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Author Topic: Kharkov's Object 490 Buntar, Bokser and Object 477 "Molot" advanced tanks  (Read 41760 times)

Offline stashandr

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So.. any photo of Ob 477 ?
Take it (object 477)
« Last Edit: August 09, 2015, 09:45:37 am by stashandr »

Offline stealthflanker

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FInally..from Harkonnen a.k.a A Tarasenko.

http://btvt.narod.ru/3/molot.htm

Better descriptions and images.

Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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Article translated:

Quote

Tanks "Rebel", "boxer", "Hammer"
 
A. Tarasenko. BTVT.narod.ru
 
The product is 490 and 490A "Rebel"
The product 477 "Boxer" (Hammer)
The development in the post-Soviet period
Alternatives
Expert Opinions
Related Links
 
Development of future tanks in the 80s was a continuation of work on the NST (New medium tank or "theme 101") started in the early 70s. By the need to create a new generation tank at the end of the 70s came and Receiver AA Morozova General Shomin.
 

List raised to create HCT-80. Blog Entry AA Morozov on 08/17/77
 
It was the initiative work KMDB, which resulted subsequently approved by the Resolution of the Central Committee of the CPSU developing tank "Boxer." Elaboration of a fundamentally new layout of the machine was carried out in several directions, and after a long search and discussions, it was concluded that a significant gap in the characteristics of the tank can be achieved by the imposition of a gun with a caliber152 mm and the use of innovative ideas in the construction of the complex machine control.
The essence of the construction of the complex machine control was integrated management system with the broadest possibilities on the basis of the on-board digital computer system. The complex was to link a powerful artillery and precision missile homing in on a target with vsesutochnym and all-weather sighting system. The binding of the tank to the area and control the fight with the help of satellite navigation, automatic digital secure communication for interaction between the tanks and helicopter gunships. Automation of fire control and movement of the machine with access to the future on a fully robotic tank, the use of state identification and application of   active protection. Thus, interacted with prospective tank developed in the same period advanced helicopter Ka-50 and Mi-28, thus created a single stroke on the basis of a complex of tanks, helicopter gunships and unmanned aerial vehicles.
The product is 490 and 490A "Rebel"

Initially viewed as a promising arrangement of two options: a crew of two people - a product "490" placed in a low-profile turret and a crew of three people - a driver is on the left, the commander of the low-profile turret gunner in the left of the gun - the product "490A."
The product is "490"
The product "4 90 ". Scale model
 
Option promising tank crew 2 people EA Morozova alleged use of hydro-pneumatic suspension. In addition to solving the basic problem - increasing average speeds due to the improvement in ride it   allows you to control clearance of the tank, which increases its permeability, and survivability in combat. In addition, controlled hydropneumatic suspension by changing the trim of the machine increases the corners pointing guns in the vertical plane.
The crew consisted of two people, located in the tower. Traffic control was assumed by means of television stereoscopic television system installed in the bow of the hull.
An important principle implemented in this version, is conditional on the division of the whole machine isolated from each other compartments. The layout of the tank: the first is a fuel cell divided by a partition with a minimum level of armor protection of the most massive tank weapons. Damage to this area and partial loss of fuel in battle will not lead to the loss of its fighting capacity of the tank. Behind him is situated in the center of the tank crew compartment protected primary combined booking and shielded armor nose assembly housing and fuel. Ammunition in the tank was isolated from the crew. To neutralize the high pressures resulting from the detonation of the charges in the roof compartment at the bottom of the hull and turret cover autoloader provided "expelling the plate." Between the tower and autoloader fighting compartment tank had combined bronepregrada preventing the destruction of tanks in the defeat of ammunition.
Armament - 125 mmhigh-power gun 2A66. Aimed   complex was composed of two Panoramic sights without night channel, night sight panaramichesky placed yourself with remote transmission of information from his crew.
The product "490" version of EA  Morozova
The product "4 90 "version of EA Morozov. The shading shows the location of ammunition and fuel
 
Tank with a new layout and a crew two people provides a significant increase in combat performance at low weight and dimensions. At the same time, the transition to the crew consisting of two people, was not well defined, especially in the aspect of the commander of the tank. The low silhouette tank, along with the advantages and disadvantages had - low line of sight and the ability to utykaniya gun into the ground.
 
