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Author Topic: Myasishchev M-19 projects  (Read 7777 times)

Offline ucon

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Myasishchev M-19 projects
« on: August 26, 2008, 12:54:08 pm »
Hi to all!
A month or more ago there was discussiion about Myasishchev M-19 space project.
You may find new facts and pix of this project in www.avicopress.ru. More info will follow.
Regards
« Last Edit: February 25, 2013, 06:54:52 am by Stargazer2006 »

Offline ucon

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2008, 04:19:14 am »
Hi to all once again)
Some new pix from upcoming book about M-19 project.
More info you can find in www.avicopress.ru
Google translator now aviable in the site.
Regards, Ucon

Offline Tophe

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2008, 09:44:22 am »
The M-19-8-1 is incredible, looking like a fake enlarged "actual aircraft". Wonderful, thanks!
I don't succeed in connecting today to avicopress, but the translation (French for me) is much welcome... One more good point for your site!

Offline ucon

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2008, 12:24:29 pm »
Hi to all.
More pix and drawings about M-19-2 ("Kholod-2" programme) see in www. avicopress.ru
Regards

Dear Thomas! M-50EP =

Offline Meteorit

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #4 on: December 01, 2008, 04:37:47 am »
Hi ucon.
Thank you for the M-19 images, I've always been fascinated by this concept. Can you tell us is the M-19-2 a bomber, spaceplane or what? And, does the "fat" aircraft in Aeroflot colors have an "M-19-X" designation like the M-19-1 and -2?

Offline ucon

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2008, 02:48:32 am »
Hi to all!
Answer to dear Meteorit.
Disignations of M-19 (Kholod-2 progtamme):
M-19 (pure) - so called "Gurkolet" = spaceplane+hypersonic bomber
M-19-1 - "fat" laboratory in Aeroflot markings
M-19-2 - pure hypersonic bomber
M-19-3 - shuttle (almost dubble sized Buran)
M-19-4 - shuttle bigger than M-19-3
M-19-4V - swept wing hypersonic bomber (look like Tu-160)
and three more exotic variants of MDB (soon will follow)

And next (the 5th) variant of M-50.
Addition info wil be soon in www.avicopress.ru
Regards

Offline Meteorit

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2008, 06:47:18 am »
Thank you so much for this info. However, if I may point out, in image M-19-3-2 in post http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,4937.msg40720.html#msg40720 it reads "M-19-1" - I presume this is actually the "pure" M-19? And, by "three more exotic variants" do you mean M-19 variants (making 9 major variants in total)?

Offline ucon

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2008, 07:09:35 am »
Dear Meteorit!
M-19-1-2 etc used as numeration for putting those pix into site avicopress and didn't mean craft designations))
Concerning to M-19, yes, it were 9 variants. But 15 years later this subject was reopened and next spaceplane had another name and designations. All will desccribed in upcoming book.
Any questions - contact directly.
Regards

Offline Meteorit

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2008, 02:36:09 am »
Dear Meteorit!
M-19-1-2 etc used as numeration for putting those pix into site avicopress and didn't mean craft designations))

Sorry, I meant "M-19-1" in the image itself on the middle drawing, not the filename. So is this craft the M-19 (pure)?

Offline ucon

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2008, 01:58:14 pm »
Hi to all!
More info about M-19-3 ("Kholod-2" programme) was added today in www.avicopress.ru
M-19-3 was almost double-sized variant of famous Buran.
Regards
« Last Edit: September 06, 2010, 03:32:24 am by ucon »

Offline Just call me Ray

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2008, 03:02:19 pm »
Needless to say, a very ambitious project and...do I spy an APU outlet? Very odd for a spacecraft, needless to say, unless it was intended to be running only during the glide phase.
It's a crappy self-made pic of a Lockheed Unmanned Combat Armed Rotorcraft (UCAR), BTW
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Offline fightingirish

