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Author Topic: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)  (Read 19927 times)

Offline FighterJock

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #75 on: June 21, 2017, 11:48:51 am »
DGA wants to spend money it doesn't have. The whole article is obviously written from discussions with Dassault/DGA and as such represents their hopes and dreams viewpoint, not necessarily reality.

The UK has been all over double edge planforms since FOAS days if you look back

I am old enough to remember reading about some of the designs for FOAS and being impressed by some of them, including one that looked almost like Replica.

Offline mrmalaya

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #76 on: June 22, 2017, 05:01:35 am »
I know you can say that the most imaged FOAS study was a double edge platform but the DGA/Onera one is very similar to what we are being shown for FCAS. That said, all we hear these days is the French side of things.

When did you last hear or see anything on the UK work?


« Last Edit: June 22, 2017, 05:31:50 am by mrmalaya »

Offline red admiral

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #77 on: June 22, 2017, 12:35:23 pm »
When did you last hear or see anything on the UK work?

Yes the MoD doesn't brief journalists or allow Industry to, beyond agreed things, as there's no benefit in doing so. This doesn't mean that nothing is happening.

Chris Lee has done his lecture on Taranis aerodynamics a few times now, which is a masterpiece in saying nothing.

Offline mrmalaya

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #78 on: June 22, 2017, 12:50:38 pm »
Well hopefully there is still scope for it to look a bit more refined than the Dassault imagery suggests. That is depicting their original design from a few years ago anyway.


Offline Harrier

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #79 on: June 22, 2017, 01:20:20 pm »
Quote
Chris Lee has done his lecture on Taranis aerodynamics a few times now, which is a masterpiece in saying nothing.

How much could be said on the aerodynamics of a subsonic non manoeuvring drone anyway? "Keep. The. Flow. Attached."?
« Last Edit: June 22, 2017, 01:27:22 pm by Harrier »
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Offline Trident

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #80 on: June 23, 2017, 01:10:51 pm »
Having googled Mr. Lee's name in connection with Taranis, a lot seems to concern engine integration (nozzle & particularly inlet). Makes sense, given the rather eccentric, LO-driven inlet shape that is probably non-trivial to achieve decent flow quality with.

Offline Flyaway

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #81 on: June 29, 2017, 12:36:05 pm »
Europe’s Complex UAV Studies Delivering Tangible Results

Maturing UAV studies suggest Europe’s governments are taking sovereign unmanned capabilities more seriously

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Meanwhile, the veil has been lifted on British and French plans to develop unmanned combat air vehicle (UCAV) demonstrators planned for flight in 2025.

The €2 billion ($2.2 billion) program, agreed to by the governments in March 2016 in Amiens, France, looks set to deliver two advanced UCAVs, one to each country—which while nearly identical, will feature sovereign capabilities in terms of the radar, electronic warfare and electro-optical systems.

Concluding the joint Future Combat Air System (FCAS) feasibility study, signed off on at the 2014 Farnborough Airshow, officials from both countries have agreed to proceed on a platform to be powered by a derivative of Safran’s M88 turbofan engine, which powers the Dassault Rafale fighter.

They have also adopted a so-called “cranked kite” planform for the system, similar to that used on Northrop Grumman’s X-47. The platforms will be as long as that of a Dassault Rafale or Eurofighter Typhoon but will feature a larger wingspan. Total weight will be comparable to the two fighter jets, with the platforms optimized for range and endurance at subsonic speeds.

Quote
While much of the FCAS program’s progress has so far been kept under wraps, a series of scenario videos shown by French defense procurement agency DGA, illustrated key areas of study. Among the ones being explored by the development teams are use of artificial intelligence (AI) to assist ground operators with mission planning, target acquisition and on-the-fly analysis of threats.

In one scenario, the AI identified which UCAV, from a flight of four, was best suited to attacking a particular target type based on the UCAV’s weapon load, fuel status and other parameter sets. And as BAE has already demonstrated with Taranis, the UCAV can be requested to search for a target and report its findings to the operator.

At the moment the focus, in France at least, has been on controlling the UCAVs from a ground station, but officials are also looking at how technologies such as augmented reality can ease operator workloads.

However, officials note that the capabilities being developed for the UCAV could also apply to Rafale upgrades. Technologies being developed for the UCAV’s radar will likely feature in the Rafale’s future development road map.

http://aviationweek.com/technology/europe-s-complex-uav-studies-delivering-tangible-results
« Last Edit: June 29, 2017, 12:48:05 pm by Flyaway »

Offline totoro

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #82 on: June 30, 2017, 12:39:06 am »
So... operational UCAVs starting to enter french/british air forces in 2030-2035 period? If the political will to pursue to project is still there?
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Offline mrmalaya

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #83 on: June 30, 2017, 02:58:49 am »
Hmm.

Perhaps I had misinterpreted the "cranked kite" definition as applying solely to the French design?

http://aviationweek.com/shownews/bae-stealthily-posits-future-ucav-concept


Offline Harrier

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #84 on: June 30, 2017, 03:06:54 am »
If the political will to pursue to project is still there?

In light of the UK election result I would not be surprised if the UK side  of FCAS suddenly went to Bombardier in Belfast!  :o

Seriously, the whole Brexit issue will complicate things, although I will believe any high end combat system from UK/Europe when I see it.
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Offline mrmalaya

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #85 on: November 12, 2017, 12:27:26 pm »
This could be the UK cranked delta version of the planform Dassault has been publicising in the past couple of years.

Dates from Farnborough last year.

Obviously BAE like their intake.

It also looks to me as if the fuselage forward of the wing is narrower and more pointed than the French design we have been shown.

« Last Edit: November 13, 2017, 07:07:31 am by mrmalaya »

Offline Deltafan

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #86 on: November 13, 2017, 04:27:00 pm »
It also looks to me as if the fuselage forward of the wing is narrower and more pointed than the French design we have been shown.
It seems :
« Last Edit: November 13, 2017, 04:29:28 pm by Deltafan »

Offline mrmalaya

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #87 on: November 13, 2017, 11:11:38 pm »
You agree?

The fuselage joins the wing inboard or at the same point as the rear fuselage, whereas on the French artwork its been outboard of that point since the beginning.

At the end of the day its comparison of a model from BAE, but its the first one that appears in context and resembles the supposed shared design.

Offline Deltafan

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Re: Future Combat Air System (FCAS)
« Reply #88 on: November 14, 2017, 04:08:12 am »
You agree?
Yes.

As the 2 prototypes FCAS/SCAF must have the same "basis" but different "systems". It will be interesting to compare their shapes, when they will fly.