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Author Topic: Mount Mitchell Air Show  (Read 4362 times)

Offline Abraham Gubler

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Mount Mitchell Air Show
« on: June 06, 2010, 08:50:03 pm »
The RAAF's new Super Hornets have been struting their stuff in low level training. Some great visual demonstration of the principals of a aerodynamics:


Visual Stealth?


Lift in action.

More and hi res at:

http://www.defence.gov.au/media/download/2010/Jun/20100607/index.htm
"There is a tendency in our planning to confuse the unfamiliar with the improbable." Thomas Schelling

Offline donnage99

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Re: Mount Mitchell Air Show
« Reply #1 on: June 07, 2010, 04:01:39 am »
I thought the zig zag leading edge on australian super hornets would look like the growlers instead of the earlier super hornets.   ???

PS that's not visual stealth.  It's called space warping. The super hornet warps backward into the past to eliminate threat even before it pops up.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2010, 04:04:57 am by donnage99 »

Offline Abraham Gubler

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Re: Mount Mitchell Air Show
« Reply #2 on: June 07, 2010, 04:23:13 am »
I thought the zig zag leading edge on australian super hornets would look like the growlers instead of the earlier super hornets.   ???

There is no difference between the wing shape of an EA-18G and the F/A-18E/F. Besides all of the first 12 RAAF Super Hornets are F/A-18F Block IIs and only five have been ferried to Australia. The second batch of 12 will be F/A-18Fs as well but with the internal wiring to support being upgraded to EA-18G. They will have none of the EA-18G’s antennas and emitters and specialized systems.
"There is a tendency in our planning to confuse the unfamiliar with the improbable." Thomas Schelling

Offline donnage99

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Re: Mount Mitchell Air Show
« Reply #3 on: June 07, 2010, 03:11:58 pm »
I meant the super hornets' leading-edge dogtooth and the growlers'

Offline Abraham Gubler

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Re: Mount Mitchell Air Show
« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2010, 04:16:37 pm »
Besides all of the first 12 RAAF Super Hornets are F/A-18F. -snip- The second batch of 12 -snip- will have none of the EA-18G’s antennas and emitters and specialized systems.
"There is a tendency in our planning to confuse the unfamiliar with the improbable." Thomas Schelling

Offline Abraham Gubler

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Re: Mount Mitchell Air Show
« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2011, 11:36:09 pm »
Expect a big announcement to be made in the next few days coming out of the Australia-USA AUSMIN defence and foreign affairs ministerial conference about the RAAF’s new Super Hornets. Interesting and cool stuff…
« Last Edit: September 15, 2011, 11:39:01 pm by Abraham Gubler »
"There is a tendency in our planning to confuse the unfamiliar with the improbable." Thomas Schelling

Offline Abraham Gubler

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Re: Mount Mitchell Air Show
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2011, 03:08:57 pm »
Finally this story is starting to leak:
 
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/defence/raaf-fighter-bombers-to-become-growlers/story-e6frg8yo-1226170085768

Quote
THE RAAF may soon have 12 of its Super Hornet fighter-bombers equipped as "Growlers", the US aircraft packed with electronic equipment that paralysed the Libyan regime's communications and missile systems.           
Because of the aircraft's spectacular success in the Libyan conflict, the Gillard government is considering soon spending more than $300 million having half of the 24-strong Super Hornet fleet fitted out for electronic warfare.

Though there is more to it. I can't tell due to confidences made but keep watching this space.
"There is a tendency in our planning to confuse the unfamiliar with the improbable." Thomas Schelling

Offline Dragon029

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Re: Mount Mitchell Air Show
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2011, 10:06:07 pm »
I can't quite remember, nor check, because the book is being loaned out to a friend, but didn't Ian Mcphedran's new book Air Force mention that if the Rhino's were converted to Growlers, keeping them instead of selling them to the USN, the RAAF would likely forgo prior plans to update the F-35A offer from 72 airframes to 100?

If so, I wonder what kind of impact that'll have - the Growlers could have served as a combat & EW capable, frontline fuel-topping platform... but the F-35A's don't work with drogues.

Either way though, the Growler conversion, if that price is correct, is only the price of about 1-3 F-35As and adds the option for ACOs to practice newer EW equipment & techniques in RAAF-owned fighters.

Offline Abraham Gubler

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Re: Mount Mitchell Air Show
« Reply #8 on: October 19, 2011, 12:31:25 am »
 
I can't quite remember, nor check, because the book is being loaned out to a friend, but didn't Ian Mcphedran's new book Air Force mention that if the Rhino's were converted to Growlers, keeping them instead of selling them to the USN, the RAAF would likely forgo prior plans to update the F-35A offer from 72 airframes to 100?
 
The third batch of AIR 6000 has already been delayed thanks to the Super Hornet. The F-35 is only one option under consideration. The idea that the USN would buy the Super Hornets after 10 years of use was always a long shot proposed by the political echelon more than the Air Force. The RAAF has a requirement for Growlers to support the F-35 from 2025-30 anyway. Add to that the utility of Growlers in counter terror and other operations and we will never let them go. The Super Hornets are also very useful as fast FAC and other supporting missions.

 
If so, I wonder what kind of impact that'll have - the Growlers could have served as a combat & EW capable, frontline fuel-topping platform... but the F-35A's don't work with drogues.

The tanker role is not a combat role but a carrier safety role. The RAAF has no buddy buddy tanks and no plans to acquire any. Further the F-35A can be built with probe or receptacle IFR gear. The RCAF F-35As will be built with an IFR probe.
 
Either way though, the Growler conversion, if that price is correct, is only the price of about 1-3 F-35As and adds the option for ACOs to practice newer EW equipment & techniques in RAAF-owned fighters.
 

Well the rest of the aircraft and the jamming pods don’t come for free. Nor to does any F-35 cost $300 million. The RAAF will be buying their F-35s at well under $100 million per unit. Even with the Growler there is no way the Super Hornet can match the F-35 for capability.
"There is a tendency in our planning to confuse the unfamiliar with the improbable." Thomas Schelling

Offline JFC Fuller

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Offline Dragon029

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Re: Mount Mitchell Air Show
« Reply #10 on: October 19, 2011, 04:13:12 am »
Well the rest of the aircraft and the jamming pods don’t come for free. Nor to does any F-35 cost $300 million. The RAAF will be buying their F-35s at well under $100 million per unit. Even with the Growler there is no way the Super Hornet can match the F-35 for capability.

Just to clarify, I was only stating the 1 to 3 figure to prevent any arguing about the F-35's pricing, but I do agree with you and thanks for the insight  :D

One question though, what prices are we set to purchase the F-35A's at? I saw that USAF report stating it'll be at a $98m USD by 2015 for (if I recall correctly), the aircraft + required equipment. There wasn't any data on prices after that, but what kind of price is it expected to bank out at?