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Author Topic: ESA Ariane 6  (Read 1557 times)

Online Grey Havoc

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ESA Ariane 6
« on: April 13, 2016, 10:44:56 am »
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Offline Michel Van

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2016, 11:08:20 am »
http://aviationweek.com/space/ariane-6-becomes-reality#slide-0-field_images-1434561

("Ariane 64" seems to be a typo.)

Nope, the offical desigination is Ariane 62 (two Solids) and Ariane 64 (four solids)
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Offline fredymac

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2016, 12:45:26 pm »
The Aviation Week article doesn't mention any plans for reuseability.  I thought they were studying options for a winged main booster glideback.  With Spacex, ULA (Vulcan), and Blue Origin itself planning on cost reductions through reuseable components, I would think Ariane would hedge its bets one way or the other.

I am puzzled about this statement:
"the Ariane 64 will lift 10,500 kg (23,150 lb.) to geostationary transfer orbit (GTO) with 1,500 tons of thrust at liftoff. In its Ariane 62 configuration, the rocket will use two boosters to carry half that weight to GTO with 800 tons of thrust"

This implies each of the solid rocket boosters puts out close to 400 tons (800,000lbs) thrust.  Or are they saying this is the combined thrust from the main booster plus the strap-ons?  In that case, is the "62" configuration total thrust correct?

Offline TomS

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2016, 01:13:36 pm »
Those numbers imply that the core provides 100 tons of thrust and that each booster is 350 tons (assuming the boosters for 62 and 64 are the same).  Does that make sense?

Offline Hobbes

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2016, 01:42:34 am »
Yes. The first stage engine will be a variant of the Vulcain 2, whic provides 1140 kN (114 tons) of thrust.

Online Grey Havoc

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #5 on: April 14, 2016, 01:51:20 am »
http://aviationweek.com/space/ariane-6-becomes-reality#slide-0-field_images-1434561

("Ariane 64" seems to be a typo.)

Nope, the offical desigination is Ariane 62 (two Solids) and Ariane 64 (four solids)

Thanks for the clarification.
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Offline Michel Van

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #6 on: April 14, 2016, 02:15:56 am »
Interesting CNES is study reusable Booster stage for Ariane 6
it's use Lox/CH4
source in french language
http://www.futura-sciences.com/magazines/espace/infos/actu/d/acces-espace-version-reutilisable-ariane-6-etude-56666/

Also is there the "Adeline" proposal by Airbus Defence and Space
Adeline stand for Advanced Expendable Launcher with Innovative engine Economy
After burnout of stage the engine block detach from fuel tank return to earth, deploy propellors and fly back to launch site (using Drone technology)


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Offline fredymac

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #7 on: April 14, 2016, 04:27:31 am »
Interesting architecture where the solid strap-ons provide about 90% of the thrust.  Almost sounds like it's a 2nd stage that starts early.

« Last Edit: April 14, 2016, 04:35:05 am by fredymac »

Offline Moose

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #8 on: April 14, 2016, 12:52:14 pm »
Interesting architecture where the solid strap-ons provide about 90% of the thrust.  Almost sounds like it's a 2nd stage that starts early.


Not unprecedented, the Shuttle's SSMEs weren't providing anywhere near the thrust of the SRBs at liftoff. SLS's core will will be similarly configured as well. In this sort of "1.5 stage" configuration, the core engines can be lighter and less complex if you light them on the ground rather than air-starting them after staging as a true second stage.

Online sferrin

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #9 on: April 14, 2016, 01:08:28 pm »
Or a Titan III/IV where the core wasn't even firing at liftoff.
"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.

Offline mz

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #10 on: April 14, 2016, 01:13:58 pm »
Interesting architecture where the solid strap-ons provide about 90% of the thrust.  Almost sounds like it's a 2nd stage that starts early.

If I checked correctly, Ariane V has been doing an even higher ratio decades. 14 MN from two P241 motors and 1 MN from Vulcain 2 core stage.
Also Soyuz (and like mentioned, formerly STS and Titan IV) were somewhat similar.

The core engine is started on pad, so that the takeoff can be aborted if it doesn't start. It is mostly designed to just run at sea level, it works better higher up with less ambient pressure.
Solids are good for high early acceleration. This reduces gravity losses a lot. Later in the flight, lower thrust to weight doesn't matter so much so a smaller engine is quite fine. Also since hydrogen propulsion is used, engines for similar thrust than denser fuels tend to be bigger (=heavier and more expensive) - yet the stage mass is lighter after the solids have been shed. That also drives optimization towards low powered core stages.

Ariane V was designed for the Hermes Shuttle to LEO so it's maybe not optimal for GTO launches.

Offline FighterJock

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #11 on: November 09, 2016, 07:33:12 am »
ESA has just unlocked full Ariane 6 funding for full scale production to go ahead.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-37925169

And this is the ESA version.

http://www.esa.int/Our_Activities/Launchers/Ariane_6_on_track
« Last Edit: November 09, 2016, 07:35:54 am by FighterJock »

Offline Flyaway

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2017, 05:20:01 am »
Ariane 6

European Space Agency, ESA

Published on Jan 23, 2017
Decided in Luxemburg by the European Space Agency council meeting at Ministerial level, Ariane 6 is a modular three-stage launcher (solid–cryogenic–cryogenic) with two configurations using: four boosters (A64) or two boosters (A62).

« Last Edit: January 24, 2017, 05:21:37 am by Flyaway »

Offline Cifu

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2017, 02:25:25 am »
Ariane 6

European Space Agency, ESA

Published on Jan 23, 2017
Decided in Luxemburg by the European Space Agency council meeting at Ministerial level, Ariane 6 is a modular three-stage launcher (solid–cryogenic–cryogenic) with two configurations using: four boosters (A64) or two boosters (A62).



Yet nothing new about the reusability. Without reusability, the Ariane 6 hardly can compete against the SpaceX Falcon 9 / Falcon Heavy, the Blue Origin New Glenn and the ULA Vulcan...

Online Grey Havoc

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Re: ESA Ariane 6
« Reply #14 on: June 28, 2017, 02:26:54 am »
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