7.11.80 . In KB Voronin came to watch our perspective, we were with him Anischenko, Chubarenko, Rachitsky and others. E. Morozov was on vacation. Reported two options: Mazurenko crew two and Kovalyuh crew three persons, with the imposition of a new gun125 mm, Gunner and commander to the left of the gun.
 
25-26.03.82. We had a Council of Chief Designers selectable option products Poplar *, were almost all first person. Two variants, the majority were in favor of option Kovalyuha. E. Morozov reported weak and felt that   his version of the crude. At the end of Shomin he spoke and said that in his heart he is for two people, but the question of control tank is almost insoluble, so it can not go for this option. We adopt alternative Kovalyuha.
 
* - In 1981, the long-term development of the MIC tank was cipher "Topol".
 
In 1982 it was decided to stop at the option of the tank with a crew of three. The tank had staked gun, the driver was located on the left side of the tank, to the right housed internal fuel capacity1290 litersThe commander was placed in the fighting compartment of the gunner on the left of the gun. Boarding and leaving the tank was provided through a hatch in the tower.
 
The product "490A" (Rebel)
The product "490A" (Rebel) .
See . Photo threaded layout model - For the 110th anniversary of the birth of Alexander Alexandrovich Morozov )
The product "490A" Rebel
 
                                           The product "490A"
The product "4 90 A "variant VR Kovalyuha
 
In addition to the main armament tank is equipped with two coaxial machine gun caliber 7.62 and remotely controlled  12.7 mmmachine gun. Commander for surveillance and fire control duplication had panaromichesky sight, gunner day sight placed on the left side of the tower, thermal sight was located on the right side of the gun, the image on the screen gunner transferred remotely. Review of the crew provided with fiber-optic devices, placed around the perimeter of the tower.
Ammunition was placed in isolation on the right side of the crew compartment of the tank. The tank was characterized by a high level of reservation, with a minimum of weakened zones. Reservations sides and roof of the tower -   the combined. In 1983 the layout was made ​​a life-size tank for developing the layout and placement of equipment. In 1984, a prototype tank began to pass the test.
 
29.1.83. There was a wooden mock Kovalyuhom on machines with external gun, gunner and commander sitting next. He sat inside and felt   that the option arrangement, apparently out.
Threaded layout 490A   
Threaded layout 490A scale model of the tank 490A
Threaded layout 490A
(Photo: Internet)
Made two prototypes 490A
 
The product 477 "Boxer ***"

In 1984, the long-term project of the tank was made a key change will allow for a significant lead over the existing tanks - the principal decision on the application of powerful 152 mmgun. In developing the "Boxer" Competition between the three Bureau it was announced at the beginning of the work. All presented their projects, military and VNIITM they appreciated and inconclusive - Leningrad and Tagil offered nothing new and promising tank charged with developing KMDB.
Work on future tanks in UKBTM LB and CB no document asked. The publications on the Internet, there is a misconception that allegedly task of creating long-term tank 90 KB asked "Spetsmash" and UKBTM that is not true. At the same time developing initiatives in these CB were, but they are a serious level of Met could not, because did not mount allied armament, electronics, control systems and so forth. An example of such work can serve as a tank with a classical layout "object 187", comparable in the characteristics of a series produced in the period T-80UD.
 
9/10/84 . Arrived guide GBTU and Grau, led by Potapov and Bazhenov with a large retinue to watch Rebel. The ratio of military to the machine was guarded Bazhenov and everything is biased.
In the study reported in Shomina by tanks, began an intense debate, which should be at the caliber guns. On the rebel was outrigger gun,125 mmand for a long time there was talk of increasing caliber. Began unsubstantiated arguments which take caliber - 140mm or 152mm. At this point very well and clearly I made the chief of STC General Grau Litvinenko, draw a graph and just three minutes proved as effective for the caliber of 152mm tank. From this point caliber152 mm  It was adopted for the Boxer and the issue never came back .
 
*** - At the end of the second half of the 80s the theme of "The Boxer" was given a new designation - "The Hammer." How to remember the veterans, KB was connected with a number of data leakage perspective products abroad.
 
