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Author Topic: CAC Postwar Projects  (Read 50439 times)

Offline Armchair Admiral

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CAC Postwar Projects
« on: February 13, 2007, 09:36:18 pm »


About 10 years ago Air Enthusiast published an article on CAC projects. One was, if memory serves, the XP 65 Warrior, a stainless steel supersonic fighter bomber. AE reproduced a small scale picture but very little information. Does anyone have further information or pictures on Commonwealth supersonic projects?

Offline hesham

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2007, 09:09:36 am »
Hi,

I don't know the project XP-65,but I have a picture of CAC-31
mock-up from my dear Jon.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2012, 06:42:31 am by hesham »

Offline pometablava

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2007, 09:14:00 am »
I only have the AE article, no more info available :'(

Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2007, 02:15:27 am »
I have the articles you were referring to.  The XP-65 was to be powered by a RA24R Avon series engine.  Span was 7.3m, length was 14.3m.

Here are some pics from them.  First the XP-65:




And the related XP-68 - this was also to be built of stainless steel.  It was to be powered by a RR Avon RA19R.  It also had provision for a search radar.  Armament was 2 30mm cannon + 1 missile on each wingtip + another semi-recessed under the fuselage.  It was to be Mach 2 capable and was largely seen as a competitor to the F-104



Regards,

Greg
« Last Edit: October 04, 2010, 10:11:18 am by Matej »

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2007, 12:10:03 pm »
Hi GTX,

probably the XP-65 and -68 weren't  "absolute stealth" designs ?    ;)
But I know those technical problems, just today I could make my
scanner work again :
Here the mentioned pictures of the AA-107 and another view of the
Ca-31 mock-up :


« Last Edit: December 20, 2007, 12:50:49 pm by overscan »
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Offline Maveric

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2007, 02:15:13 am »
Hi all,

any information´s for the projects CA.21; CA.23 and CA.24 ?

Servus Maveric
I see you on the dark side of the moon.

Offline hesham

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #6 on: February 16, 2007, 03:23:20 am »
Hi Maveric,

For the CA.23 see in designation system,  http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1213.0.html
and for CA.21 it was a furhter 250 Mustangs,but was cancelled.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2010, 09:06:22 am by hesham »

Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #7 on: February 16, 2007, 11:38:42 am »
Some more Pics of the CA.23 (including mock-up pics):






Regards,

Greg

Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #8 on: February 16, 2007, 12:01:36 pm »
Other interceptor proposals from CAC included:

The XP-46 - this was to be powered by an afterburning Avon RA-7R and was hoped to achieve 750 kts at 45000 ft.  it was to be armed with two 30mmm cannon:


This was followed by a Rocket (probably using similar motors to the Bell X-1) powered interceptor, the XP-47.  It was to be armed with six 3inch Oerlikon or Mighty Mouse type rockets:


Finally, there was the XP-62.  This was to be a four-engined light(?) interceptor poweed by for RR RB93 Soar jets with a thrust to weight ratio of 6.77:1.  Given the life of this engine at Mach 1+, it was expected that an engine change would be required after every 4 to 5 missions!  It was also planned to be armed with rockets:


Regards,

Greg
« Last Edit: February 16, 2007, 12:04:17 pm by GTX »

Offline Jos Heyman

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2007, 12:20:20 pm »
The designation CA-24 was reserved for a proposed licence version of the Hawker P-1080.

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2007, 12:19:07 am »
Sorry GTX, I just had to follow my own signature ...
Some browsers ( e.g. Firefox) are blocking hotlinked attachements without warning !   ::)
Ok, now I can see your photos.
It takes a long time, before all mistakes are made ...

Offline Archibald

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2007, 04:23:09 am »
I'm fond the XP-65 / 68 , CA-23 and CA-31 designs. I've made a model of the XP-68 some months ago...
Is there any model of the CA-23 on the market ?
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Offline Archibald

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2007, 04:29:28 am »
Maybe this sounds stupid but...

this variant of the CA.31 seems quite different from Uncle lee's resin model of the CA.31.
http://www.fortunecity.com/meltingpot/portland/971/Reviews/raaf/ca-31.htm

The AE article tells that there was various iterations of the CA-31 (single seat for cas, 1 RB-172 or two J-85).

