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Author Topic: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution  (Read 34770 times)

Offline Pioneer

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Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« on: July 01, 2006, 03:14:49 am »
Northrop P-610 single-engine variant of the YF-17 Cobra (later F/A-18 Hornet)


At the time of the USAF’s ‘Light Weight Fighter’ (LWF) Request for Proposal, Northrop attempted to cover its bases, by submitting both a single-engine design, the P-610, and the twin-engine design, the P-600
Both the USAF and Northrop went with the P-600, which would be developed into the YF-17 Cobra, and later further developed into the larger and heavier F/A-18 Hornet for the US Navy.
But it is the P-610 that I am interested in
The P-610 design was very similar in layout to that of its two-engine P-600 design submission. But it was thought by some to not be as a refined as its twin-engine cousin. Although Lt. Gen Stewart would state that the P-610 looked as good or better than the twin-engine P-600 design. Northrop understood the single-engine F100 turbofan design would also make sense to the USAF, as it used this engine in its premier fighter, the McDonnell Douglas F-15 Eagle.
But the status of the P-610 designs completion would soon be sealed with the death of its designer, Northrop Engineer Bill Roth, and with his death the P-610 would never be finished.

Does anyone have pictures, drawings (including 3-view drawing) and technical data / specifications for the single-engine P-610?



Regards
Pioneer
« Last Edit: July 01, 2006, 08:31:20 am by overscan »

Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #1 on: July 01, 2006, 08:34:29 am »
I hope you don't mind that I broadened the scope of the thread.

I don't have anything specific on the P-610, but heres a nice overview of the design evolution from P-300 (Tiger derivative) to F-18 from "Northrop : An Aeronautical History" courtesy of Tinwing.
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Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #2 on: July 01, 2006, 09:12:14 am »
Some pics from the same book...
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Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #3 on: July 01, 2006, 09:19:09 am »
Three view from the Northrop book, plus other pics found on the net.
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Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #4 on: July 01, 2006, 09:24:21 am »
A curious (earlier?) revision with Dassault-style intakes.
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Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2006, 09:56:07 am »
P530 SPECIFICATIONS (from Northrop: An Aeronautical History)
WING SPAN  .........................................35 FT.
OVERALL LENGTH............................55 FT., 4 IN.
OVERALL HEIGHT ............................14 FT., 2 IN.
WING AREA....................................400 SQ. FT.
CLEAN TAKEOFF WEIGHT.......................23,000 LB
MAX. TAKEOFF WEIGHT.........................40,600 LB
SPEED-MAXIMUM...............................MACH 2.0
SPEED-CRUISING...............................MACH 0.85
RANGE (FERRY)...............................3,660 MILES
SERVICE CEILING...............................60,000 FT.
POWER —(2)G.E. 15/J1A5 TURBOJET, 13,000-LB THRUST
ARMAMENT — (I) 20MM GATLING GUN
(4)IR MISSILES (7) PYLON STATIONS AND (2) WING TIP STATIONS FOR ORDNANCE
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Offline elmayerle

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2006, 02:55:20 pm »
The best bet would be to check with the Western Museum of Flight as, if I remember correctly, they have most of Northrop's design history in their files.

Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #7 on: September 23, 2006, 10:21:48 am »
Source:

Air Enthusiast August 1971
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Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #8 on: September 23, 2006, 11:12:18 am »
1971 Specs

2 x GE-15 turbofans, 12,000lb thrust [I believe this is wrong: the caption to the 3 view from August says 15,000lb]
Span: 33 ft
Length: 51 ft
Wing Area: 37.16 sq m
Empty Weight: 17,000lb
Fuel: 7,200lb
Warload: 12,000lb
Normal TOW: 25,000lb
Armament: 1 x 20mm M61, 4 AIM-9

Source:
Air Enthusiast June 1971
"I'm always right except when persuaded otherwise against my better judgement"
                                                             
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Offline TinWing

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #9 on: September 23, 2006, 12:06:27 pm »
1971 Specs

2 x GE-15 turbofans, 12,000lb thrust [I believe this is wrong: the caption to the 3 view from August says 15,000lb]
Span: 33 ft
Length: 51 ft
Wing Area: 37.16 sq m
Empty Weight: 17,000lb
Fuel: 7,200lb
Warload: 12,000lb
Normal TOW: 25,000lb
Armament: 1 x 20mm M61, 4 AIM-9

Source:
Air Enthusiast June 1971

I am surprised by the minimal fuel load. 

This is the first time I've seen fuel capacity quoted for the P530, but I have seen a figure of nearly 5,900km given for ferry range!


Offline Matej

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #10 on: December 09, 2006, 11:41:00 am »
Well, I just realised that someone was faster... (I wanted to point out single engined P-610) So I add only three early F-18 artists impressions that are closer to YF-17 than final F/A-18.

Bizarre aviation expert.

Offline Sundog

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2006, 08:20:49 pm »
Yeah, I would love more info on the P610. That YF-17 book is excellent. I hadn't realized while the Navy was flight testing it it received a Top Gun paint scheme, which looks great on it. I also didn't know it was the first fighter to perform the "Cobra" maneuver, although the Navy called it the "Hook and Hang" maneuver. Which is ironic that it is called the Cobra maneuver today, when the first plane to perform it, AFAIK, was the Cobra. ;)

Also, an FYI, that type of inlet on the early design is called a, "Half Shock Cone" inlet and was first used on the F-104. In fact, they were so classified at the time, you can see pics of the F-104 with covers over them at roll out so you can't tell what they look like (Or they were airbrused out to look like a solid nacelle, I don't remember which.)

There is also a good article on the YF-17 in volume 1 of "Wings OF Fame," by Bill Gunston. Wings Of Fame merged with World Airpower quarterly to become "international Air Power review." I don't know if you can find old issues of Wings Of Fame, but I highly recommend them.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2010, 07:58:33 pm by Sundog »

Offline Pioneer

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #12 on: December 10, 2006, 12:04:15 am »
Quote
Yeah, I would love more info on the P610.


Thanks Sundog!

I thought everyone had given up on this search for the P-610.

Lets hope that there is someone out there that has more info

Let the search continue

Regards
Pioneer

Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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Re: Northrop P-530 / P-600 / P-610 / YF-17 Design Evolution
« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2007, 11:29:40 am »
Larger scans of the evolution of the Cobra. Unfortunately the drawings are quite inaccurate viewed up close.
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Offline PaulMM (Overscan)

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« Last Edit: September 30, 2007, 12:53:09 pm by overscan »
"I'm always right except when persuaded otherwise against my better judgement"
                                                             
- Sir Sydney Camm