In 1985, it approved a new layout of the tank with 152 mmgun. The driver of a tank located on the left, to the right of the fuel tank was located engineered partitioned. The commander and gunner were placed in the body of the tank under the tower and had direct eye contact with each other. The design of automatic loader had a loop at the rear of the crew compartment, replenishment of ammunition is isolated from the compartment located between the motor and gear and crew compartment.
We had the opportunity gunner manual override guidance weapons and turret. Multichannel gunner's sight imagined visual, thermal imaging,   television channel, guided weapons and guided laser rangefinder and automatic tracking system. There was an auxiliary hinge sight. Workplace commander was equipped with panaramicheskim sight. In the center of the crew compartment housed TIUS remote control, access to which was the commander and gunner.
 
Left BTS 152 mm caliber in comparison with the BTS 125 mm caliber
Left BPS separate loading gauge 152 mm versus BTS caliber 125 mm
 
Throughout the period of discount on future tanks have been constant problems and delays associated with the development and supply of components, primarily related to the lag of the USSR in the field of thermal imaging and computers. In 1986, CDB CMH offered to install on the tank, as a temporary solution developed for the production of tanks thermal sight "Agave-2", the offer CB refused. In 1987, the first prototype was assembled tank without sighting system and automatic loader.   In 1988 reliable operation of the automatic loader in the tank to achieve still failed, despite the fact that the machine was working at the stand in the tank with him there were problems. Despite this show of high management (Defense Minister Yazov, ministers Defense Ministry, Ministry of Radio Industry, Mintyazhmasha, Minmasha, Ivanovo, Shabanov, Galkin, Bazhenov, Gerasimov, Zakharov, representatives of the Central Committee of the CPSU), the first sample of the tank was successful - the machine showed a surprisingly high rate (63 km / h). I fired, as well.
The tank's armament consisted of 152 mm 2A73 gun, coaxial machine gun caliber 7.62 (In the original version 2 machine guns), anti-aircraft machine guns 12.7 mm. Subsequently installed automatic gun caliber 23 and later30 mm. The tank was equipped with a device for automatic metering of thermal bend of the barrel in the planes HV and GBV.
 
Trays projectile and charge additional autoloader ed.  477.
Trays projectile and charge additional autoloader ed. 477
 
On top of the tray charge are hooks to capture shots lifting mechanism. To provide compact size provides partial rotation of the shell tray and additional charge to each other.   As consumption expenditure shots in laying the automatic loader (8 shots) trays are automatically replenished from lumpy conveyors (32 shots).
Replenished loading mechanism included two conveyor - top to charges for the lower shells. Each conveyor is a closed circuit in the trays that are placed shells and charges. Drive belts elektromehangichesky.
 Release of pallets is carried out through a hatch in the stern of the imposition of the roof of the tower. Problems autoloader were associated with the need for full mechanization of all caliber ammunition rounds152 mm. Refinements autoloader required considerable time.
For comparison, the object created UKBTM tank 195 is also equipped with 152 mmgun   ammunition was mechanized 24 shots. At the T-14 "Armata" ammunition for125 mm 32 cannon shots.
 
The tank looked very impressive in comparison with the mass-produced cars. Since the height of the line of fire from the product "477" was2088 mm, The T-64 - 1630 mm. The length of the tank with the gun forward was10650 mm, The T-64 - 9225 mm. The height of the roof of the tower -2434 mm, The T-64 2170 mm.

The product is "477" (Boxer). An early version
                                                    The layout of the fuel, ammunition and crew products "477"
The layout of the fuel, ammunition and crew products "477"
 