What variant did the mockup represented? the two J-85 or the single RB-172 variant ?
« Last Edit: December 20, 2007, 12:05:13 pm by overscan »
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Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2007, 11:54:31 am »
Archibald,

What happenned with that pic - its a BGV International ship concept???

BTW, There was a pic of a superb model of the CA.23 that someone did last year (I think it was on Modelling Maddness and was from a Melbourne show) - I believe it may have been a scratch build though.

Regards,

Greg
« Last Edit: February 17, 2007, 11:57:40 am by GTX »

Offline JAZZ

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #14 on: May 11, 2007, 03:39:44 pm »
Here is an odd looking little trainer concept from CAC. From Australian Aircraft Magazine.

Offline Petrus

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #15 on: May 12, 2007, 03:48:06 am »
Some more Pics of the CA.23 (including mock-up pics):

(...)

Regards,

Greg

Do you know the CA-23's dimensions and other specs? I presume the engines were to be the Avons. Am I right?

Best regards,
Piotr

Offline Archibald

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #16 on: July 02, 2007, 12:44:24 pm »
Australian project from the 60's, delta wing, RB-172 engine (another aircraft powered by this prolific family of engines  ;))
Mach 1.5, the aim was to train RAAF pilots to the Mirage IIIO. In the end the role was filled by both Aermacchi MB-326 and twin-seat Mirage III.
I have the air Enthusiast article on Australian designs, but I'm deseperately seeking a 3-view of this project (and more pics of the mockup, I know it has been preserved).

Thanks in advance...

 

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #17 on: December 20, 2007, 12:12:30 pm »
http://www.flightglobal.com/PDFArchive/View/1967/1967%20-%201366.html
http://www.flightglobal.com/PDFArchive/View/1967/1967%20-%200463.html

Quote
PROGRESS WITH THE CA-31

ADVANCED-TRAINER PROJECTS make news these days and reflect the importance of offering sufficient performance to simulate as many as possible of the characteristics of the type of aircraft which the pupil pilot will eventually fly. Last week we described the Dornier Do P375 universal trainer; this week we illustrate a mock-up of the Commonwealth Aircraft Corporation Pty CA-31 operational trainer, proposals for which were submitted to the Australian Government last winter.

Forward planning by the Commonwealth Department of Air—as shown by its acquisition of the Mirage IIIO and, soon, the F-111C- indicated the need for a supersonic two-seater as a logical follow-on to the Macchi MB.326H which will be used for the primary training programme (the first Australian-built MB.326s will fly next year). While, therefore, the Department of Air was evaluating a number of aircraft already built and projected, the CAF drew up a specification for the CA-31. This trainer is probably unique in having a delta wing, most existing delta trainers having been developed from existing operational aircraft. The design is clearly aimed at providing delta-wing training for the Mirage, notwithstanding the existence of the conversion trainer - the Mirage IIID - already in service with the RAAF.

The CA-31 has been engineered to produce an effective, versatile, supersonic jet trainer which can be operated effectively in a number of roles. The design emphasises low weight, simplicity and excellent handling, together with minimum maintenance and logistic support requirements. With a 21ft-span double delta wing (similar to that of the Draken) go a swept fin and rudder. Full-span elevons provide control in pitch and roll. Overall length is 37ft. The estimated approach speed is 120kt, while the landing and take-off runs are 2,050ft and 1,200ft respectively.

While the gross weight in the training configuration would be 8,500lb, no decision has apparently been made about the selection of the powerplant; but CAF thinking is now turned towards a single turbofan providing 4,600lb of static thrust or 6,900lb with afterburner. This engine could well be the Rolls-Royce/Turbomeca Adour which has been selected for the Anglo-French Jaguar trainer/strike fighter, but the Bristol-Siddeley Snecma M45 series of engines offers an attractive alternative. The speeds at high level and "on the deck" are understood to be Mach 1.5 and Mach 1 respectively.

The aircraft is, according to CAF, readily adaptable to light ground-attack duties and guns, rockets, bombs and missiles may be carried for advanced training or operational use.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2007, 12:21:35 pm by overscan »
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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #18 on: December 20, 2007, 12:52:23 pm »
Added from other topic, posted by Jemiba
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Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #19 on: December 20, 2007, 10:01:00 pm »
Thanks for that - there is also a fairly close approximation of the CA-31 by Peter Hobbins on the whatifmodelers site:




Regards,

Greg

Offline Kadija_Man

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #20 on: December 21, 2007, 05:37:27 am »
Obviously one got real value for money in those days...

