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Author Topic: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)  (Read 23366 times)

Offline Jemiba

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« Reply #45 on: August 30, 2013, 10:58:51 am »
original source : Aeroclub-Magazin April 1960

mentioned in the GST magazine and some other contemporary publications.
Started as an April fool, but taken seriously !
« Last Edit: April 09, 2018, 09:28:06 am by Jemiba »
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Offline hesham

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #46 on: September 01, 2013, 02:43:16 pm »
Discussing the CC.2 in the Campini projects thread, the talk went on the Re.2007, a notorious fake. Since there is some interest in this and it seems that the "fekeness" ot the Re.2007 is not widely aknowledged, I give here a (somewhat lenghty explanation). Since we are in Secret projects, I attached some projects draft to helm me summarize the matter. Here we go.  Afinal warning: nothing of what follows is true: Italian aviation historians alla gree on this version since at least the late '80s...
What follows is the story of the Re2007. Story, not history, since the Re 2007 as is widely, and incorrectly, known, i.e. a late war prototype fighter powered by a Jumo jet engine, is a fantasy (even if the right word is "fake"...). First the facts and then the interpretation of them, since even fakes are done for a purpose, freak as it could look.
Just after the war italian aviation buffs knew that the Re.2007 existed and the way it looked. A perspective view is in picture 1, as published in the magazine "L'Ala" in February 1948. Actually, first mention of this project comes from a report written by Ing. Alessio, General Manager of Reggiane, in late 1945, describing the projects that were well advanced: this particular project was a mail and six passenger transport. Alessio described it as a derivative of the Re.2005, but in reality it derived from the Re.2000 and had a radial engine (see picture 4). Same article in L'Ala described also a Re.2008 like a racer derived from the Re.2005 (pic 2). Alessio didn't mention this but instead a single engine, single crew postal plane, wich was similary derived by the R.2005. In fact this was a straightforward derivative of the Re.2000 with a P&W or Wright 1500 Hp water-cooled radial (pic 3). Alessio described a third desing, a translatlantic flying boat, i.e the Ca.8000.

To summarize: Reggiane general manager said that he had in the wings (literally) a mail carrier, a mail and passenger carrier and a large transport. L'Ala attributed to the second one the Re.2007 designation (probably on Alessio input) and the Re.2008 to the racer.


My dear Lark,


I sent those drawings here,because mu dear Skybolt displayed them here at first.

Offline Heroben

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #47 on: October 16, 2013, 03:56:24 pm »
 Oh yeah! The group of friends working on this are from Canada, USA, Russia, Japan, Italy, now I need to find some French acquaintances...
« Last Edit: April 09, 2018, 09:28:31 am by Jemiba »

Offline jimbrooks

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #48 on: October 16, 2013, 08:14:16 pm »
original source: unknown

The Quad Mustang, obviously a fake  :)

Offline Jemiba

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« Reply #49 on: October 25, 2013, 04:29:58 am »
original source: Trait d'Union magazine #136 March-April 1991

mentioned : http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,13770.msg201744.html#new
« Last Edit: December 27, 2015, 02:11:31 am by Jemiba »
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Offline Skyblazer

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #50 on: January 01, 2014, 06:08:36 am »
Organization of this thread is a little complicated, but until a better solution is found, I'll duplicate here some information I already posted in the Gloster designations topic.

Some totally FAKE Gloster aircraft can be found on the web under the designations "G.45 Sea Meteor FSN.6", "SS.39 Gannet", "SS.40 Skipper I" and "SS.42 Skipper II" (the latter in association with Avro of Canada). NONE of these are genuine. They are part of the Wesworld uchronia (a fantasy by an author who imagines an alternate timeline) and must therefore NOT be taken into consideration.

Offline Skyblazer

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #51 on: January 02, 2014, 05:37:30 am »
Would you believe? A simple search on the word "blacklist" on the entire forum through the search engine does NOT bring up this topic!!!

Anyway, the engine is great otherwise, so I guess we'll have to make do with its occasional whims...  ::)

Here is a complete (but oh so beautiful) fake from Japan: the "Lockheed P-37 Fire Eater"!
« Last Edit: April 09, 2018, 09:28:58 am by Jemiba »

Offline Hood

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #52 on: January 02, 2014, 08:12:15 am »
As the creator of those Gloster Wesworld 'fakes' (and many more!), I can only say to everyone, anything you see on Wesworld is fictional, even seemingly real-world names/objects/designations/real never-were's may include elements of fiction.