 
Booking the nose portion of the tank body had a modular structure, its size was Bole 1 min the course of the projectile, much attention was paid to the protection of the tank top and the protection boards. Reservations sides had pyatipregradnuyu structure hatches crew also had a powerful multi-layered protection. An important aspect in ensuring the survival of the tank on the battlefield has been active defense. Considering various options - Arena, Rain, Drozd, Tent.
In ed. "477" have been implemented and tested units undercarriage based ed. "434", increase their operational characteristics:
road wheels with intermediate rubber bumpers, rims reduces wear and increases the stability of the tracks;
suspension with increased dynamic swing, hydraulic shock absorbers with a two-stage characteristic differentiated torsion stiffness, increase the speed and smoothness of the product;
caterpillars closed metallic hinge   (ZMSH)   serial-type wide580 mmImproving engagement with the drive wheel and stseplyaemotyu with the ground, reducing losses in the caterpillar tracks and significantly increase the stability of the caterpillar bypass.
Also improved variants were produced product "477A", one of which was equipped with a gas turbine engine and has been manufactured using a product suspension assemblies "219". The mass of the chassis made by type of product "434" had a mass6760 kgOn the basis of "219" - 8853 kgIe on2093 kg above. Tanks of this modification is also staffed with an auxiliary power unit placed on the fenders on the right. The changes also affected the engine-transmission unit.
In the process of improving the tank was in addition to the main armament automatic gun was changed accommodation coaxial machine gun.  Using a 152 mm gun handed down, on the one hand, reduced the profile of the tower and reduce the reserved space on the other, it eventually had to close from outside influences armored jacket and she became poluvynesennoy received outside the reservation.
To increase the firepower to destroy   ground and air targets tank was in addition to the main armament automatic gun. Guidance and Stabilization gun vertically independent, horizontally - along with the tower. It changed accommodation coaxial machine gun, crew accommodation inspection devices and so on. Use152 mm the imposition of a gun, on the one hand, reduced the profile of the tower and reduce the reserved space on the other, it eventually had to close from outside influences armored jacket and she became poluvynesennoy received outside the reservation.
 
Having layout with external gun in the world tank manufacturing has never been done, developers are faced with a very serious problem. At first, she was placed on the roof of the tower in a small box. The first sample was made showed that the tank to be operated with a gun is impossible. Marked gun not protected not only from the shells, but also of everything that gets in the tank - water, mud, twigs, stones. In addition, when loading offers access to the inside of the machine and everything fell into bed falls inside. The problem, apparently, and simple, but it could not solve. As a result, over the fact that the gun booked and appeared on the tower casing, which increased the weight of the machine and overlaps the field of view of the impact of the complex. This is especially touched panorama, had significantly increased its periskopichnost.
Adoption of technical solutions on the tank allow to achieve a significant lead over the current generation of machines. At the same time, chasing the maximum specifications of firepower and protection,   thus surpassing even the requirements Genzakazchika had to sacrifice the weight of the machine, which has reached a critical point and forced to do some nodes from titanium. Thus titanium produces equipment for the entrenchment, cover containers dynamic protection units and a number of other elements. All technical problems were encountered and solved gradually they left, but it took time, sometimes very significant. Design and development testing continued in the 89-90 year, in 1992, planned state tests of an experimental batch of machines. Even before the completion of the GOP customer demanded manufacturing of an experimental batch of 50 machines. But in the end the tank was brought in a very bad time of the collapse of the USSR, when the priority was the survival of enterprises, rather than expensive long-term development.
 
Hammer 477 product tank Hammer Tank deposited in the UPI
Hammer Tank deposited in the UPI
(Photo: Internet)
 
Produced more than 10 samples. lay the groundwork for the manufacture of pre-production party. The tanks are stored on the test base KMDB (RLE). Also, a few samples are in the territory of the Russian Federation. It is likely that the demonstration in the Russian tanks "Armata" renewed interest in the future tanks KMDB both the country's developer, as a variant of a joint project with foreign customers.
The development in the post-Soviet period (Note)

477 tank with a new automatic loader on the basis of sets of running gear ed.  "434"
Option tank 477, has received a new automatic loader on the basis of sets of running gear ed. "434" release1993.
Changed as armor protection of the tower, and the frontal part of the hull sides, set protection branch caterpillar front. Protection modules turret and hull are made of titanium.
 
