martin 194

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hi all
Always Martin !
I read sometime ago a very little article speaking of a long range heavy bomber
name "Tokyo express" nothing more.....
Is this aircraft the four engined type 194 ?
Is it a concurent of the B 29 30 31 32 ???
With a drawing please !
thanks
 
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,7033.0/highlight,tokyo+express.html
 
You are mistaking Models 194 and 203. The Tokyo Express was Model 203, while the Model 194 is listed as the Lone Ranger, a four-engined heavy bomber project (the name could be a play on the words "long range", or perhaps just a scribe's mistake...). Perhaps the two were very similar? (I have never seen the 194 in picture) but they had separate model numbers, anyway.
 
Stargazer2006 said:
..the name could be a play on the words "long range", or perhaps just a scribe's mistake

As "Lone Ranger" I only knew still yet the Boeing Boeing XPBB-1, officially named SeaRanger.
And the "Lone Ranger" isn't any less, than an american icon, well known beyond the USA, the
masked hero, fighting bravely for justice. You was never allowed to watch those US TV series,
when you was a kid ? ;)
 

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Jemiba said:
And the "Lone Ranger" isn't any less, than an american icon...

A pretty well faded icon. In the US, the "Western" genre has virtually vanished; the last time the Lone Ranger made any sort of cultural impact was a major motion picture in 1981 that did so badly that the guy who played the Lone Ranger never appeared in any movie ever again.

Hell, the Western has gone so far down hill that when G.W. Bush was running for President in 2000, and for probably the first four years of his administration, political opponants both here and abroad would often refer to him as a "cowboy." And forgetting the politics of it, the point was that they used "cowboy" as some sort of *negative.* Prior to the 1970's, there would have been virtually no way in hell that calling someone in American politics a "cowboy" would have been thought of as an insult. Now, many see it that way.

And so it would not surprise me in the slightest that the Lone Ranger would not be well known by non-USAians... and by any American younger than, say, 35 or so.

Hmmm... surfing on over to Wiki, it appears that Disney/Bruckheimer might be working on a new Lone Ranger flick. With - gah -Johnny Depp as the Lone Ranger. Arrrrrrrrrrgh.

[/threadjack]
 
[threadjackreopening]

Actually we NEVER got the Lone Ranger here in France, although I know about it through my (reasonably good for a European) knowledge of pre-1990 U.S. popular culture—not only I've always loved it, but since I taught English for almost 15 years before turning to the web, I used to read a lot of magazines and stuff on the U.S.

As kids growing up in the 1960s and 1970s we were fortunate to have Davy Crockett, Daniel Boone, Rin-tin-Tin, Zorro, something we called "La grande vallée" (dont know the original title), and several others that were not "western" per se, perhaps even Bonanza at one point. We did get quite a few great western movies regularly, though.

But one has to understand that western is one of the most American cultural genres ever. And contrary to jazz, superheroes or space opera, which also belong to that list, it is related to a period of time that is not only past, but also subject to a lot of controversy: Indian massacres, massive bison slaughter and handguns galore... not very politically correct, especially not in non-US countries... From the 1980s onwards, western lost ground and the perspective changed, subtly, slowly but permanently. No more the good cow-boy versus the wicked Indian... From being the embodiement of freedom, courage, independence and adventure, the cowboy now cristallized a lot of bad feelings. He became a clodhoppern, a hoarse macho that smoked too much and shot before he spoke, a symbol of all that the educated west coast or east coast Americans (and quite a few more abroad) loathe: the uneducated, unrefined middle-west country bum, opposed by nature to everything that comes down from Washington, favorable to death penalty and taking justice in one's own hands, and probably a bit racist at the edges...

Personally I love western with a twist: humour and wit mixed with action. Movies such as Silverado, Maverick or The Quick and the Dead, are among my favorites.

[/threadjackreopening]

Sorry for digressing!
 
Must have been during the mid-60s, that the "Lone Ranger" was the favourite carnival
costume in the Kindergarten !

But back to the topic: May it be, that the Martin 194 was intended as an patrol/reconnaissance
bomber ? Would explain the name.

P.S.: Johnny Depp as the "Lone Ranger" ? Well, Stéphane, that could become a western you'll like !
 
Jemiba said:
P.S.: Johnny Depp as the "Lone Ranger" ? Well, Stéphane, that could become a western you'll like !

Most definitely, as I think Depp makes a lot more interesting every project he associates himself with!
 
