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Author Topic: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement  (Read 68421 times)

Offline Mark S.

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #15 on: April 08, 2016, 08:12:19 am »
I don't know if we can design the gun but it wouldn't be too difficult to get it built here in the U.S.  Plenty of firms have the technical know-how especially in the Midwest.

Offline sferrin

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #16 on: April 08, 2016, 08:24:43 am »
Too bad they just can't built more A-10s with updated avionics and propulsive system. -SP

Could we even build that gun in the US if we wanted more?

There's a guy on Aliexpress can do a good deal...

I could swear I read somewhere that the facility that use to make gatling guns in the US is long gone; that even "new" miniguns are just refurbed old stock made decades ago.
General Dynamics would like a few words with you.

If they've acquired the tooling, and still have the know-how, for the GAU-8 I would be delighted  to be wrong.   :)
"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.

Offline sferrin

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #17 on: April 08, 2016, 08:26:08 am »
I don't know if we can design the gun but it wouldn't be too difficult to get it built here in the U.S.  Plenty of firms have the technical know-how especially in the Midwest.

Ugh.  An AR is not a 30mm Gatling gun.  Lots of people make ultra-lights and hang-gliders too but none of them are going to be kicking out a fighter plane anytime soon.
"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.

Offline Steve Pace

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #18 on: April 08, 2016, 10:05:56 am »
I don't know if we can design the gun but it wouldn't be too difficult to get it built here in the U.S.  Plenty of firms have the technical know-how especially in the Midwest.
Where's Mr. Gatling when you need him? -SP
When you know you're right, go ahead.

Offline TomS

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #19 on: April 08, 2016, 11:05:15 am »
General Dynamics would like a few words with you.

If they've acquired the tooling, and still have the know-how, for the GAU-8 I would be delighted  to be wrong.   :)

General Dynamics Ordnance and Tactical Systems bought (by way of Lockheed Martin) the GE activity that originally developed the GAU-8.  GD-OTS is is actively supporting GAU-8 with spares.  Given that new GAU-8s are still being produced for Goalkeeper installations for the ROKN, it seems that new guns are being made, and GD-OTS is the only company that can do that.


http://www.usaopps.com/government_bids/detail/ADP14012808290000301.htm


Quote
The Naval Surface Warfare Center, Dahlgren Division intends to acquire continued research, development, analysis, testing documentation, prototype fabrication, pre-production, and production of Gatling Gun weapon systems hardware and associated gun control systems software. The effort will be fulfilled through other than full and open competition with General Dynamics - Ordnance and Tactical Systems (GD-OTS), Williston Technology Center, 326 IBM Road, Building 862, Williston, VT 05494. This requirement encompasses several different variants of this multi-barrel gun (to include the 25mm GAU-12 and GAU-22; 30mm GAU-8; .50cal GAU-19/A and 19/B; and the 20mm M61 and 3 barrel variant M197). GD-OTS is the Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) for these guns and has been in continuous production for these guns for almost 70 years. No other company can produce these guns new. GD-OTS is the Current Design Authority (CDA) for the 25mm GAU-12 and GAU-22; 30mm GAU-8; and .50 cal GAU-19/A and 19/B. The entire Technical Data Packages (TDPs) for the .50 cal GAU-19 gun is GD-OTS Proprietary and portions of the TDPs for the 25mm GAU-12/GAU-22 and 30mm GAU-8 guns are GD-OTS proprietary. GD-OTS has also developed the ammunition handling systems that support integrating these multi-barrel weapons in every frontline aircraft for the US Government.

Offline elmayerle

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #20 on: April 08, 2016, 11:20:05 am »
If that's so, it is truly sad....

Enjoy the Day!  Mark

The history of the classic "minigun" is a depressing read:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minigun

(Yeah, I know, it's Wiki, but it's a decent summation.)

There was a fascinating article on the development of the mini-gun in Small Arms Review about a year ago.  After the prototype was developed by experimental engineering, production development and design was taken over by production engineering, with no input from the group that developed the prototype.  Ultimately, they had to bring back the original engineer and design to develop an alternate design, to that of production engineering, that would work.

Offline GTX

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #21 on: April 08, 2016, 11:30:24 am »
How about single seat version of korea's T-50 when it is selected as T-X aircraft?


So basically the FA-50:



Offline sferrin

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #22 on: April 08, 2016, 11:43:46 am »
If that's so, it is truly sad....

Enjoy the Day!  Mark

The history of the classic "minigun" is a depressing read:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minigun

(Yeah, I know, it's Wiki, but it's a decent summation.)

There was a fascinating article on the development of the mini-gun in Small Arms Review about a year ago.  After the prototype was developed by experimental engineering, production development and design was taken over by production engineering, with no input from the group that developed the prototype.  Ultimately, they had to bring back the original engineer and design to develop an alternate design, to that of production engineering, that would work.

I still wish they'd have found a use for the micro-gun  ;D in 5.56mm. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XM214_Microgun

"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.

Offline sferrin

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #23 on: April 08, 2016, 11:45:22 am »
General Dynamics would like a few words with you.