In the tank there were two "highlights" - poluvynesennaya 152 mm and gun control system. What was included in the prospective tank , at the time , had no analogues in any tank in the world. Much has not been implemented to this day. Starting from the impact of the complex with all kinds of control channels and ending with onboard computing system, satellite navigation, SAR, state identification system, motion control systems and tank fire by radio. Also conducted testing of MSA with the television channel with the automatic capture and target tracking and laser channel CO 2 for targeting missiles with semi-active homing and radar detection and capture targets. Experimental samples of radar checked on the tank (RFCs "Arguzin" Institute of Signal). The results were initially disappointing, the underlying surface distort the signal , and even a moving target is difficult to be detected on the ground.
After many design studies and trials, the customer decided to move to a new shot with large dimensions, which is under construction and has developed a new automatic loader. New shot had a very respectable size - up1.8M. The main task was to ensure the reliability of the automated installation and the greatest possible number of shots and as little as possible during the preparation   and production of the first shot, which is one of the defining characteristics of the tank. This design makes it possible to dramatically reduce this time, as there is no double chambering. It has developed a new automatic loader, which consisted of accommodation in the center of the crew compartment consumable drum 10 shots   and two replenishing drums placed along the body of 12 shots each. With all the cons of it went through a significant reduction of the time of preparation and production of the first shot (at least 4) and substantially simplify the construction AZ.
The development of the tank 477, received after the collapse of the Soviet Union in Ukraine marking note continued.   There were manufactured prototypes of the tank on the basis of sets of running gear ed. "434" and "219". Work on the new tank were before the 2000s, together with the Russian Federation.
Prospective tank developed with the involvement of enterprises   of the former USSR. So 2A73 cannon and ammunition for it developed and manufactured in Russia, so the implementation of the project within the framework of lack of funding Armed Forces on the territory of Ukraine at the moment, without the involvement of external sources is difficult, although attempts to establish152 mmgun Kiev CB-A and implemented. A number of realized for ed. 477 and its variants of elements, including TIUS have been introduced in the tank "Hold."
 
Produced two sample elements based suspension ed. 434 and 219
Alternatives

As part of the new tank, there are two directions, one of which (VR Kovalyuh) provided for the establishment of the tank on the basis of traditional technologies in tank.
Other (AV Bershov) provided for the establishment of the tank with electromechanical transmission and electromagnetic cannon. Mechanical transmission branch was designed AA Sakun (KMDB. Morozov),   electrical branch (electric unit) - VI Trofimenko MEI Moscow.
"Highlight" of the tank was the electric unit, which allowed "almost instantly"   switch from motor mode   into generator mode, transforming the kinetic energy into electrical energy and the tank, creating a short-term double engine power to make a shot. The cooling system developed for electrical installation Kiev Institute of Thermal Technology. By the end of 1990, the technical project was completed EMT. As a manufacturer has been selected Moscow plant "Bolshevik." The collapse of the Soviet Union (August1991.) Put a final "cross" on the draft of the tank with EMT.
Expert Opinions

"Hammer" suffered the fate of the storm, but unlike the latter
he was not simply copying is not always successful foreign ideas
a breakthrough in tank building.
 
At the moment, the appearance and characteristics of tanks developed under the "Rebel" and "The Boxer" were not disclosed. The only data available in the Internet at the moment include the only photo of the tank placed on one of the Bulgarian military history forums. The only reliable source on the subject were published in 2009 journals Apukhtina Yu, one of the developers of promising tank.
However, the network is a huge topic of interest, given that the possibility of publishing photos and other documents on this issue at the moment is difficult on there a lot of speculation.
As an example, the discussion on the subject of the Russian expert A. and B. Hlopotova Murakhovski. In an interview given to the comparison of ideas KMDB tank design and development UKBTM tanks - T-95 and T-14.
 
Murakhovski: About the experience I will say this. Most ofigitelnye was the first acquaintance with ob.195 - break template that is configured on the classic layout, long experience of close "dialogue" with Panzer from T-54 to T-80, their foreign "partners". Potkin led a revolution in the world tank manufacturing. Feature of many, and he with his colleagues of the NT embodied.
The family "Armata" - the heir of the decisions at the time, with all due respect to current employees UKBTM. But before Terlikovym is a mammoth task - to start a family in the series.
 
Khlopotov: Potkin certainly was a man with a capital letter, but again, do not go too well. After reviewing the working papers on the grind, Notte and protein, I admired a lot more guys from Kharkiv headed Shomina. T-95 compared to those machines was suck ! That you yourself, as a tanker officer like yourself would feel in combat, with only 24 of the projectile in BC? And this despite the fact that your board pierced by any more or less modern RPGs?
 
