Famous Chinese actress 'unpersoned'

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Grey Havoc

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She has millions of adoring fans. She’s worth billions of dollars. But Beijing has all but erased actress Zhao Wei from history. And they won’t say why.
Zhao’s name won’t be immortal. Her entire internet existence has been scrubbed.

All serials and chat shows featuring her have vanished from major Chinese online streaming sites. She no longer even appears in the online credits for the movies she appears in.

Discussing why is being censored on social media.
 

Grey Havoc

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On a likely related note:

The government’s recent focus is on children, whom the party says it fears are being inundated with a toxic culture that poisons their minds, isolates them from society and saps young boys of their masculinity.

Mr. Xi signaled the new direction at China’s annual legislative meetings in March, when he told delegates to be wary of addiction to online games and “other dirty and messy things online” that could have a bad influence on young Chinese people.

The country’s powerful internet regulator, the Cyberspace Administration of China, kicked off the campaign in June when it announced plans to rein in the culture of online celebrity worship.

On Friday, it banned the ranking of celebrities by name on social-media platforms, saying only their songs and films could be ranked without mention of who created them.

Focus more on the performances, rather than the performers, the guidance said.
 

edwest2

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'China’s National Radio and Television Administration in 2018 ordered the banishment of actors whose “morality is not noble”, who was “tasteless, vulgar and obscene”, or whose “ideological level is low and have no class”.'

That would describe a significant amount of American television and movies, and the portrayals therein, along with the behavior of a number of actors off-screen. A return to 1959 standards, as in the television networks' Standards and Practices departments, would be helpful to American youth and all ages really. From time to time, a man would appear on television from that network's Standards and Practices department. He assured viewers that "We watch everything you watch to make sure it's suitable for the entire family." Keep in mind that only 3, or 4 depending on where you lived, channels were available at the time.
 

sferrin

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Consider how many people in the US think cancel culture is a GOOD thing. The Chinese social credit system is exactly that. Basically Black Mirror come to life. And people are stupid enough to believe it's a good idea. And they get to vote.
 

DWG

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A return to 1959 standards, as in the television networks' Standards and Practices departments, would be helpful to American youth and all ages really.

I was just reading something earlier noting that the movie production code was probably responsible for institutionalising a lot of homophobic behaviour (because it insisted you could have gay characters, but they had to be punished for being gay, and that was a message people took away with them). Similarly if you go back to 1959, that's well before the first interracial kiss (Kirk/Uhura on Star Trek), and representation of disabled characters is still inadequate today, never mind the complete absence there was back then.
 

edwest2

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Behind the fake/invented term "cancel culture" is an old and simple idea: people accuse others and become judge, jury and (social) executioner. Some kid in high school gets ostracized by the 'cool kids' for being not like them. Or people who should mind their own business go on Twitter or some similar place and say, "Look! He made a racist post !!! Ten years ago." or "Let's dig up whatever dirt we can on this other guy. Oh look! He said some bad things about women !!!"

Sure, people on public forums are responsible for what they write, but some average folks have put it on themselves to investigate and "cancel" people they want to find dirt on? They hope that the person they don't like wrote something bad on social media and they will look hard to find any offending post or posts, expose them to the world and execute them.

Is that a good idea?

Regarding TV and movie """"" celebrities ''''', I have no trouble ignoring actors who behave badly on screen and off. They lose the label of celebrity. Their bad behavior does not interest me. But, these actors are not portraying normal people even when they play "heroes." Off-screen, some are immoral, tasteless, vulgar and obscene, and have no class.
 

DWG

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Consider how many people in the US think cancel culture is a GOOD thing.

"Cancel culture" is nothing new, it's precisely what London's East End did when they refused to allow Mosely's blackshirts to march through Jewish areas in the Battle of Cable Street. It's the attempt to insist that protesting about policies that seek to demean or terrorise those who don't support them is unacceptable that's new.

And we're probably straying into politics.
 

edwest2

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A return to 1959 standards, as in the television networks' Standards and Practices departments, would be helpful to American youth and all ages really.