Offline Justo Miranda

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #21 on: January 28, 2008, 01:31:47 pm »
Australian heavy fighter

Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #22 on: January 28, 2008, 11:54:52 pm »
I don't know about the P223 designation, but this is the CAC CA-23 - see more (including mock-up pics) here:

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1479.0

Regards,

Greg

Offline Justo Miranda

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #23 on: January 29, 2008, 12:40:41 pm »
I don't know about the P223 designation, but this is the CAC CA-23 - see more (including mock-up pics) here:

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1479.0

Regards,

Greg

My source , AIR ENTHUSIAST Nş 63 ,uses the P223 denomination , as you may see at the lower section of the drawing I seen yesterday.
When using the "Search" option on the CAC P223 dit not get anything.It happens sometimes...

Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #24 on: February 01, 2008, 10:51:30 am »
No problem.

Regards,

Greg

Offline Petrus

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #25 on: June 30, 2008, 12:24:52 pm »
As for the CA-23 there is an interesting webpage on this project. You may find it at http://jet-flight.net/ca23.html.

Piotr

Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #26 on: March 18, 2010, 12:46:43 am »
Has anyone got a decent line drawing that also includes a side view of the CA-23?

Regards,

Greg

Offline Matej

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #27 on: March 18, 2010, 05:20:14 am »
Topics merged

Bizarre aviation expert.

Offline Pioneer

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #28 on: July 09, 2010, 05:42:42 am »
Hello gents

Does anyone have or know of any 3-view drawing or side profile drawing of the CA-31 design???

Regards
Pioneer
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Faithfulness and fortitude.
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Offline Petrus

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #29 on: July 09, 2010, 08:27:49 am »
I'm not sure if you look for something I've attached below. But there are the CA-31's three-view drawings of a kind.

Best regards,
Piotr

Offline Pioneer

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #30 on: July 10, 2010, 05:00:29 am »
Thanks Petrus very much!
These are great!
I hope that I may be able to find larger copies, as I am going to attempt to get some 'What If' profiles done of these in both a combat and trainer variant (Hint Hint GTX ;) ;D

If I have any luck (and takers) I will be sure to forward them on for your efforts

Regards
Pioneer
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Faithfulness and fortitude.
Gentleness and compassion.
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Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #31 on: July 10, 2010, 01:50:16 pm »
There is a full size Ca-31 mockup in the back of the Australian National Aviation Museum, at Moorabbin Airport near Melbourne, Australia.

The mock-up is disassembled and against one wall (easily missed).  Pics were taken with my phone a couple of years ago:











Regards,

Greg

Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #32 on: July 10, 2010, 01:53:04 pm »
I'm not sure if you look for something I've attached below. But there are the CA-31's three-view drawings of a kind.

Best regards,
Piotr

Piotr,

What is the source of these please?

Regards,

Greg

Offline Petrus

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #33 on: July 10, 2010, 02:00:15 pm »
Piotr,

What is the source of these please?

Regards,

Greg

Well, some time ago I downloaded it from another forum, I can't recall now which one.

Piotr

Offline Geoff_B

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #34 on: July 10, 2010, 02:33:05 pm »
I'm not sure if you look for something I've attached below. But there are the CA-31's three-view drawings of a kind.

Best regards,
Piotr

Piotr,

What is the source of these please?

Regards,

Greg

From the instructions from the Uncle Les 1/72 CAC CA-31 resin kit Greg  ;D

Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #35 on: July 10, 2010, 02:56:59 pm »
I should have guessed - thanks.  Will ask Les about a copy next time I'm talking to him - might try to get a high res version.

Regards,

Greg
« Last Edit: July 11, 2010, 12:17:34 am by Matej »

Offline Skyraider3D

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #36 on: October 02, 2010, 06:08:28 am »
Would anyone have the CA-23 drawings of which snippets are shown halfway down this page?
http://jet-flight.net/ca23.html

I've been trying to find contact details for the author of that article, Denis O'Brien, but without luck.

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Offline Orionblamblam

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #37 on: October 02, 2010, 07:55:34 am »
I've been trying to find contact details for the author of that article, Denis O'Brien, but without luck.