Khlopotov (on the tank "Armata"): So I from the beginning it was in opposition. In 195 at least some sense was, though , the complete fulfillment of VIM out in the next branch, wrote that he was "breaking the pattern" when he saw the 195, and I have such a gap was when I got exhaustive materials on the Kharkov and St. Petersburg machines , that's when me something much became sad ...
 
Memories of one embodiment of a test tank (1998-2000.)
 
... GABTU, GKOT Academy BTV, industrial research institutes and other key players from all over the USSR ... just developed the concept of the Hammer. Yes, the idea was Kharkov, but taking into account the implementation of GABTU, GKOT Academy BTV, industrial research institutes and other key stakeholders. So it is not necessary to show all of himself in the role of Ivan, not mindful of kinship. This whiff " dermokratizmom " .
I was last in the KMDB in December 2000. During the period 1998-2000 gg I once sat in the car, guided weapons. In December 2000 Hammer slelat few dozen shots. It was a living machine, I did feel.
 
 
... Moving away 200 meters from the metro station, you find yourself in a world that is completely separated from our reality. Here, everything is subject to the same strict rhythm - to issue "on the mountain" another sample of the armored vehicles.
Wide communicating evidence of numerous working personnel of the enterprise. Vigilant watchman for a long time to collate your "face" on the pass of the original. Finding no special differences, supportive nod permits to follow the entrance of the plant.
If you know where to go, it is not very long for straying factory lanes, you finally can get closer to one of the internal structures, commonly called "experimental assembly." Again another "VOHR" vigilantly watching the so-called "inner passage", looking at it the right stamp, allowing you to go to the shop.
And here you are in the holy of holies KMDB - in the shop pilot assembly. Since the tank without arms - it's just "peacefully tractor plowing the land", the first pass in the mining sector of the device, which features a tank on the tractor. It is called the "MZ" - ie, loading mechanism.
Load in the real dimensions of the tank roll bar opens all the stuffing "peacefully plowing tractor." We climb the stairs to the level of his body and try to dip into the driver's hatch, located on the axis of the machine. It is not strange, but it is in its place, you can witness and feel the force of arms firepower. Triplex, pedals, controls - all normal. For those who saw the tank "is not in the picture", will be a new presence on the sides of the workplace of the driver a couple of "revolving" drums is clearly not in the caliber 7.62 mm. On the entire length of the driver's compartment stretches the main boeukladki (BU) of the tank. Smart systems are distinguished, when and where was the owner of this type of ammunition. From the shoulder "fur-water" to the spinning reels - no more150 mm. Modestly but with taste - in the tank is not too much space. These "revolver" is the main tank ammunition. A reasonable question - "Where is all this deetsya"?
To view this matter will follow in the fighting compartment. Leaving the separation of management and rank in the fighting compartment. Like all the latest products KMDB, it has a classical scheme - gunner (NO) on the left and the tank commander (CT) on the right. Alas, his hands shake, they can not - another "Revolver" separates them. This so-called "consumable" drum. And once again raises the question - "Who lives in this teremochke?" And live there, those who have forwarded during the boot process from the main combat pack. The nomenclature of "living" in the attics (as in the main ECU) determines the appropriate order.
So we have than to shoot. And how to do it? Silently.
Systems of search, detection and identification purposes can fire from a tank weapons as gunner and tank commander. It is a pity, however, that for them (each) allocated only 0.8 "cube" space. Yes, there is some discomfort, but only at first. After two or three hours spent in the "sarcophagus", nothing you do not hesitate and do not interfere with your "work".
Why are we, as they say in Odessa, we have to work? And around. Wide panoramic sights multichannel allows both NO and CT use all the features of a tank weapons. Power ammunition allows to hit as armored and open the target location. With sufficient probability of defeat and a fairly large range. And given ur (guided missile), and in general - at the limit of visibility for a typical theater of operations. So long as "Abrash" We will seek out the central Marochko, we have already done. While in Ukraine, "Abrasha" already as allies present.
 