Stargazer2006 said:
[threadjackreopening]

From the 1980s onwards, western lost ground and the perspective changed, subtly, slowly but permanently. No more the good cow-boy versus the wicked Indian... From being the embodiement of freedom, courage, independence and adventure, the cowboy now cristallized a lot of bad feelings. He became a clodhoppern, a hoarse macho that smoked too much and shot before he spoke, a symbol of all that the educated west coast or east coast Americans (and quite a few more abroad) loathe: the uneducated, unrefined middle-west country bum, opposed by nature to everything that comes down from Washington, favorable to death penalty and taking justice in one's own hands, and probably a bit racist at the edges...

Maybe a few years before that. 1970 saw Little Big Man in US theaters and typified the swing to political correctness that began in those times. But PC movies haven't always been the norm since then...Clint Eastwood has had some success with several Westerns. Recently, Russell Crowe did a Western remake of a classic from the 50s, 3:10 To Yuma.

US movie and TV tastes seem to be cyclical...maybe Westerns will once again make their way into all of our lives.
 
About planes again...

The Boeing XPBB-1 (model 344) Sea Ranger was
sometimes nicknamed "Lone Ranger" since only
one was ever built...
 
Back to planes -2.
No, it wasn't a Big Marauder. An iteration was Two iterations different in a surprising way.
 
Stargazer2006 said:
But one has to understand that western is .. . related to a period of time that is not only past, but also subject to a lot of controversy

Here's a simple challange: try to come up with a definable historical period that *isn't* loaded with some sort of controversy. The era of the "Western" was certainly no worse than the bulk of human history. Why has the Western in particular become "politically incorrect?" Probably because, as you say, the recognizable "hero" of the Western is not some upwardly-mobile East/West coast trendy metrosexual hipster-type, but rather someone who had an actual job.

As to movie cycles... the twenty to thirty years after WWII were loaded to the gills with rah-rah WWII war movies, movies that did well and made money. The nine years after 9/11 have so far had a smattering of war movies related to wars in the middle east... movies that on the whole have *not* been rah-rah, and on the whole have *not* done well at the US box office. One might argue that this means the US moviegoing public has lost interest in war movies; I'd argue that the US moviegoing public is not overly interested in movies that make the US out to be the bad guy. Gets old after a while.


Some movie producer could make a mint by producing a big-budget version of Kratman's "Caliphate," I'd bet.
 
There were at least three different configurations to the Martin 194.

One version was a swept-wing, pusher configuration four contra-rotating prop probably with eight engines (given the U.S.'s apparent inability to create a gearbox for a true single-engined counter-rotating prop), a wingspan of 171' and an approximate length of 124' 3". My "guesstimation" for the longer length of this fuselage compared to those below is the change in center gravity caused by the long swept wing. The drawing date is illegible, but I think one can safely assume it is in the same general time frame as the beginning of December, 1942 as below.

Another, a straight wing version with a four contra-rotating tractor prop and and probable eight engine configuration, a wing span of 171' and a length of 114' 6". Drawing date 12/04/42.

The version shown in the color rendition was fitted with four contra-rotating pusher props, most likely with eight engines - one for each prop. Wingspan was 171' and length was 119'. Drawing date 12-01-42.

While I have original factory drawings of all three versions, to this point I have no documentation. Given the date and size of the designs I think it is safe to assume that the proposed engines were the P&W R-4360, the largest available reciprocating engine in the U.S. at the time. Also - and this is putting 2+2 together and hoping it comes out 4 - my guess is that these designs were intended to be follow-on's to/replacements for the B-36. Boeing was also working on numerous designs of bombers to follow the B-36 in the same general time frame.

Submitted for your consideration.

AlanG
 
I couldn't get the Martin 194 out of my head, so I finally finished the top view from the factory 3-view and thought I'd share it here in substantially reduced form.

Hope you enjoy it!

AlanG
 

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I got so interested in the Martin 194 that I decided to go ahead and draw the front view as well. Fortunately, it was pretty easy overall.

So here ya go!

Enjoy.

AlanG
 

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Nearly 21 degrees of sweep on the leading edge. I assume it was done just for CG reasons but that seems awfully high for the time.
 
Dear AC Researcher,
May I suggest that swept wings were an answer to balance problems?

My studies are mostly about single-engined pushers, but they suffer serious balance problems caused by the need to locate heavy engine(s) near the centre of gravity, but pusher propellers still need to spin aft of the trailing edge.
One solution was extended drive shafts: Republic SeaBee, Curtiss Ascender, Japanese Siden and Shiden, etc. but drive shafts have their own vibration problems.
 

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