The magic of creepy Ye Olde Internet Tubes gives the guys name, PO box, phone number and email address:
http://www.melbourneit.com.au/cc/whois/search

I won't post his (or anyones) contact info out here in the world in front of the IRS and everybody, but enter "jet-flight.net" into the whois search at that website and it'll hook you right up.
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Offline Skyraider3D

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #38 on: October 02, 2010, 03:30:49 pm »
Thanks! I actually did try a WHOIS for that domain, but clearly not on the right website as my search didn't get further than the contact details of the site's webhost.

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Offline Orionblamblam

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #39 on: October 04, 2010, 09:59:46 am »
You just needed to go one step further.

Now, no using this newfound ability for evil...
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Offline Skyraider3D

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #40 on: October 04, 2010, 01:31:44 pm »
Too late, I've woken up half Australia now in my quest to find those drawings!  :-[   ;D

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Offline hesham

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #41 on: October 08, 2012, 09:19:41 am »
Here is the CAC Wallaby regional airliner project,later fitted
by a more powerful engines as P265,but it was very strange,
that the company didn't use the series 200 !.


http://www.airwaysmuseum.com/CAC%20Wallaby.htm

Offline Flying Sorcerer

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #42 on: October 15, 2012, 03:33:27 pm »
Anyone have info on the XP-67 Warrior? It was a CAC project from the late fifties.

Offline hesham

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #43 on: October 17, 2012, 06:47:32 am »
Anyone have info on the XP-67 Warrior? It was a CAC project from the late fifties.


All I know about XP-67 Warrior,it was a Mach-2 fighter project.

Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #44 on: October 17, 2012, 11:12:07 am »
Anyone have info on the XP-67 Warrior? It was a CAC project from the late fifties.


Only what is on page 1 of this thread.

Offline pathology_doc

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #45 on: November 12, 2012, 04:37:59 am »

These two look like they could have been lifted straight out of "British Secret Projects: Fighters since 1950". Then again, why not? It was early days, and with little known, convergent solutions would have been the norm. They vaguely suggest straight-wing versions of Avro's jet-plus-rocket fighters, which suggests an interesting answer to the question of what, if anything, might have evolved had the Miles M.52 flown and the resultant data been used as a line of development.

I have the articles you were referring to.  The XP-65 was to be powered by a RA24R Avon series engine.  Span was 7.3m, length was 14.3m.

Here are some pics from them.  First the XP-65:




And the related XP-68 - this was also to be built of stainless steel.  It was to be powered by a RR Avon RA19R.  It also had provision for a search radar.  Armament was 2 30mm cannon + 1 missile on each wingtip + another semi-recessed under the fuselage.  It was to be Mach 2 capable and was largely seen as a competitor to the F-104



Regards,

Greg

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #46 on: December 06, 2013, 07:52:06 am »
Here is the CAC Wallaby regional airliner project,later fitted
by a more powerful engines as P265,but it was very strange,
that the company didn't use the series 200 !.


http://www.airwaysmuseum.com/CAC%20Wallaby.htm


Hi,


http://alternathistory.org.ua/avstraliiskie-mnogomotornye-chast-3-cac-wallaby

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #47 on: January 17, 2014, 05:27:52 am »
Hi,


here is the early proposals to Commonwealth CA-23 fighter project,the scheme 1
looks like Grumman XF9F-2 aircraft,and some details of the design.


http://alternathistory.org.ua/proekt-tyazhelogo-vsepogodnogo-istrebitelya-commonwealth-aircraft-corporation-ca-23-avstraliya

Offline Kiltonge

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #48 on: June 30, 2014, 07:25:06 am »

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #49 on: June 30, 2014, 09:31:43 am »
Amazing find Kiltonge.

Offline Kiltonge

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #50 on: June 30, 2014, 10:04:06 am »
Unfortunately I can't find a scrap of additional info about the COIN project.

For comparison, in 1974 Thailand paid US$12 million for 20 Fairchild AU-23s with spares.  That is US$600,000 per unit, or about AUS$860,00 according to Measuring Worth in 1974.

So AUS$220,000 would have been remarkably good value even without spares...

Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #51 on: June 30, 2014, 11:04:51 am »
I wonder if it was this one based upon the Nomad (but GAF rather than CAC):





I believe this was another version of the same:





Supplied to me by "Uncle Les" (of modelling fame) who got them from the late Kevin Kerle.