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #11 on: December 16, 2008, 08:41:05 am »
Needless to say, a very ambitious project and...do I spy an APU outlet? Very odd for a spacecraft, needless to say, unless it was intended to be running only during the glide phase.
Look at pic "M-19-12-1.jpg", where you see an engine pod under the fuselage. The pod is also tiled like the heat shield.
Another picture: http://www.testpilot.ru/russia/myasishchev/m/19/img/m19_1a.jpg
Quote
#14 - quite new wing, movable nose, another engines scheme and auxiliary fuel tanks
What does movable nose mean? Just like T-4, Tu-144 and Concorde?
Quote
3. M-50 passenger variant
I presume, we will might see here soon a AWACS variant like the Tupolev TU-126 "Moss".  :)
Quote
1. M-50 with X-44 missile
Mini-me, you complete me.   ;) ;D

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Sln ist an Irish Gaelic word for Goodbye.  :)

Offline flateric

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #12 on: December 16, 2008, 08:44:42 am »
What does movable nose mean? Just like T-4, Tu-144 and Concorde?

Yes, droop nose a-la Concorde. We were thinking of right term, but finally went to 'movable'.
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stealth, more than a few of them truly technically ignorant and proud of it." Sherm Mullin, Skunk Works

Offline ucon

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #13 on: December 16, 2008, 09:13:10 am »
Hi to all!
Sometimes it is very funny to see link where I can find the illustrations from my own book -  http://www.testpilot.ru/russia/myasishchev/m/19/img/m19_1a.jpg
Thank you very much, dear fightingirish  ;D

Offline ucon

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #14 on: January 09, 2009, 04:19:19 am »
Hi all!
M-19-4 ("Kholod-2" programme) has added in www.avicopress.ru.
First time ever presented in high quality pix and descriptions.
Regards

Offline Meteorit

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #15 on: January 10, 2009, 11:44:35 am »
Great, ucon!
Although I wonder, as the M-19-3 was bigger than Buran and the M-19-4 even bigger, if the An-225 could lift it, or would an M-90 for example be more appropriate ??? ;)
Hopefully there will be some sensible way for me to get that M-19 book when it comes out.

Offline ucon

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2009, 12:10:42 pm »
Hi all!
New aircraft which took part in M-19 "Kholod-2" programm:
swept wing long-range bomber M-19-4V
more info in www.avicopress.ru
Regards
« Last Edit: September 06, 2010, 03:31:04 am by ucon »

Offline Orionblamblam

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #17 on: January 10, 2009, 12:33:59 pm »

swept wing long-range bomber M-19-4V
more info in www.avicopress.ru

Where at, exactly?
Aerospace Projects Review


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Offline pometablava

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #18 on: January 10, 2009, 01:19:42 pm »
 
Quote
Where at, exactly?

Aviation > Myasishchev > ЭМЗ > Космос > М-19

Offline pometablava

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #19 on: January 10, 2009, 01:28:27 pm »
Ucon, were M-19-3 and M-19-4 a Buran replacement program?

Offline boxkite

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #20 on: January 12, 2009, 01:42:51 am »
Thank you for the next part of M-19 history. This thread was read more than 12.000 times. So, ucon, this is a success for you. But please don't forget the Ilyushin projects, e. g. Il-56. After the first taste we would like to see more  ;) .

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #21 on: January 12, 2009, 03:42:28 am »
Yup  fascinating thread .

Offline ucon

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #22 on: January 18, 2009, 02:41:46 am »
Hi all!
New additional info on M-19 programme in www.avicopress.ru

Offline pometablava

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #23 on: January 18, 2009, 06:28:42 am »
Impressive, thanks Ucon. It looks to be a similar concept to the Rockwell Star raker

Offline XP67_Moonbat

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #24 on: January 18, 2009, 08:14:59 am »
What type of engines were planned for that beauty?

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Offline Meteorit

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #25 on: January 18, 2009, 08:59:54 am »
Thanks again ucon! And great renderings by Mr. Gatial. The M-19-4V looks really nice.

