The philosophic question of intelligent life on other worlds was also debated during the Middle Ages by Albertus Magnus, Tomas de Aquino, Etienne Tempier and Nicholas of Cusa.

During the Renaissance, Giordano Bruno and Johannes Kepler suggested that intelligent creatures might live in other planets.

Although they were the smartest men of their time, they all lacked a good reason to make such claims but they were not charlatans or tricksters either, they simply got carried away by inspiration, a neurological event so complex and enigmatic that today's science is only beginning to understand.

The ancient Greek philosophers considered inspiration to be the enemy of reason and consisted of an emotional storm passed on to humans by mythical beings, the muses.
Inspiration, intuition and creativity, uncontrollable random phenomena that have always obsessed artists and scientists... Where do writers get ideas from?

In some cases 'aha moment' occurs when a state of low mental focus is interrupted by an unexpected event. According to legend it was the fall of an apple that led Isaac Newton to develop the law of universal gravitation in 1687. Newton himself attempted to rationalize the creative phenomenon by calling it 'inductive reasoning'.

In the case of Archimedes of Syracusa (287-211 BC) it was an accident in his bathtub that inspired him to develop the physical law of buoyancy.

In 1815, the massive eruption of Mount Tambora caused severe climate abnormalities, cold summer temperatures, incessant rainfall and reddish sky at twilight. The depressive atmosphere induced Mary Shelley to write the book 'Frankenstein, or the Modern Prometheus'.

The eruption of Krakatoa volcano in 1883 darkened the sky worldwide for years and produced red sunsets who inspired the paintings of William Ashcroft in 1888 and "The Scream" picture of Edvard Munch in 1893.

In 1865 Friedrich Kekulé discovered the ring shape of the benzene molecule while thinking of Ouroboros, an ancient symbol depicting a serpent eating its own tail.

Sometimes, after surviving a near-death-like experience subjects reach a higher level of consciousness, perhaps that was the case with the Moses revelations or the reason why the Athenian statesman Solon (630-560 BC) attempted slavery abolition.

On September 1928, Alexander Fleming discovered that some culture plates of his laboratory were contaminated with fungi spores from another experiment, but he had just returned from a vacation and instead of getting angry he said 'That's funny', he got to work and with these fungi he created an antibiotic that saved millions of lives.

On June 1942, the Air Group Commander C. Wade McClusky, who led two dive bombers squadrons during the Battle of Midway, made the critical decision to continue the search for the Imperial Japanese Fleet although their planes were running low of fuel. Shortly after the Air Group managed to sink two Japanese aircraft carriers, this action ended with Japan's overwhelming aero naval superiority and changed the course of the war in the Pacific.

On May 25, 1961 President Kennedy addressed the Congress saying that ‘the US should commit itself to achieving the goal, before this decade is out, of landing a man on the Moon and returning him safely to the Earth’.

They were only the words of a politician, but after his assassination this promise became sacred and threatened to become a curse when calculations showed that the technology of the time was unable to manufacture the enormous size of the rocket needed for this mission.

In his desperation, engineer Thomas Dolan experienced his 'aha moment' and developed the concept of 'Lunar Orbit Rendezvous' that led to the design of the Lunar Module Lander and the success of the Apollo program.

Today, creativity is the Holy Grail among the qualities most valued by political leaders and business leaders.

Randomness is something that science defines as 'neural network by defect', a set of brain areas, located in the prefrontal and parietal cortex, which are only activated in a state of low mental focus when the subject trusts his instincts, without questioning them. This is something that Artificial Intelligence will never be able to do and that perhaps ensures our survival in a machine-driven future world.

During a press briefing on February 2018, Professor of Psychology Michael Varnum of the Arizona State University, presented its findings about how we might respond to the extraterrestrial life concept using a software program that qualifies emotions. In the study Varnum asked more than 500 participants about their own hypothetical reactions. Responses also showed significantly more positive than negative emotions.

It is disturbing that some of these moments of inspiration could have being not a natural phenomenon but memes implanted by an external intelligence with the intention of directing the evolution of our species.

Spock would say it's the most logical answer.

To educate us for altruism or to train us for some dark reason?.

Reason, the enemy of inspiration, is now called science.
 
Reason, the enemy of inspiration, is now called science.

Reason is not the enemy of inspiration. Reason is what separates the truly inspired from the nonsensical. Reason allows you to take inspiration and actually *do* something with it. Inspiration without reason is some whacko scrying in a crystal ball and reading horoscopes to determine the color of the Vril emissions on the underside of the Flat Earth.
 

Similar threads

Back
Top Bottom