Les has actually attempted to model it too:

« Last Edit: June 30, 2014, 11:06:26 am by GTX »

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #52 on: June 30, 2014, 03:59:09 pm »
Wow,very nice drawings and Model,thank you my dear GTX.

Offline Abraham Gubler

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #53 on: June 30, 2014, 04:49:48 pm »
Unfortunately I can't find a scrap of additional info about the COIN project.

I'll add it to my scanning list!
 
There are a few pages of details in Joe Vella's CAC projects article in AE63. It was basically a high wing, light twin (300 hp pistons) with a narrow fuselage and a modular 'prime mover' cab. Called the LMS [Light Military Transport] but despite the name concieved as a COIN support aircraft. COIN aircraft had a turret with two MGs, pilot and rear facing observer/gunner.
"There is a tendency in our planning to confuse the unfamiliar with the improbable." Thomas Schelling

Offline Abraham Gubler

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #54 on: July 03, 2014, 03:37:17 pm »
Here is an image of the display model of the CAC LMS. This example is fitted with the 'wide' body passenger/cargo pod. The COIN version would just have a gunner's position and turret in its place. Air Enthusiast 63 has three view line drawings by Joe Vella of some of the different proposals. And many other CAC designs. I recommend anyone interested in CAC secret projects should get a copy:
 
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Air-Enthusiast-63-Israel-Spitfire-Blackburn-Dart-Wellesley-/400728757621?pt=UK_Magazines&hash=item5d4d4b9575
 
"There is a tendency in our planning to confuse the unfamiliar with the improbable." Thomas Schelling

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #55 on: July 03, 2014, 04:11:36 pm »
Great find Abraham.

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #56 on: January 15, 2015, 11:59:19 pm »
Hang on....hold the fort  :o I missed this CAC LMS [Light Military Transport] design posting  ???
The head-on drawing you posted GTX of the COIN design, is this a real design proposal or one of your 'What If' drawing mate?
If it's the real thing, can I obtain more info please??

P.S. Agreed ;)
Quote
Amazing find Kiltonge

Regards
Pioneer
« Last Edit: January 16, 2015, 12:09:28 am by Pioneer »
And remember…remember the glory is not the exhortation of war, but the exhortation of man.
Mans nobility, made transcendent in the fiery crucible of war.
Faithfulness and fortitude.
Gentleness and compassion.
I am honored to be your brother.”

— Lt Col Ralph Honner DSO M

Offline GTX

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #57 on: January 16, 2015, 12:15:31 am »
The drawings aren't mine.  They were supplied to me by Uncle Les.

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #58 on: February 23, 2015, 08:58:24 am »
From Wikipedia,


I don't understand,there was a project called GAF F2 two seat jet trainer,it became the
CAC CA.31 or not ?.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Havilland_Australia


Quote
The end of the Vampire programme marked the beginning of an extended period when no complete aircraft were produced, although there was work for the company in various modification (see DHA-3 Drover) and repair and overhaul programmes, including repairing RAAF DHC-4 Caribous damaged on active service during the Vietnam War and major servicing of the RAAF Caribou fleet. One design project pursued during this time was for a military jet trainer for the RAAF. HdH offered its P17 indigenous design derived from the Vampire and was also involved in the Government Aircraft Factory (GAF) F2 project, which would have seen HdH undertaking production work on this aircraft with GAF and the Commonwealth Aircraft Corporation (CAC). The CAC-built version of the Aermacchi MB-326 was selected for production in 1965 and neither project proceeded. However all was not lost as CAC subcontracted to HdH the manufacture of the wings and wingtip fuel tanks, tailplanes,ailerons, flaps, hydraulic system components and landing gear for the Macchi, as well as parts of the Macchi's Viper engines built by CAC.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2015, 04:53:56 am by hesham »

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #59 on: February 24, 2015, 09:31:01 am »
In Air Pictorial 3/1958و


they spoke about De Havilland (Australia) intended to produce a four-five seat executive
aircraft,I don't know it it was its design (Project) or no.

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #60 on: February 24, 2015, 04:36:41 pm »
Interesting. In the DHA designation system DHA-4 to DHA-9 are missing (DHA or HDH-10 is an RPV), so possibly this executive aircraft could be one of those designations. Maybe this is a direction for a search.