 
SpyLOG
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Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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Object 477 Bokser / Molot images. Finally, its the FST-2 :) According to the article the name change came after a security leak.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2015, 12:33:02 am by PaulMM (Overscan) »
"They can't see our arses for dust."
 
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Offline jsport

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Object 477 Bokser / Molot images. Finally, its the FST-2 :) According to the article the name change came after a security leak.
is there any more descript on img 015 ie engine vs ammo vs crew etc. ?

Offline Avimimus

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It'd also be interesting to find out the tonnage of 'Rebel'.


I'm probably more curious to get exact translations of some of the advanced systems though...

Offline LVisingr

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It'd also be interesting to find out the tonnage of 'Rebel'.


According to the quotes by author of the article at Russian forums: Buntar under 60 tons, Boxer/Molot 52-55 tons, Nota 61-62 tons.

« Last Edit: August 14, 2015, 10:18:32 pm by PaulMM (Overscan) »

Offline jsport

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It'd also be interesting to find out the tonnage of 'Rebel'.


According to the quotes by author of the article at Russian forums: Buntar under 60 tons, Boxer/Molot 52-55 tons, Nota 61-62 tons.
is there open crew escape space out the rear of the tank next the engine compartment  vice img015 above?

Offline LVisingr

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It'd also be interesting to find out the tonnage of 'Rebel'.


According to the quotes by author of the article at Russian forums: Buntar under 60 tons, Boxer/Molot 52-55 tons, Nota 61-62 tons.
is there open crew escape space out the rear of the tank next the engine compartment  vice img015 above?


No, there is ammunition storage.

Offline jsport

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It'd also be interesting to find out the tonnage of 'Rebel'.


According to the quotes by author of the article at Russian forums: Buntar under 60 tons, Boxer/Molot 52-55 tons, Nota 61-62 tons.
is there open crew escape space out the rear of the tank next the engine compartment  vice img015 above?


No, there is ammunition storage.
thank you

Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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It'd also be interesting to find out the tonnage of 'Rebel'.


According to the quotes by author of the article at Russian forums: Buntar under 60 tons, Boxer/Molot 52-55 tons, Nota 61-62 tons.


Short tons or metric tonnes? Makes quite a difference.
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Offline dan_inbox

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Do Russians ever speak in English tons rather than metric tonnes?

Offline LVisingr

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It'd also be interesting to find out the tonnage of 'Rebel'.'
According to the quotes by author of the article at Russian forums: Buntar under 60 tons, Boxer/Molot 52-55 tons, Nota 61-62 tons.
Short tons or metric tonnes? Makes quite a difference.

Sorry, my fault, everything is in metric tonnes, of course. I am Czech and I have sometimes little mess in all these weight units... :)
« Last Edit: August 15, 2015, 02:43:15 am by LVisingr »

Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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After the first, low profile Izdeliye 490 version was abandoned, 490A and 477 were as tall and as heavy as their Western rivals it seems. All credit to Kharkov though for continuing their history of radical designs. If they'd managed to put some 490A prototypes into May day celebrations in the late 80s, I'm sure it would have caused quite a stir!


The major barrier to these tanks entering production was really the required electronics being beyond the capacity of Soviet industry.
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Offline LVisingr

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Revised info about the weights:


490A Buntar - under 60 tonnes
477 Bokser/Molot (with the old conveyor loading system) - 51-55 tonnes
477A Molot (with the new drum loading system) - 57 tonnes
477A1 Nota - 61-62 tonnes


With steel armor (as in older types), Nota would have been even much heavier, about 67-69 tonnes, but thanks to using advanced titanium armor, the weight was eventually "only" 61-62 tonnes. However, in terms of Soviet/Russian tank design school, this thing was a MONSTER that would ruin Soviet/Russian army logistics, created to support tanks with weight under (or maybe very slightly over) 50 tonnes. This was probably one of the main reasons for terminating these too-much-ambitious projects. Also Object 195 (T-95) was too heavy (52-58 tonnes) and the engineers of Uralvagonzavod were tasked to create something lighter. The final result is T-14 Armata with combat weight of 48 tonnes (the kit for urban operations adds 5 tonnes more).