• Hi Guest! Forum rules have been updated. All users please read here.

Consolidated Tailless Bomber

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,776
Reaction score
4,467
Being unfamiliar with WW2 projects, what is this tailless Consolidated Vultee bomber (?) design?

http://crgis.ndc.nasa.gov/historic/Additional_Photos_for_12-Foot_Low_Speed_Tunnel#Consolidated_Model
 

Attachments

  • LMAL_37489.jpg
    LMAL_37489.jpg
    243.3 KB · Views: 853

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,776
Reaction score
4,467
Same, with wing sections extended fore and aft.

http://crgis.ndc.nasa.gov/historic/File:LMAL_46747.jpg
 

Attachments

  • LMAL_46747.jpg
    LMAL_46747.jpg
    477.4 KB · Views: 731

Antonio

ACCESS: Top Secret
Staff member
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2006
Messages
3,534
Reaction score
313
Tailless Twin-Engine Patrol Studies (1943): possibly a proposal for a PV-1 and PV-2 replacement won by Lockheed with its P2V Neptune.

Source: Convair Advanced Designs. Secret Projects from San Diego 1923-1962. Robert E. Bradley. page 165
 

overscan (PaulMM)

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Messages
12,776
Reaction score
4,467
Heh - I haven't opened my copy of that yet!

More here:

http://crgis.ndc.nasa.gov/historic/Additional_Photos_for_12-Foot_Low_Speed_Tunnel_3#Model_.2340
 

Attachments

  • LMAL_38724.jpg
    LMAL_38724.jpg
    128.9 KB · Views: 643
  • LMAL_38720.jpg
    LMAL_38720.jpg
    58.4 KB · Views: 640
  • LMAL_36286.jpg
    LMAL_36286.jpg
    231.4 KB · Views: 638

James

ACCESS: Restricted
Joined
Mar 4, 2011
Messages
9
Reaction score
0
Interesting. Never come across this project before.

(My first post here - Hi everyone. :) )
 

Apophenia

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2007
Messages
2,703
Reaction score
1,119
This might be old news by now but ... according to Alan Griffith (aka ACResearcher), there were at least three proposals for Consolidated flying wings. The first was a Sept 1941 twin-engined bomber wing a 130 foot span for the USAAC. This variant was later pitched to the US Navy as a "so-called 'Patrol Bomber', Consolidated designation P5Y1". Consolidated was quite persistent with their 'P5Y1". A 1944 brochure for a "Performance Report Two Engine Patrol Landplane Tailless Type" appeared on eBay"

http://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-CONSOLIDATED-REPORT-ON-TAILLESS-AIRCRAFT-/291040911366

"Another variant was to have a wingspan of 134 feet with a gross weight of 90,000lbs. This version was tested in GALCIT wind tunnel in 1943." This would be the version illustrated here.

"Finally, there was a 180,000lb, 180ft wing span beast sporting four engines. This final version was to have a range of 7500 miles."

http://www.hyperscale.com/2015/reviews/books/amsecprojbookpreview_1.htm

According to Claus Reuter (The Development of the Heavy Bomber 1918-1944, page 61), the final, 180 foot span concept was to have each of four buried turbocharged tractor engines driving its own counter-rotating propellers through extension shafts. This bomber would have been highly loaded but control on landing was to be aided by full-span flaps and retractable horizontal tail surfaces.

Crew positions were to be pressurized, including the turrets. Defensive armament was to consist of a nose turret (4 x .50-cal), dorsal and ventral turrets (each with 2 x 37mm cannons). Normal offensive armament load would be 5,000 lbs with a crew of 9 flying at 240 mph over 7,500 miles. Up to 40,000 lbs could be carried over 3,500 miles. Gross weight was about 180,000 lbs.

A variation on the theme had a large, central tailfin. See 'Free Flight Tests of a Consolidated-Vultee Tailless Model', NASA Langley CRGIS video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjYKWtOZ7wE
 

Apophenia

ACCESS: Top Secret
Senior Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2007
Messages
2,703
Reaction score
1,119
A bit more ... attached are specs and a three-view drawing from that 1944 brochure from eBay.

Powerplant was to be twin Pratt & Whitney R-4360 Wasp Majors but span is listed as 147 feet (whereas Alan Griffith suggested that this was to be based on the 130 foot span Army bomber's airframe).
 

Attachments

  • consolidated-tailless-specs.jpg
    consolidated-tailless-specs.jpg
    86.2 KB · Views: 154
  • consolidated-tailless-3v.jpg
    consolidated-tailless-3v.jpg
    89.7 KB · Views: 154

Stargazer2006

ACCESS: USAP
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2009
Messages
13,227
Reaction score
599
More images of that project:
 

Attachments

  • 4588021295_16991cc179_o.jpg
    4588021295_16991cc179_o.jpg
    69.7 KB · Views: 203
  • Consolidated-Patrol-Bomber-.gif
    Consolidated-Patrol-Bomber-.gif
    901.4 KB · Views: 212

Stargazer2006

ACCESS: USAP
Senior Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2009
Messages
13,227
Reaction score
599
A splendid painting by Daniel Uhr:

a79dd425849887.5634bb5176f36.jpg


  • His topic on this forum: http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,18167.0/all.html
  • His website: http://duhraviationart.com/
 

ACResearcher

Author/researcher/illustrator.
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2011
Messages
261
Reaction score
160
The artwork by Daniel Uhr is the cover art from American Secret Projects: Fighters Bombers and Attack Aircraft, 1937-1945 by Tony Buttler and Alan Griffith, Crecy Publishing Ltd, Copyright 2015. I worked very closely with Daniel as he created this beautiful rendition. As one who is extremely pleased to be able to occasionally freehand a straight line I can only be in awe of folks who can come up with such art.

I have a substantial amount of information on these Consolidated tailless bomber projects in my collection, including the document to which Apophenia refers above as well as a number of NACA test results, proposals to the military, etc. I will be going into depth on these aircraft in a future publication.

Cockpit side up.

AlanG
 

Avimimus

ACCESS: Top Secret
Joined
Dec 16, 2007
Messages
1,974
Reaction score
94
Interesting to compare this to:
- The Kalinin VS-2/K-12, K-14, K-16, K-18 program (https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,4819.0.html)
- The Boeing B-306 program (https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,304.0/all.html)
 

airman

ACCESS: Top Secret
Joined
Oct 14, 2007
Messages
1,243
Reaction score
102
Website
zeef.com
I suppose that be unsterstood that Tailess formula for Bombers was highly problematic .
 

ACResearcher

Author/researcher/illustrator.
Senior Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2011
Messages
261
Reaction score
160
Hesham,

It would be good for you to mention the author of these books, in this case my friend Bob Bradly - an excellent researcher and a fine gentleman.

I will say I found a tremendous amount on all these aircraft in various archives before I met Bob, but he generously shared his wisdom with me on a number of projects.

AlanG
 
Top