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Author Topic: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?  (Read 106417 times)

Offline marauder2048

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #435 on: March 10, 2019, 11:26:03 pm »
An FA-16 could lob 30mm guided rds BLOS to stop advancing armor if the DARPA MADFIRES program is proves out. Given a previous program allowed a F-15 to lob unguided cannon accurately some time back.

The slant ranges looked at for the guided 30x173 round for the AC-130 were 2.5 - 3.0 nautical miles @ 15,000 ft and above.
Not sure what kind of impact velocity say PGU-14/B would have. But I suppose there's nothing preventing you
from developing a HEDP type round.

 

Offline jsport

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #436 on: March 11, 2019, 08:42:21 am »
An FA-16 could lob 30mm guided rds BLOS to stop advancing armor if the DARPA MADFIRES program is proves out. Given a previous program allowed a F-15 to lob unguided cannon accurately some time back.

The slant ranges looked at for the guided 30x173 round for the AC-130 were 2.5 - 3.0 nautical miles @ 15,000 ft and above.
Not sure what kind of impact velocity say PGU-14/B would have. But I suppose there's nothing preventing you
from developing a HEDP type round.

Flying low enough to avoid AAA and rendering all but the more sophisticated "look down" SAMs unable to gain LOS.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2019, 08:45:27 am by jsport »

Offline TomS

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #437 on: March 11, 2019, 09:08:39 am »
Flying low is pretty much the perfect way to NOT avoid AAA.   


Offline jsport

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #438 on: March 11, 2019, 12:43:40 pm »
Flying low is pretty much the perfect way to NOT avoid AAA.

Unless you know exactly where the AAA is prior, and they never know you where there until their "suppressed" and your gone.

Offline quellish

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #439 on: March 11, 2019, 03:16:47 pm »

Unless you know exactly where the AAA is prior, and they never know you where there until their "suppressed" and your gone.

So... invisible, silent, and not dropping ordinance. Got it.

Offline sferrin

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #440 on: March 11, 2019, 03:25:56 pm »
Flying low is pretty much the perfect way to NOT avoid AAA.

Unless you know exactly where the AAA is prior, and they never know you where there until their "suppressed" and your gone.

LOL!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_attack_on_Karbala
"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.

Offline jsport

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #441 on: March 11, 2019, 08:25:42 pm »
Flying low is pretty much the perfect way to NOT avoid AAA.

Unless you know exactly where the AAA is prior, and they never know you where there until their "suppressed" and your gone.

LOL!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_attack_on_Karbala
yes well aware an example of incompetence at all levels.

Pg 54 different world
synoptic surveilance  and multi-spectral well beyond this from stated AF sat program goals.
press article some time back  'three tanks gather some where in the world ..someone knows
https://fas.org/irp/program/collect/cbo-radar.pdf

Offline jsport

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #442 on: March 11, 2019, 08:28:07 pm »

Unless you know exactly where the AAA is prior, and they never know you where there until their "suppressed" and your gone.

So... invisible, silent, and not dropping ordinance. Got it.
not sure whether your following the conversation. lobbed guided gunfire from a couple miles out. . Aircraft asending and reversing after the shot.

Offline marauder2048

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #443 on: March 11, 2019, 11:21:10 pm »
I've seen claims that reliably detecting (non-SPAAG) AAA via SAR requires resolution < 0.1m.

That's pretty hard to do from space. I agree that space-based SAR could help
you narrow down probable AAA locations to the point that a very high
resolution fighter-based SAR could do the rest.

Offline Arjen

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #444 on: March 12, 2019, 03:42:20 am »
lobbed guided gunfire from a couple miles out
What about a howitzer for that? Spotter with laser designator in line of sight, guided rounds.

Offline Foo Fighter

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #445 on: March 12, 2019, 04:11:25 am »
The problem with artillery (SP or towed) is that in a high intensity engagement it would have to move after firing one or two rounds to avoid CB fire.  Aircraft tend to move all the time.  IMHO, rotary assets are best for this type of engagement where AA of all types require mitigation.

Offline jsport

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #446 on: March 12, 2019, 09:52:24 am »
I've seen claims that reliably detecting (non-SPAAG) AAA via SAR requires resolution < 0.1m.

That's pretty hard to do from space. I agree that space-based SAR could help
you narrow down probable AAA locations to the point that a very high
resolution fighter-based SAR could do the rest.
Thank you for pointing that out as was considering. Non SPAAG AAA should be well known though overtime sensing. SPAAG amoung advancing mechanized forces will not likely be advancing quite the same as tanks.

Any craft replacing the A-10 would indeed need very high
resolution fighter-based SAR such as BAI/CAS dedicated F-16. Still would argue AFTI tech would assist in survival and specific targeting from max gun range distance. Yes shaped charges in autocannon rds.

Offline marauder2048

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #447 on: March 13, 2019, 08:43:14 am »
The problem with artillery (SP or towed) is that in a high intensity engagement it would have to move after firing one or two rounds to avoid CB fire.  Aircraft tend to move all the time.  IMHO, rotary assets are best for this type of engagement where AA of all types require mitigation.

IIRC, the guided artillery rounds aren't moving that fast terminally and might be within intercept capability of an APS.

Offline Foo Fighter

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #448 on: March 13, 2019, 08:49:12 am »
Sorry but I do not get your point.

Offline marauder2048

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Re: Continuing relevance of the A-10 Warthog today and tomorrow?
« Reply #449 on: March 13, 2019, 09:33:56 am »
I was suggesting that CB fire might be less of an issue than the fact that the shells themselves
are within the intercept capability of the accompanying SPAAGs or the APS.