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GIUK Gap hypersonic interceptor aircraft

Desert Dawn

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I have identified the photo of what`s dubbed the GIUK Gap interceptor. I had already seen that photo since several years ago, but the article from professor Paul Czysz at Antigravity.com now shows a drawing of the same vehicle: Mach 6 liquid methane fueled aircraft project.

The photo shows the model inside the Arnold`s wind test tunnel.
 

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flateric

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Stephane, welcome onboard and thanks for wonderful stuff!
Would you mind if we will move this thread to McDonnell Douglas hypersonic thread?
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,2867.0/highlight,douglas+hypersonic.html


BTW, Mr.Czysz is not far away=)
 

Desert Dawn

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flateric said:
Stephane, welcome onboard and thanks for wonderful stuff!
Would you mind if we will move this thread to McDonnell Douglas hypersonic thread?
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,2867.0/highlight,douglas+hypersonic.html


BTW, Mr.Czysz is not far away=)

Hi Flateric, thank you,

actually i think this project is maybe part of HEDI (High Endoatmospheric Defense Interceptor), early 1990`s.
I am looking into it. I already emailed Professor Czysz, but not too sure if he will answer that one.

Actually i might have a hard time finding my thread again if it gets blended into another earlier thread (i had no idea there was a MDD hypersonic thread). In fact, i think that the FDL family of lifting bodies would deserve a thread of their own, since there are just so many versions of them (i keep finding more and more) and it is such a rich family (i think the X-20 probably have its own thread here, pls correct me if i am wrong).

If we find more info, and it if it is indeed HEDI, we might have an HEDI thread, but i suspect the HEDI would be one very good candidate for the projects that were possibly (i don`t say it is) related to whatever they name Aurora now. Anyway, since i know the Aurora drawing for the Bill Sweetman book was heavily influenced by input from Professor Czysz, no surprise there since this is also an MDD design from the same time period.
I want to find out more about the inlet system of that particular design, it does not use the front fuselage as a compression ramp, which is a bit strange for something going Mach 6. Have to check more.

I have other findings about other hypersonic programs that i will post in the future.
 

sferrin

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Desert Dawn said:
Hi Flateric, thank you,

actually i think this project is maybe part of HEDI (High Endoatmospheric Defense Interceptor), early 1990`s.

Uh, HEDI was a missile program not an aircraft.

http://www.designation-systems.net/dusrm/app4/hedi.html
 

Desert Dawn

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I just checked, yes, HEDI was a SDI program missile with a "kill vehicle" to destroy reentry vehicles of MIRV, not something winged. They just happened to be in the same article, my mistake for not checking earlier (just had time to do it today).

And i did get an answer, but nothing new per say, just what i already knew, that aircraft was designed to intercept a Russian warship battle group if it went through the GIUK gap, and run 360 circles around it and find them with radar inside that circle. I believe it would have been armed from what he told me, but no precision yet. My initial guess was that it was purely reconnaissance and would keep the battle group inside its turning radius, relaying its position to other forces until bombers or missiles would engage the Russian cruiser fleet. Based on what i have read from an older article from Prof. Czysz where he mentionned an hypersonic aircraft that could slice the Kirov with hypersonic kinetic projectiles, i think the design maybe carried tungsten rods or darts.
 

KJ_Lesnick

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Neutronic Fusion?

When was that particular document printed? (I know the concept is old, but when was the drawing which depicted it printed)
 

flateric

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what neutronic fusion?
 

TomS

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??? I'm a little confused. Could someone please post a link to the "antigravity.com" article in question? I can't seem to find the site (www.antigravity.com is an ad site -- no content). And where did the mentions of fusion (neutronic or otherwise) come from?
 

flateric

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seems they are on hold
take this so far http://www.zshare.net/download/5695299524b7846b/
 

shockonlip

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Desert Dawn said:
flateric said:
Stephane, welcome onboard and thanks for wonderful stuff!
Would you mind if we will move this thread to McDonnell Douglas hypersonic thread?
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,2867.0/highlight,douglas+hypersonic.html


BTW, Mr.Czysz is not far away=)
...
Anyway, since i know the Aurora drawing for the Bill Sweetman book was heavily influenced by input from Professor Czysz, no surprise there since this is also an MDD design from the same time period.
I want to find out more about the inlet system of that particular design, it does not use the front fuselage as a compression ramp, which is a bit strange for something going Mach 6. Have to check more.

If you don't use the forebody for compression, you could still put a compression surface inside the
engine module, but it makes the engine module longer as it is now not just an isolator/combustor/nozzle,
but a inlet, isolator, combustor, nozzle. If it's subsonic combustion, then no isolator. And there could be
good reasons for putting it in the module if you want to play around with different modules.

Depending on which picture you're talking about, if it is the Czysz (there are NO VOWELS IN THIS GUYS LAST NAME!!)
Mach 6 Interceptor drawing you posted (thanks for that by the way), you can see a possible compression ramp
in the front of the engine module. There may be an internal compression function as well.