Offline ucon

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #26 on: February 06, 2009, 05:20:29 am »
Hi all!
New additional info on M-19 programme in www.avicopress.ru
Regards

Offline ucon

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #27 on: February 08, 2009, 06:29:14 am »
Hi all!
Today next and last variant of M-19 "Kholod-2" programme.
More pix and info see in www.avicopress.ru
Regards

Offline Triton

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #28 on: August 19, 2009, 12:05:52 pm »
Images of a Myasishchev M-19 model from the USSR-Russian Aviation and Space Collectibles web site.

NOTE: Although seller claims that model is authentic and accurate, the reader should be aware that the authenticity and accuracy of this model is in question. It may have been manufactured by another party without license.

Description is quoted directly from the site and is not corrected for spelling.
Quote
Myasishchev M-19 secret project of Aerospace Craft with horizontal take off and landing.Intended to carry 30 tones cargo weight to orbit.Project started in 1974 when it was clear that American military Space Shuttle program will be a reality.
M-19 was planned for many purposes including delivery cosmonauts to orbit and their return from orbital stations, maintanance of objects on orbit, retyurn of cargo from space, performing military and scientific experiments on orbit.
Lenght of original M-19 was 70 meters.Lenght of model-35 cm (scale 1/200).Displayed at superior quality metal stand with engraved logo of Experimental Design Bureau of Myasishchev
.
http://www.ussr-airspace.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=24_53&products_id=2847
« Last Edit: December 23, 2009, 05:40:30 pm by Triton »

Offline Triton

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #29 on: August 01, 2010, 11:02:11 am »
Artist's impression of Myasishchev M-19.

Source:  http://212.113.124.22/ru/news/view/46498/
« Last Edit: August 01, 2010, 11:22:16 am by Triton »

Offline Skyblazer

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #30 on: February 25, 2013, 05:43:00 am »
Topic split from the old Myasishchev thread.

Offline blackkite

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #31 on: February 23, 2017, 01:43:21 am »
Hi! Open cycle nuclear rocket engine which contaminate space!? :o

M-19-1 picture by ucon-san.
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=18507.0;attach=55733;image
M-19-1 three side view drawing by ucon-san.
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=18507.0;attach=55735;image

https://falsesteps.wordpress.com/2016/09/24/m-19-gurkolyot-grab-the-problem-by-the-throat-not-the-tail/

"Weighing in at 500 tonnes with fuel, the M-19 was a very flat, 69-meter long triangular wedge with two small sets of wings, one at the tail and one as canards near the nose. Launching horizontally from a runway, the M-19s trip to orbit would begin with twin(set of?) turbofan jet engines(Please watch No.3 picture) burning liquid hydrogen. After getting up to Mach 4, the plane would switch over to scramjet engines(Please watch bottom of bottom picture), also burning hydrogen. In both cases, though, the engines had Gurkos idea behind them for a little extra kick.

The M-19 would have had a nuclear rocket engine that would take over in turn once the scramjet pushed the plane to Mach 16 and out of the appreciable atmosphere around 50 kilometers high. As the reactor was just sitting there during the turbojets and scramjets operation, Gurko reasoned, why not use it to superheat their exhaust to increase thrust? The potential increase in efficiency was considerable, and as the nuclear rocket (already more efficient than chemical rockets) would only be used for the final leg, the low inherent fuel use of the air-fed turbo- and scramjets gave the M-19 a tremendous payload fraction: the 500-tonne fully fueled plane was projected to lift 40 tonnes to LEO in its 15m 4m cargo bay, which compares favorably to even staged rockets. Consider the Space Shuttle at 2040 tonnes and 28 tonnes of payload, or the Saturn V at 3038 tonnes and 118 tonnes of payload. To move whatever was stored in it, the bay was to be equipped with a manipulator unit, and an airlock from the crew compartment allowed EVA. Behind the bay was a large LH2 tank and, it should be made clear, no oxidizer tank. The rocket would run on raw hydrogen, while the two different types of jet would use the air as their source of oxygen.