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #61 on: February 24, 2015, 06:02:50 pm »
From Wikipedia,


I don't understand,there was a project called GAF F2 two seat jet trainer,it became the
CAC CA.31 or not ?.


The P17 and F2 were proposals for the Vampire advanced trainer replacement. Australian aviation industry were very upset with the RAAF for not providing enough time for them to tender developed proposals for this requirement. Hence the selection of the MB-326 which CAC were lucky to secure license production of. The CA.31 was developed after this decision as a fighter combat trainer to replace CAC Sabres being used in this role. I don't think GAF had anything to do with the CA.31 development.
"There is a tendency in our planning to confuse the unfamiliar with the improbable." Thomas Schelling

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #62 on: February 25, 2015, 05:06:53 am »
Interesting. In the DHA designation system DHA-4 to DHA-9 are missing (DHA or HDH-10 is an RPV), so possibly this executive aircraft could be one of those designations. Maybe this is a direction for a search.

Sharp Notice my dear Jos,

and the HDH-10 was appeared in 1975 and HDH-11 was appeared in 1978,later I will
speak about them.


And thanks you Abraham Gulber.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2015, 07:00:53 am by hesham »

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #63 on: February 25, 2015, 04:18:44 pm »
the HDH-10 was appeared in 1975 and HDH-11 was appeared in 1978,later I will
speak about them.

HDH-10 Enmoth I, HDH-11 Beemoth I. There was also an HDH-12 Promoth in 1980. All mini-RPVs.

Offline Abraham Gubler

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #64 on: May 13, 2015, 06:23:16 pm »
Here is the CAC Wallaby regional airliner project,
http://www.airwaysmuseum.com/CAC%20Wallaby.htm


From this source here is the brochure for the CAC Wallaby downsized to fit within the attachment limits here.
"There is a tendency in our planning to confuse the unfamiliar with the improbable." Thomas Schelling

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #65 on: May 14, 2015, 02:52:43 am »
From this source here is the brochure for the CAC Wallaby downsized to fit within the attachment limits here.

Absolutely splendid... Thank you so much for sharing.

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #66 on: May 14, 2015, 05:21:20 am »

From this source here is the brochure for the CAC Wallaby downsized to fit within the attachment limits here.


Amazing find Abraham,


and can I ask you,on the last drawing,they wrote AP35,is that meaning Project P.35 ?.

Offline Abraham Gubler

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #67 on: May 14, 2015, 06:12:19 am »

and can I ask you,on the last drawing,they wrote AP35,is that meaning Project P.35 ?.


AFAIK CAC used Pxyz codes for aircraft project designs until sometime in the early to mid 1950s when they changed to XPxy and APxy.
"There is a tendency in our planning to confuse the unfamiliar with the improbable." Thomas Schelling

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #68 on: May 14, 2015, 08:48:45 am »
Thank you Abraham.

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #69 on: April 04, 2017, 06:25:11 am »
At a Russian webpage http://aviadejavu.ru/Site/Arts/Art8805.htm you may find pictures that were published in the "Air Enthusiast" issue 3 of 1996 in an article "From Fisherman's Bend. CAC Projects, Proposals and Concepts" by J.Vella.

Piotr

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #70 on: April 04, 2017, 06:47:41 am »
At a Russian webpage http://aviadejavu.ru/Site/Arts/Art8805.htm you may find pictures that were published in the "Air Enthusiast" issue 3 of 1996 in an article "From Fisherman's Bend. CAC Projects, Proposals and Concepts" by J.Vella.

Piotr

Great find my dear Petrus.

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #71 on: April 04, 2017, 06:49:42 am »
And;

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #72 on: April 04, 2017, 06:50:18 am »
And;

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #73 on: April 04, 2017, 07:08:51 pm »
Does anyone know where I could find stats/specs for the CAC LMS? I'm curious about engines, weights, dimensions!

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #74 on: April 05, 2017, 11:52:43 am »
Does anyone know where I could find stats/specs for the CAC LMS? I'm curious about engines, weights, dimensions!

LMS?  I might be able to assist but need to clarify exactly wha you are referring to.

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #75 on: April 05, 2017, 06:05:17 pm »
Does anyone know where I could find stats/specs for the CAC LMS? I'm curious about engines, weights, dimensions!