This must have been a pretty exciting time at MCDD when they were designing these things!!
 

KJ_Lesnick

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From what I remember aneutronic fusion was a type of fusion using elements heavier than hydrogen who's byproducts did not include neutrons.

KJ Lesick
 

Simon666

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KJ_Lesnick said:
From what I remember aneutronic fusion was a type of fusion using elements heavier than hydrogen who's byproducts did not include neutrons.

KJ Lesick
It's actually code for fusion of hydrogen and boron although side reactions would produce some neutrons.
 

flateric

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well, I'm still wondrering what this thread is about starting from post #5...
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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They are discussing the "aneutronic fusion-drive hybrid" concept mentioned on the Cyzsz drawing
 

KJ_Lesnick

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Overscan,

That drawing is from the 1960's... they were doing aneutronic fusion then? I thought Aneutronic fusion was a more recent concept...

KJ
 

Desert Dawn

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shockonlip said:
Desert Dawn said:
flateric said:
Stephane, welcome onboard and thanks for wonderful stuff!
Would you mind if we will move this thread to McDonnell Douglas hypersonic thread?
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,2867.0/highlight,douglas+hypersonic.html


BTW, Mr.Czysz is not far away=)
...
Anyway, since i know the Aurora drawing for the Bill Sweetman book was heavily influenced by input from Professor Czysz, no surprise there since this is also an MDD design from the same time period.
I want to find out more about the inlet system of that particular design, it does not use the front fuselage as a compression ramp, which is a bit strange for something going Mach 6. Have to check more.

If you don't use the forebody for compression, you could still put a compression surface inside the
engine module, but it makes the engine module longer as it is now not just an isolator/combustor/nozzle,
but a inlet, isolator, combustor, nozzle. If it's subsonic combustion, then no isolator. And there could be
good reasons for putting it in the module if you want to play around with different modules.

Depending on which picture you're talking about, if it is the Czysz (there are NO VOWELS IN THIS GUYS LAST NAME!!)
Mach 6 Interceptor drawing you posted (thanks for that by the way), you can see a possible compression ramp
in the front of the engine module. There may be an internal compression function as well.

This must have been a pretty exciting time at MCDD when they were designing these things!!


Hi, thank you Shockonlip, yes, that engine module is pretty long so it makes sense and i know about internal compression as well, i don't know what specific type of engines this particular aircraft would have used, there are just so many cycles they could have used, so it is sure that influenced that particular engine modules design. If we knew more about the engines, we could figure out why. We cannot see it too well but i would bet there is no expansion ramp on this particular aircraft design. I think it is maybe using variable nozzles.

Flateric, i think we can move this one to the MDD aircraft thread, i don't think we will learn a lot more about that one, but i was just told this would have been about the size of an F-111. I will have another picture coming (not the same aicraft, but same project nonetheless).
 

KJ_Lesnick

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Not to perseverate here, but the writing of the "Aneutronic fusion" system.

Was that conceived during the 1950's or 1960's, or was that conceived and developed later on? Also was the document that depicts this an old document or a recently printed document or a recently made copy that depicts an old design?


KJ
 

Desert Dawn

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KJ_Lesnick said:
Not to perseverate here, but the writing of the "Aneutronic fusion" system.

Was that conceived during the 1950's or 1960's, or was that conceived and developed later on? Also was the document that depicts this an old document or a recently printed document or a recently made copy that depicts an old design?


KJ

Hi JK,

This is not related to these two aircrafts, that was refering to another portion of his interview for an unrelated subject. I will stick to the wind test tunnel aircraft model and the GIUK Gap interceptor.
 

Desert Dawn

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Well, never say never...

I thought i would not find anything else on the GIUK Gap interceptor, but here i just found two more drawings of it two days ago in my old documents (2 versions of it):

(and i apologize for the sideway picture, Photobucket page said : In Maintenance... could not do better than that for now. I'll correct that later).
 

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starviking

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overscan said:
They are discussing the "aneutronic fusion-drive hybrid" concept mentioned on the Cyzsz drawing

Shouldn't that kind of discussion be in the Bar or at "Above Top Secret"?

A quick search on Aneutronic Fusion reveals that it requires temperatures ten times higher than that required by the current favoured Fusion Power reaction: Deuterium/Tritium.
 

starviking

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KJ_Lesnick said:
Not to perseverate here, but the writing of the "Aneutronic fusion" system.

Was that conceived during the 1950's or 1960's, or was that conceived and developed later on? Also was the document that depicts this an old document or a recently printed document or a recently made copy that depicts an old design?

KJ

First reference to Aneutronic Fusion in google scholar is in 1984: "The LOTRIT reactor, an example" - <i>L HIBALL</i> - Nuclear Instruments & Methods in Physics Research, 1984
 

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So this (MDC?) project was intended as a Maritime Recon and Strike platform?
 
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