Offline Jemiba

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #53 on: January 02, 2014, 08:49:32 am »
Would you believe? A simple search on the word "blacklist" on the entire forum through the search engine does NOT bring up this topic!!!

Seems, you have cured this problem !  ;)
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Offline Skyblazer

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #54 on: January 02, 2014, 03:33:27 pm »
As the creator of those Gloster Wesworld 'fakes' (and many more!), I can only say to everyone, anything you see on Wesworld is fictional, even seemingly real-world names/objects/designations/real never-were's may include elements of fiction.

Thanks for setting the record straight! And congratulations on your search for designations that sound authentic. You got me wondering on a couple of occasions (notably on the Meteor 6) and it shows you put a lot of thinking in it, which I can only appreciate since I do the same with my photo-montages of imaginary aircraft! I have toned it down a bit these days however, after realizing my fakes (although clearly labeled as such) were liable to generate confusion with historians in the future, given the way information spreads on the web!

By the way, are your imaginary aircraft purely text creations or did you ever create images for them? I'd be curious to see that!

Offline Hood

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #55 on: January 03, 2014, 03:50:24 am »
Thanks for setting the record straight! And congratulations on your search for designations that sound authentic. You got me wondering on a couple of occasions (notably on the Meteor 6) and it shows you put a lot of thinking in it, which I can only appreciate since I do the same with my photo-montages of imaginary aircraft! I have toned it down a bit these days however, after realizing my fakes (although clearly labeled as such) were liable to generate confusion with historians in the future, given the way information spreads on the web!

By the way, are your imaginary aircraft purely text creations or did you ever create images for them? I'd be curious to see that!

I've drawn a few of them in Shipbucket style (FD-scale) but the majority are modified real aircraft or real never-were's, but some are my own creations. All the relevant illustrations can be found at Wesworld, but you'd need to be a member to see most of them.

Perhaps I'd better include a fuller list to ensure everyone realises the fakes and so these are not mistaken for real project or aircraft (especially if illustrated with real photos and plans). I've not included the Gloster's mentioned above but Stargazer has missed another fake Gloster.

Spitfire F.Mk.IV
Spitfire Trainer T.Mk.VI
Hawker Typhoon IIA
Hawker Tempest F.Mk.I (Napier Sabre), F.Mk.II (RR Griffon), F.Mk.III (RR Vulture), TT.Mk.IV and FB.Mk.VA (Tempest with Typhoon wing); In
Hawker Cyclone F.Mk.I
Vickers-Supermarine Spiteful F.Mk.I and PR.Mk.II and F.Mk.III
Gloster G.39 Gunner (fake name for real G.39)
Boulton Paul P.97 Nighthawk (fake name for real P.97 project)
De Havilland D.H.103 Hornet FB.Mk.I, PR.Mk.II and FR.Mk.III
Vickers Wellington Mk IIIF (fictional IR-sensor equipped nightfighter conversion)
Lysander GR.Mk.III
Fairey Balmoral (fictional land-based Fairey Barracuda)
Fairey Fox II B.Mk.I (fictional land-based Fairey Spearfish)
Wellington B.Mk.IV, B.Mk.V; GR.Mk.VI, B.Mk.VII and GR.Mk.VIII
Boulton Paul P.90 Birmingham (fictional name for real P.90 project)
Bristol 159 Manchester
BCAC (Vickers) Type 601 Windsor B.Mk.III (fictional RR Clyde powered variant)
BCAC (Vickers) Type 497 Westminster B.Mk.I
BCAC (Vickers) Type 507 Westminster B.Mk.II
Fairey Firefly FN.Mk.I and FN.Mk.II (fictional single-seat Firefly)
Vickers-Supermarine Sea Fang FN.Mk.I (fictional Griffon-powered fighter based on Seafire)
Martin-Baker Sea M.B.5 (fictional carrier-based variant)
Blackburn B.44 Firebrand FRN.Mk.I and FRM.Mk.II (fictional development of B.44 project)
Blackburn B.20 Boston (fictional name for real B.20 prototype)
BCAC (Bristol) Type 164 Buccaneer GR.Mk.I (fictional Buckingham variant)
Bristol Type 130 Bermuda (fictional re-naming of Bombay)
Handley Page H.P.89 Hastings C.Mk.II (fictional variant) as is H.P.74 Hermes II airliner
Gloster SS.43 (fictional variable-incidence wing research aircraft)
Gloster G.45 Sea Meteor FSN.Mk.VI
Flettner Fl-282 Hummingbird (fictional name)
ShinRa Aviation CH-2 Liasopod Gyrodyne H.Mk.I (fictional helicopter)
Avro 689 Tudor II, 711 Tudor III, Avro 711A Trader (fictional variants based on real projects)
Avro 700 Ashton (real Avro project but false name)
BCAC (Bristol) Type 174 BC.1 Wayfarer, Type 172 Wayfarer C.Mk.I (fictional variants)
BCAC (Bristol) BC.2 167 Britannia and BC.3 175 Britannia (fictional aircraft)
BCAC (Bristol) 179 BC.4 Super Freighter (fictional but based on real project)
De Havilland DH.97 Ambassador (fictional re-naming of Airspeed AS.57)
General Aviation (UK) Ltd. Tribian Sponson (fake name for real Tribian Sponson project)
General Aviation (UK) Ltd. Aerocar (fake name for Portsmouth Aerocar)
Handley Page H.P.54 Harrow (fictional airliner rather than RAF transport)
Handley Page HP.77 Hampton (fictional)
Miles M.73 Herald (fictional but based on original HP(R) Herald
Saro SR.44 FRN.Mk.I (fictional name for real SR/A.1)
Short S.35 S Class (fictional but based on Shetland)
Short S.45 Solent (fictional)
Short S.32 Sandringham (fictional name for S.32 airliner project)