I was just reading something earlier noting that the movie production code was probably responsible for institutionalising a lot of homophobic behaviour (because it insisted you could have gay characters, but they had to be punished for being gay, and that was a message people took away with them). Similarly if you go back to 1959, that's well before the first interracial kiss (Kirk/Uhura on Star Trek), and representation of disabled characters is still inadequate today, never mind the complete absence there was back then.

Funny you should mention Star Trek. A character who risked his life to save others ends up in a high-tech wheelchair. He was previously imprisoned by some aliens and met a woman when he was there. At the end, he is reunited with this woman who was on the verge of death but saved by the intervention of the aliens who produced a functioning but physically distorted human. They are made whole on this planet and stay together. There were other science fiction stories from that time period. One where children were taken to a planet where the atmosphere took away their disabilities. I understood the situation homosexuals were in. I never took away a message that gay people had to be punished for being gay.
 
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Justo Miranda

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In all generations there is a small percentage of people with their own ideas who do not allow themselves to be influenced by advertising, propaganda or censorship. The others simply reproduce in the hope that a future mutation will prove more intelligent.
 

Orionblamblam

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representation of disabled characters is still inadequate today, never mind the complete absence there was back then.

If you're talking sci-fi... *of* *course* "disabled" are under-represented. If you are deaf, blind, de-limbed, missing a lung, got a bad ticker, allergic to sunlight, terrified of the color blue... you go to Doctor Crusher, she waves a tricorder at you, a hand-held device goes "bleep," some technomagic happens... and you're no longer disabled Missing organs are cloned and installed. Missing limbs are replaced with cloned new ones... or kick-ass robotic ones that give you superpowers. Anyone with real disabilities in a Star trek/Star Wars like world can get them fixed lickety split... and anyone who chooses *not* to is clearly too weird to be trusted with a starship capable of laying waste to entire planetary systems.
 

Orionblamblam

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"Cancel culture" is nothing new, it's precisely what London's East End did when they refused to allow Mosely's blackshirts to march through Jewish areas in the Battle of Cable Street.

Naw. Cancel culture would have been if those opposed to Mosely had figured out who all of his supporters were, from the most fervent blackshirt to just some schmoe who thought he had some good ideas, and then pursue them through life to get their employers to fire them, their banks to refuse them services, their local shops to close their doors to their business. The goal of many cancel culturists is to hound the target to *suicide.*

Note: this is nothing to do with "politics," just a definition of a current cultural malady. One that is clearly related to the subject of the thread, but with mobs enacting the policy rather than the government. When the mob and the government become indistinguishable, though...
 

overscan (PaulMM)

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representation of disabled characters is still inadequate today, never mind the complete absence there was back then.

If you're talking sci-fi... *of* *course* "disabled" are under-represented. If you are deaf, blind, de-limbed, missing a lung, got a bad ticker, allergic to sunlight, terrified of the color blue... you go to Doctor Crusher, she waves a tricorder at you, a hand-held device goes "bleep," some technomagic happens... and you're no longer disabled Missing organs are cloned and installed. Missing limbs are replaced with cloned new ones... or kick-ass robotic ones that give you superpowers. Anyone with real disabilities in a Star trek/Star Wars like world can get them fixed lickety split... and anyone who chooses *not* to is clearly too weird to be trusted with a starship capable of laying waste to entire planetary systems.

My wife informs me that there are TV shows out there which aren't Sci-Fi, in which disabled people could be better represented. I can't confirm or deny having never watched such things.

And yes, this topic is straying into politics and has zero connection to the forum.
 
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Orionblamblam

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My wife informs me that there are TV shows out there which aren't Sci-Fi,
lies-deception.gif
 

edwest2

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TV shows which aren't sci-fi? I've never heard of such a thing...
 

