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Author Topic: Israeli Medium Weight Armored Vehicle Concept - Project Carmel?  (Read 565 times)

Offline bobbymike

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"I love those who can smile in trouble, who can gather strength from distress, and grow brave by reflection. 'Tis the business of little minds to shrink, but they whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves their conduct, will pursue their principles unto death." - Leonardo da Vinci

Offline Moose

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Re: Israeli Medium Weight Armored Vehicle Concept - Project Carmel?
« Reply #1 on: September 23, 2017, 03:58:36 pm »
This is one of those things that gets excoriated if the US Army proposes it, but now will get a fair shake because IDF.

Offline Void

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Re: Israeli Medium Weight Armored Vehicle Concept - Project Carmel?
« Reply #2 on: September 23, 2017, 07:19:11 pm »
It is still a rather goofy idea - it is trying to turn a tank into a rolling attack helicopter even though attack helicopters have proven to be extremely expensive, susceptible to ambushes, demanding to operate and incapable of sustained operations. In other words at odds with all the stated goals. It also returns to the persistent fallacy that substituting physical systems with virtual systems will make the weapon cheaper to own and operate; as if cutting-edge electronics and software are free or CS majors are cheaper to employ than mechanics.

Offline Foo Fighter

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Re: Israeli Medium Weight Armored Vehicle Concept - Project Carmel?
« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2017, 03:15:44 am »
It seems more like a recce vehicle than a tank per se, I am always sceptical of media sources calling vehicles 'tanks' as they usually are not.

Offline DWG

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Re: Israeli Medium Weight Armored Vehicle Concept - Project Carmel?
« Reply #4 on: September 24, 2017, 04:37:37 am »
It does look rather like a grown-up Scimitar.

Offline dan_inbox

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Re: Israeli Medium Weight Armored Vehicle Concept - Project Carmel?
« Reply #5 on: September 25, 2017, 01:00:35 am »
It is still a rather goofy idea - it is trying to turn a tank into a rolling attack helicopter
That's not the point of this concept, at least not to replace tanks where they're supposed to operate, ie in the open.
 
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The future armored platform will be light, agile, small ... and designed primarily for operation in urban areas
Says exactly the opposite: provide protected fire support where tanks are too clumsy.

To me, this looks like heyl shiryon is building on the lessons drawn from fighting in high-rises urban areas, with the makeshift use of M163 Vulcans to reach the skyscrappers' upper storeys. It's creating a purpose-built vehicle with the right arc of fire and connectivity.

Urgency is increasing, with Iran upping their threats of a major war through their hezb'allah puppets now that they see the end of the Syrian quagmire. Last week Iranian generals spoke again about burning Haifa and TA.  If they insist enough, the IDF just might have to go back to Beirut to clean them up, and those godcrazies will again use every densely populated area as hideout.
Hence the requirement for Carmel-type equipment...
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On the design:  I would question the use of caterpillars. For urban areas, 6x6 or 8x8 wheeled should be enough, and be faster, cheaper, longer-operating, etc.