LMS?  I might be able to assist but need to clarify exactly wha you are referring to.

The Commonwealth Air Corporation LMS Light Military Transport:
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1479.0;attach=577624;image

Mentioned in reply #53 and #54.

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #76 on: April 06, 2017, 11:12:15 am »
Thanks - let me see what I can find out.

Offline Pioneer

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #77 on: May 07, 2017, 04:09:52 pm »
Gentlemen, can I press upon the forum for information (or an educated guess) as to what 'year' the Commonwealth Aircraft Corporation (CAC) CA-31 might have entered production, had it been politically and militarily supported in Australia.

Regards
Pioneer
« Last Edit: May 07, 2017, 05:18:50 pm by Pioneer »
And remember…remember the glory is not the exhortation of war, but the exhortation of man.
Mans nobility, made transcendent in the fiery crucible of war.
Faithfulness and fortitude.
Gentleness and compassion.
I am honored to be your brother.”

— Lt Col Ralph Honner DSO M

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #78 on: May 07, 2017, 04:31:57 pm »
Gentlemen, can I press upon the forum for information (or an educated guess) as to when the Commonwealth Aircraft Corporation (CAC) CA-31 might have entered production, had it been politically and militarily supported in Australia.

Regards
Pioneer

My dear Pioneer,I think yes.

Offline Pioneer

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #79 on: May 07, 2017, 05:17:23 pm »
Gentlemen, can I press upon the forum for information (or an educated guess) as to when the Commonwealth Aircraft Corporation (CAC) CA-31 might have entered production, had it been politically and militarily supported in Australia.

Regards
Pioneer

My dear Pioneer,I think yes.

Thank you my friend

M.A.D
And remember…remember the glory is not the exhortation of war, but the exhortation of man.
Mans nobility, made transcendent in the fiery crucible of war.
Faithfulness and fortitude.
Gentleness and compassion.
I am honored to be your brother.”

— Lt Col Ralph Honner DSO M

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #80 on: May 08, 2017, 02:03:48 am »
HSA's Hawk went from private venture studies in 1968 to an AST in early 1970, initial contract in 1971 and then March 1972. Prototype flew on  21 August 1974  and entered service in late 1976.

CAC had much less experience than Hawker Siddeley, and the CAC-31 was technically much more ambitious. Can't see it taking less time that the Hawk.

CA-31 studies were from 1965, submitted in 1966 to a requirement, but even given a contract in 1967 I'd guess first flight would probably no earlier than 1974 and service entry 1978?
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Offline Pioneer

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #81 on: May 08, 2017, 12:33:50 pm »
Thank's for your analysis Paul!


Regards
Pioneer
And remember…remember the glory is not the exhortation of war, but the exhortation of man.
Mans nobility, made transcendent in the fiery crucible of war.
Faithfulness and fortitude.
Gentleness and compassion.
I am honored to be your brother.”

— Lt Col Ralph Honner DSO M

Offline Abraham Gubler

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #82 on: January 24, 2018, 03:14:21 am »
I only saw one file on the CA-23 at the Melbourne office of the National Archives of Australia. Unfortunately I missed the "Appreciation of Fighter CA 23 [1952]" from the private papers of H.P. Breen. The rest are in Canberra, including the very interesting looking Cabinet paper "Production of two prototypes of a long range all weather attack fighter aircraft CA 23 : Agendum Number - 129/1953 and Attachment : Date of Meeting - 20 August 1953". Which at two folios thick could be a gold mine. Alas this means I'll have to make a visit to our nation's capital.

I've data captured the 'Low speed wind tunnel investigation on the CA-23, a twin seat all weather fighter aircraft', D A Lemaire. This report details effects of various adjustments to the wing planform, flap size, with or without tails, dive brakes, etc. Primary purpose of these tests, carried out in Feb to Aug of 1951, were to explore the low tailplane position. Original position was a high T-tail, then to a position below the fin and both were destabilising.
"There is a tendency in our planning to confuse the unfamiliar with the improbable." Thomas Schelling

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #83 on: January 24, 2018, 04:38:58 am »
Amazing find Abraham.

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Re: CAC Postwar Projects
« Reply #84 on: December 06, 2018, 09:12:16 am »
Commonwealth Aircraft Corporation CA.23, TNA. AVIA6/17964
...'excuse me mister, is that plane for real'...!!!

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