If they've acquired the tooling, and still have the know-how, for the GAU-8 I would be delighted  to be wrong.   :)

General Dynamics Ordnance and Tactical Systems bought (by way of Lockheed Martin) the GE activity that originally developed the GAU-8.  GD-OTS is is actively supporting GAU-8 with spares.  Given that new GAU-8s are still being produced for Goalkeeper installations for the ROKN, it seems that new guns are being made, and GD-OTS is the only company that can do that.


http://www.usaopps.com/government_bids/detail/ADP14012808290000301.htm


Quote
The Naval Surface Warfare Center, Dahlgren Division intends to acquire continued research, development, analysis, testing documentation, prototype fabrication, pre-production, and production of Gatling Gun weapon systems hardware and associated gun control systems software. The effort will be fulfilled through other than full and open competition with General Dynamics - Ordnance and Tactical Systems (GD-OTS), Williston Technology Center, 326 IBM Road, Building 862, Williston, VT 05494. This requirement encompasses several different variants of this multi-barrel gun (to include the 25mm GAU-12 and GAU-22; 30mm GAU-8; .50cal GAU-19/A and 19/B; and the 20mm M61 and 3 barrel variant M197). GD-OTS is the Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) for these guns and has been in continuous production for these guns for almost 70 years. No other company can produce these guns new. GD-OTS is the Current Design Authority (CDA) for the 25mm GAU-12 and GAU-22; 30mm GAU-8; and .50 cal GAU-19/A and 19/B. The entire Technical Data Packages (TDPs) for the .50 cal GAU-19 gun is GD-OTS Proprietary and portions of the TDPs for the 25mm GAU-12/GAU-22 and 30mm GAU-8 guns are GD-OTS proprietary. GD-OTS has also developed the ammunition handling systems that support integrating these multi-barrel weapons in every frontline aircraft for the US Government.

<breathes a huge sigh of relief> 
"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.

Ian33

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #24 on: April 08, 2016, 12:26:09 pm »
General Dynamics would like a few words with you.

If they've acquired the tooling, and still have the know-how, for the GAU-8 I would be delighted  to be wrong.   :)

General Dynamics Ordnance and Tactical Systems bought (by way of Lockheed Martin) the GE activity that originally developed the GAU-8.  GD-OTS is is actively supporting GAU-8 with spares.  Given that new GAU-8s are still being produced for Goalkeeper installations for the ROKN, it seems that new guns are being made, and GD-OTS is the only company that can do that.


http://www.usaopps.com/government_bids/detail/ADP14012808290000301.htm


Quote
The Naval Surface Warfare Center, Dahlgren Division intends to acquire continued research, development, analysis, testing documentation, prototype fabrication, pre-production, and production of Gatling Gun weapon systems hardware and associated gun control systems software. The effort will be fulfilled through other than full and open competition with General Dynamics - Ordnance and Tactical Systems (GD-OTS), Williston Technology Center, 326 IBM Road, Building 862, Williston, VT 05494. This requirement encompasses several different variants of this multi-barrel gun (to include the 25mm GAU-12 and GAU-22; 30mm GAU-8; .50cal GAU-19/A and 19/B; and the 20mm M61 and 3 barrel variant M197). GD-OTS is the Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) for these guns and has been in continuous production for these guns for almost 70 years. No other company can produce these guns new. GD-OTS is the Current Design Authority (CDA) for the 25mm GAU-12 and GAU-22; 30mm GAU-8; and .50 cal GAU-19/A and 19/B. The entire Technical Data Packages (TDPs) for the .50 cal GAU-19 gun is GD-OTS Proprietary and portions of the TDPs for the 25mm GAU-12/GAU-22 and 30mm GAU-8 guns are GD-OTS proprietary. GD-OTS has also developed the ammunition handling systems that support integrating these multi-barrel weapons in every frontline aircraft for the US Government.

Then...

Quote
<breathes a huge sigh of relief>

I joined you then raised a fine single malt to the Gods as thanks.

Offline marauder2048

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #25 on: April 08, 2016, 01:09:54 pm »
Curious to see how well the combination of APKWS II and 25mm on AV-8B work out CAS-wise against ISIS. Might inform some of the Air Force's deliberations.

Offline LowObservable

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #26 on: April 08, 2016, 01:16:37 pm »
That was a strange discussion about guns. I'd have thought it was pretty obvious that someone had to be able to make the GAU-22/A...

Offline sferrin

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #27 on: April 08, 2016, 01:50:52 pm »
That was a strange discussion about guns. I'd have thought it was pretty obvious that someone had to be able to make the GAU-22/A...

Sure.  Doesn't mean it's the same company that built the GAU-8. 
"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.

Offline Gildasd

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #28 on: April 08, 2016, 02:22:56 pm »
That was a strange discussion about guns. I'd have thought it was pretty obvious that someone had to be able to make the GAU-22/A...

Sure.  Doesn't mean it's the same company that built the GAU-8.
Or that due to improvements in materials, maybe 3 or even 1 barrel is sufficient...

Offline sferrin

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Re: A-X all over again - USAF pushes for A-10 replacement
« Reply #29 on: April 08, 2016, 02:24:18 pm »
That was a strange discussion about guns. I'd have thought it was pretty obvious that someone had to be able to make the GAU-22/A...

Sure.  Doesn't mean it's the same company that built the GAU-8.
Or that due to improvements in materials, maybe 3 or even 1 barrel is sufficient...

I hadn't heard of any discovery of Unobtainium yet so I'm kinda thinking "no" on that front.  Besides, this has zero to do with whether or not anybody is currently building the GAU-8 so I'm not sure what your point is suppose to be.
"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.