Orionblamblam

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A recent article on a similar phenomenon in the west (US in particular):

The New Puritans


Sometimes advocates of the new mob justice claim that these are minor punishments, that the loss of a job is not serious, that people should be able to accept their situation and move on. But isolation plus public shaming plus loss of income are severe sanctions for adults, with long-term personal and psychological repercussions—especially because the “sentences” in these cases are of indeterminate length. Elliott contemplated suicide, and has written that “every first-hand account I’ve read of public shaming—and I’ve read more than my share—includes thoughts of suicide.” Massey did too: “I had a plan and the means to execute it; I then had a panic attack and took a cab to the ER.” David Bucci, the former chair of the Dartmouth brain-sciences department, who was named in a lawsuit against the college though he was not accused of any sexual misconduct, did kill himself after he realized he might never be able to restore his reputation.
 

edwest2

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This is civilized? Total strangers taking on the "job" of accusing and then socially executing people? This is an abdication of the civil, civic-minded approach. Instead of helping others, which monkeys cannot do nor should we compare ourselves to the social behavior of animals, some self-identified group of Official Accusers will go after people for wrongs committed? This is the mob - online. The mob and they are not here to help others. A very sad development.

Yes, in ancient times, empires celebrated their victories but not their defeats. In ancient Egypt, your name was deleted if you ran afoul of the rulers.
 

Grey Havoc

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We live in dark times, to say the least.
 

edwest2

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"dark times"? I think not. When a group, any group, decides "we can accuse" and become judge, jury and executioner, what is that? Helping your neighbor? Aren't there laws about privacy? Or is Twitter the default, "You posted it and now you must pay" spider's web? What happened to educating others? Not dramatic enough?
 

Antonio

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This is civilized?
To me?, of course not. I agree with you. A terrible habit which has found a powerful effect multiplier with the internet tools. Not only in China but also in many societies closer to everyone here. In a recent article from my local press I found it was called bringing someone to "civil dead".

Moderator note:
We open threads and threads about fascinating questions. Most of the time we enjoy in peace from talented people. Thanks everyone!
But we should keep the focus on unbuilt projects or should we start serious consideration about opening a new forum for everything off topic?
 

Justo Miranda

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Justo Miranda

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This is civilized? Total strangers taking on the "job" of accusing and then socially executing people? This is an abdication of the civil, civic-minded approach. Instead of helping others, which monkeys cannot do nor should we compare ourselves to the social behavior of animals, some self-identified group of Official Accusers will go after people for wrongs committed? This is the mob - online. The mob and they are not here to help others. A very sad development.

Yes, in ancient times, empires celebrated their victories but not their defeats. In ancient Egypt, your name was deleted if you ran afoul of the rulers.
Except if you are the pharaoh and lose the battle of khadesh
 

edwest2

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This is civilized?
To me?, of course not. I agree with you. A terrible habit which has found a powerful effect multiplier with the internet tools. Not only in China but also in many societies closer to everyone here. In a recent article from my local press I found it was called bringing someone to "civil dead".

Moderator note:
We open threads and threads about fascinating questions. Most of the time we enjoy in peace from talented people. Thanks everyone!
But we should keep the focus on unbuilt projects or should we start serious consideration about opening a new forum for everything off topic?

This is a habit? No, this is not habitual behavior. It is not powerful except in the eyes of the self-appointed Official Accusers.
 

martinbayer

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This is civilized? Total strangers taking on the "job" of accusing and then socially executing people? This is an abdication of the civil, civic-minded approach. Instead of helping others, which monkeys cannot do nor should we compare ourselves to the social behavior of animals, some self-identified group of Official Accusers will go after people for wrongs committed? This is the mob - online. The mob and they are not here to help others. A very sad development.

Yes, in ancient times, empires celebrated their victories but not their defeats. In ancient Egypt, your name was deleted if you ran afoul of the rulers.
Your analysis/notion of monkeys is incorrect, see e.g. https://www.pnas.org/content/105/36/13685.
 

edwest2

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This is civilized? Total strangers taking on the "job" of accusing and then socially executing people? This is an abdication of the civil, civic-minded approach. Instead of helping others, which monkeys cannot do nor should we compare ourselves to the social behavior of animals, some self-identified group of Official Accusers will go after people for wrongs committed? This is the mob - online. The mob and they are not here to help others. A very sad development.

Yes, in ancient times, empires celebrated their victories but not their defeats. In ancient Egypt, your name was deleted if you ran afoul of the rulers.
Your analysis/notion of monkeys is incorrect, see e.g. https://www.pnas.org/content/105/36/13685.

Even so, people are not monkeys. A higher standard of behavior should be the goal.
 
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