After completing its mission in orbit, the M-19 would then fly back home, using the same propulsion systems in reverse order to come into a powered landing at an airstrip somewhere in the USSR, with an astonishing cross-range capability of 4500 kilometers. This completely plane-like return was of considerable interest to Soviet space planners for other reasons too, as it meant that the M-19 would reduce search and retrieval costs to nil as compared to capsules unless there was an emergency. Under those circumstances the cabin was to be entirely ejectable, serving as a survival capsule for the three to seven cosmonauts that might be on-board."

Other images source.
http://www.testpilot.ru/russia/myasishchev/m/19/img/

Nuclear rocket engine does not need Oxidant.(M-19 weight and space saving engine.)
« Last Edit: February 23, 2017, 03:31:08 am by blackkite »

Offline Grey Havoc

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #32 on: February 23, 2017, 02:13:41 am »
Combined with the Buran, it would likely have given the Soviet Union a major leg up in orbital operations over the United States during the 1990s.
To the Stars

Offline blackkite

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #33 on: February 23, 2017, 03:03:30 am »
Combined with the Buran, it would likely have given the Soviet Union a major leg up in orbital operations over the United States during the 1990s.
HmHm........

And this model shows M-19-2 pure hyper sonic bomber.
http://www.ussr-airspace.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=24_53&products_id=2847
« Last Edit: February 23, 2017, 03:16:56 am by blackkite »

Offline flateric

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #34 on: February 23, 2017, 03:15:26 am »
Blackie, you continue to repost old pics from this same thread - wrong attributed though, while authors clearly shown on pictures
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,18507.msg40720.html#msg40720
plus bunch of copyrighted stuff from Ucon published books - while he's a constant member of SPF. Think if you would like that being an author and publisher yourself.
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stealth, more than a few of them truly technically ignorant and proud of it." Sherm Mullin, Skunk Works

Offline blackkite

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #35 on: February 23, 2017, 03:19:42 am »
Ummm....but I think this is only a internet information which every one can acsess easily. :-[
Any way I need hard cory. Don't worry. ;)
« Last Edit: February 23, 2017, 03:42:40 am by blackkite »

Offline Archibald

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #36 on: February 23, 2017, 11:39:20 pm »
Combined with the Buran, it would likely have given the Soviet Union a major leg up in orbital operations over the United States during the 1990s.

Nope. The M(G)19 was a technical boondoggle. As if turbojets + ramjets + scramjets + rocket wasn't enough, then add a nuclear pile to the whole thing. There are rumour the Gurkolyot (like spiral) was pushed by Aviation minister Dementyev as an asset in the turf war that opposed aviation to rocket (MOM, Afanasyev). Dementyev didn't wanted an hemorroage of aviation engineers toward rockets (and Buran somewhat did that)

More generally, a space shuttle is half an aircraft and half a rocket, but in USSR the respective ministries hated each others since 1960, the years Krutchev had thrown heavy bombers under a bus in favor of ICBMs (Myas... thing, Tsybin closed, M-50 , M-52, RSR scrapped)

There was a high level meeting about a soviet space shuttle in April 1972, three months after Nixon started the space shuttle. One believed a soviet space shuttle would have been started. Wrong, nothing moved until 1976 and even then the soviets hated the shuttle, and buran.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2017, 11:42:32 pm by Archibald »
Conservatoire de l'Air et de l'Espace d'Aquitaine - Bordeaux - Mrignac / Dassault aviation museum
http://www.caea.info/en/plan.php

Offline blackkite

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Re: Myasishchev M-19 projects
« Reply #37 on: February 24, 2017, 01:56:22 pm »
"then add a nuclear pile to the whole thing."
HmHmHm..........SSTO is hard.
Thank you very much. :D
« Last Edit: February 24, 2017, 02:46:46 pm by blackkite »