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Author Topic: Little-Known French Projects and Prototypes  (Read 101991 times)

Offline Jemiba

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #120 on: February 19, 2014, 08:36:50 am »
Interesting find, hesham !
Perhaps one of our native french speakers could help here : The design reminds me to
Gerald Herricks Convertaplanes ( http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,19837.msg202197.html#msg202197)
and in the text I found "..l'immobilisation en vol", which I would translate as "fixed during flight".
And the 3-view somehow suggests, too, that during cruising flight the rotor should be stopped
and work as a fixed wing.
It takes a long time, before all mistakes are made ...

Offline hesham

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #121 on: February 19, 2014, 01:44:34 pm »
Thank you my dear Jemiba.

Offline hesham

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #122 on: February 21, 2014, 05:37:29 am »
Hi,


here is a strange concept for Leyat designer;


http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k6556091g/f2.image

Offline hesham

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #123 on: February 21, 2014, 07:43:09 am »
Hi,


here is a strange ideas from L'Aerophile February 1937,from Santos Dumont,Antoinette
and Bleriot.

Offline hesham

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #124 on: February 22, 2014, 04:02:35 am »
Hi,


here is the Carmier T-10 light aircraft.


http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k6556104n/f2.image

Offline hesham

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #125 on: February 22, 2014, 05:31:16 am »
Hi,


here is a strange seaplane design,created by Chantiere Europeens de Constructions
Aeronautiques or C.E.C.A,and I don't know what was its motor,a jet engine ?.


http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k65559918/f2.image

Offline hesham

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #126 on: February 22, 2014, 01:31:29 pm »
Hi,


here is a strange seaplane design,created by Chantiere Europeens de Constructions
Aeronautiques or C.E.C.A,and I don't know what was its motor,a jet engine ?.


http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k65559918/f2.image


Was this engine working by compressed air,I can't translate well the French language.

Offline bigvlada

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #127 on: February 22, 2014, 11:03:54 pm »
Hi,


here is the Astra two seat recce and trainer biplane;


http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k6568240r/f2.image
I magnified the whole page from the link in order to read the whole text. Now, my primary school French is rusty, but I'm certain the text says that the aircraft in those two pictures is an new design from Astra company located in Arad.
This link (http://aviatia.cda.ro/15years.htm) about history of pre WW2 romanian aircraft manufacturing says that there was an aircraft maker in Arad named Astra. Most of the pictures are missing, but the one which link still remains looks a lot like our mystery aircraft, they named it S.E.T. 7. Seems that there were small variations between various S.E.T. 3-7 models.

Offline dan_inbox

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #128 on: February 22, 2014, 11:14:48 pm »
http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k65559918/f2.image

Was this engine working by compressed air,I can't translate well the French language.
The text says "à réaction directe ... avec 5 tuyères" which would be a 5-exhaust jet engine. It also mentions an auxilliary Diesel engine for maneuvering an electricity generation.
1922 is a little early for jet engines, ain't it?  The description  resembles an early ramjet or statojet.


Heavy-lifter long-range, jet propelled, pressurized and made out of "néocellulose?  quite the  visionaries!

Offline avion ancien

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #129 on: February 23, 2014, 02:29:18 am »
If it should prove that the 'Astra two seat recce and trainer biplane' is, in fact, Romanian in origin, perhaps it's a matter of concern that it should be held out as being French in origin, in that it has been posted as a little-known French project or prototype. The fact that a picture and/or drawing and/or description of an aircraft appears in a French aviation journal doesn't mean that the aircraft is French. Les Ailes and its contemporaries were very cosmopolitan in their approach and featured many aircraft, from Europe and the wider world, on their pages. Thus I do feel that every attempt should be made to ascertain, by cross referencing insofar as is possible, that a hitherto unknown - at least to the participants to this forum - aircraft is, in fact, French - in design or manufacture - before giving it such an attribution by posting it on this thread. The risk from this is that, ultimately, the aircraft may come to be accepted as French, simply by its presence in this thread, when it has done no more than appear in a French aviation journal. That way history is misrepresented. Perhaps, unless there is clear evidence that an aircraft is French, in design or manufacture, it should be described as a little-known project or prototype that may have been designed and/or manufactured in France.

By way of corollary, I also have some concerns about describing the Hennion as a French aircraft when, it appears, it was designed and manufactured in Morocco. M Hennion may have been French and he may have designed and built his aeroplane in French Morocco. But does that make it French? If a British citizen designed and built an aeroplane in India before WW2, is that a British aircraft? I think that most people would consider it to be an Indian aircraft. If it's otherwise, someone had better undertake a significant rewriting of A.J.Jackson's British Civil Aircraft!   

Offline hesham

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #130 on: February 23, 2014, 04:18:14 am »
Thank you Dan and Avion.

Offline hesham

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #131 on: February 23, 2014, 04:31:04 am »
Hi,


here is the Chassaing-Dorand biplane ambulance aircraft project;


http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k65682660/f5.image

Offline avion ancien

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #132 on: February 23, 2014, 10:25:00 am »
Attached is the whole of the report from les Ailes of 1 February 1940 concerning the Hennion monoplane. If one looks at the opening sentence of the second paragraph, where the place of construction should appear, irritatingly one finds the word 'censuré'. Thus maybe I was too swift in judging this aeroplane as Moroccan rather than French (but perhaps Maveric can identify the source of his information that it was constructed in Morocco). However I do not resile from the general principle of my argument, namely that it is preferable to attribute an aircraft designed and/or built in a country under colonial rule to the geographical country rather than to the foreign power that rules it at that time. Otherwise all aircraft designed and/or constructed before August 1947 in what is now India, Pakistan and Bangladesh will have to be called British!   
« Last Edit: February 23, 2014, 10:28:43 am by avion ancien »

Offline c460

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #133 on: February 23, 2014, 11:35:36 am »
Hi avion_ancien,

The Hennion also appears in Les Ailes 28/12/1939, where the town name Casablanca is not censored:
http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k6554721m/f5.image

By the way, Charles Claveau includes Hennion (who made no other aircraft) among French aircraft manufacturers in Trait d'Union no.215. But I agree that the attribution is borderline.

Adrien

Offline Maveric

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Re: Little-known French projects and prototypes
« Reply #134 on: February 23, 2014, 12:15:05 pm »
Hi avion ancien,my source was the L+K, but I can´t say which issue. I believe 2013 or 2012...
I see you on the dark side of the moon.