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Author Topic: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies  (Read 53313 times)

Offline frank

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Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« on: May 21, 2006, 12:19:14 pm »
Thread to discuss Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF Projects.

Merged with existing Rockwell ATF threads by Overscan



If I knew how to add a pic, I'd attach it, but in a 1981 issue of Aviation Week & Space Technology, there was a page of sketches of ATF designs. One that's had me intrigued is a Rockwell design & it is just a front view sketch. For the life of me, it looks very reminiscent of the front view of the fictional Soviet MiG-31 "Firefox", of Clint Eastwood's 1982 movie of the same title. Low wing, top mounted intakes, flat/chisel-like nose, twin outward canted verts & looks like low mounted canards. Maybe even a bit like an F-117 even. I can email a copy if anyone's interested. If some of you guys have an idea about additional info on this design, I'd love to know more.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2006, 10:03:57 am by overscan »

Offline flateric

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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2006, 02:12:05 pm »
This one?
"There are many disbelievers in
stealth, more than a few of them truly technically ignorant and proud of it." Sherm Mullin, Skunk Works

Offline frank

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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2006, 05:27:15 pm »
This one?


Yes, this one! Thanks for posting it!

Offline elmayerle

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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2006, 12:00:27 am »
Well, as I understand it, the gent responsible for designing the movie's "Firefox" actually was a designer with Northrop.  Rumor says he was involved with the YF-23 but I can't verify that.

Online sferrin

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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #4 on: May 23, 2006, 10:05:56 pm »
That's interesting.  Northrop did the design work for the two stealth aircraft in the movie "Stealth" also.  They designed the aircraft and then hollywood added all the bells and whistles.  Obviously it was more an exercise in "hey this would look cool" than anything as it's unlikely they'd want to show their latest ideas for the sake of Hollywood.
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Offline flateric

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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2006, 09:00:12 am »
Frank - I'm not sure posting it will make your day, but obviously that's what you are looking for.
This is '78 Rockwell 'high-altitude supersonic penetrator' air-to ground concept, pre-ATF in a way it was proposed then (with emphasis on ATG missions). To my sorrow that's the best quality - and all - I have on this.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2006, 09:54:11 am by flateric »
"There are many disbelievers in
stealth, more than a few of them truly technically ignorant and proud of it." Sherm Mullin, Skunk Works

Offline frank

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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2006, 11:16:05 am »

   Congrats! You have made my day, well, nearly, at least! THANK YOU! It doesn't look so much like Firefox in the drawing, but a very sexy aircraft, indeed! Could you tell me where it's from? Man, I really like this place!!

Frank - I'm not sure posting it will make your day, but obviously that's what you are looking for.
This is '78 Rockwell 'high-altitude supersonic penetrator' air-to ground concept, pre-ATF in a way it was proposed then (with emphasis on ATG missions). To my sorrow that's the best quality - and all - I have on this.

Offline flateric

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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2006, 11:28:28 am »
I bet it's the same canard aircraft which front view you have mentioned. Canard id hard to see but its just under US AIR FORCE markings.
Source is:

SILVERMAN, S. (Rockwell International Corp., Los Angeles, Calif.)
AIAA-1978-3013
In: Diamond jubilee of powered flight: The evolution of aircraft design; Proceedings of the Conference, Dayton, Ohio, December 14, 15, 1978. (A79-16957 04-01) New York, American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics, Inc., 1978, p. 132-139.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2006, 11:30:55 am by flateric »
"There are many disbelievers in
stealth, more than a few of them truly technically ignorant and proud of it." Sherm Mullin, Skunk Works

Offline flateric

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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2006, 12:17:01 pm »
Looks alike but I'm not sure - from AWST Ocrober 27, 1980
Courtesy Matej Furda
"There are many disbelievers in
stealth, more than a few of them truly technically ignorant and proud of it." Sherm Mullin, Skunk Works

Offline frank

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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #9 on: May 29, 2006, 06:08:01 am »

     I think they are two different, tho similar designs. The '78 drawing shows a different vertical tail arrangement, different canard location & arrangement & appears to be a two seat a/c. The 1980 drawing also has some sort of pod located on the belly. Thanks for this one too.



Looks alike but I'm not sure - from AWST Ocrober 27, 1980
Courtesy Matej Furda

Offline flateric

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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #10 on: June 02, 2006, 04:18:49 pm »
HiMAT-derived fighter concepts from 1983
« Last Edit: June 02, 2006, 04:22:19 pm by flateric »
"There are many disbelievers in
stealth, more than a few of them truly technically ignorant and proud of it." Sherm Mullin, Skunk Works

Offline fightingirish

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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #11 on: June 03, 2006, 11:25:27 am »
From the magazine "National Geographic", January 1981, Vol. 159, No.1 at page 96:
Slán,
fightingirish

Slán ist an Irish Gaelic word for Goodbye.  :)

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Online PaulMM (Overscan)

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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2006, 03:51:47 pm »
Rockwell's Saberbat FSW fighter project, which competed with the Grumman X-29, is found here:

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=208.0
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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2006, 03:57:26 pm »
ATF studies
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Re: Rockwell pre-ATF and ATF studies
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2006, 03:58:31 pm »
more
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