There are a couple of fake airships too; HMAS No.1 Solaria and HMAS No.2 Olympia; Submarine Scout Pusher (SSP), HMAS No.3; Reconnaissance Scout Class (RS), HMAS No.4 & No.5 and Semi-Rigid Scout Class (RSR), HMAS No.6.

As Argentine player I've devised several wholly fictional types (some of which have already made it onto this site as 'real' projects.

FMA T-514 (fake improved Avro 504 copy)
FMA Llama
FMA I.Ae 1 Guarani
FMA I.Ae 2 and 2T (fake monoplane trainer)
FMA I.Ae 3 and 3T (fake single-seat trainer)
FMA I-100 Barron
FMA I.Ae 4 Courier and 4S torpedo bomber and 4R racer
FMA I.Ae 5 (fictional airliner version of real M.B.2 bomber)
FMA I-01 Buchon
FMA I-02 Pulqui
FMA I.Ae 6T
FMA I.Ae 7 (fictional four-engine airliner)
FMA I.Ae 8 (fictional tourer)
FMA I.Ae 9 (fictional racer)
FMA RP-1 (I.Ae 10) (fictional rocket-powered aircraft)
I.Ae 23 Jaguar
IMPA M.B.1
IMPA SI-21A, SI-21B, SI-21RF, SI-21T and SI-21S
IMPA I-99
IMPA TB-1
Tucan T-17
Tucan T-18 NB-1 and T-18B NB-2


Offline Skyblazer

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #56 on: January 03, 2014, 04:43:24 am »
Wow. That is VERY helpful and I thank you for taking the time to document this.

Being too busy already with the work on this forum and several other activities on the side, I don't think I'd have the time or the incentive to join Wesworld, but I'm sure it must be great.

We have a section here on "Fictional aircraft and theoretical designs", so if ever you so wish, feel free to start a topic to present your creations... ;)

Have a great new and creative year!

Offline hesham

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #57 on: January 13, 2014, 04:44:22 am »
Hi,


I think this aircraft was also from Blacklist;


http://www.pinterest.com/rodneialquati/aviation-aircrafts/

Offline Skyblazer

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #58 on: January 13, 2014, 05:40:26 am »
I think this aircraft was also from Blacklist

The purpose of "blacklisting" certain projects is to warn people who browse the web about types that SEEM to be real projects while they are in fact the product of someone's imagination. The confusion may stem from the use of a name/designation that resembles a real corporate or military name/designation for example. It could also be the result of a fake image looking a lot like a real one.

The image you posted is not a source of confusion for any historian or researcher. It was not meant to pass off as a real project. It DOES belong in the Theoretical and Speculative Designs section, but it is simply an imaginary, notional design such as hundreds of others that can be found in 1920s and 1930s magazines. It would be perfectly all right in the Imagination of the future from the past page, for instance.

Offline hesham

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Re: Fake aircraft and aircraft projects (Blacklist !)
« Reply #59 on: January 13, 2014, 05:44:30 am »
Hi Stargazer,


it was from Nazi imagination for future aircraft,so I put it in blacklist.