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Author Topic: MSrE Designations -- Hungarian Aircraft Designs  (Read 7836 times)

Offline hesham

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MSrE Designations -- Hungarian Aircraft Designs
« on: October 12, 2006, 05:55:18 am »
Aircraft from Hungary:

Muegyetemi M-28 Daru :high wing three seat monoplane with a fixed
                                  tailwheel u/c and a 240 hp Argus 10c engine.
Lampich D-20 Pajtas :low wing side-by-side two seat trainer with enclosed
                             canopy and fixed tailwheel u/c, powered by a 105
                             Walter Minor engine.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2012, 07:30:20 am by Stargazer2006 »

Offline Apophenia

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Re: MSrE Designations -- Hungarian Aircraft Designs
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2010, 08:21:23 pm »
MSrE stands for the Müegyetemi Sportrepülö Egyesület or (Budapest) Technical University Sport Fliers Association. The acronym is sometimes listed as 'MSE' (as in the Golden Years of Aviation civilian aircraft registration lists).

Wikipedia lists the MSrE series as: L-1, L-2, L-4, BL-5, BL-6, BL-7, L-9, Gerle 12, Gerle 13 , Gerle 14, Gerle 15, BL-16, M-19, M-20, M-21, M-22, M-24, M-25, M-27, M-28, M-29, M-30. But there's a few gaps in that listing.


MSrE Aircraft [http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/MSrE.html]

MSrE Head of Planning Árpád Lampich
Engines designed by gróf Péter Thorotzkai (or Thorotzkay)

L-1 Mama Kedvence (Mama's Favorite/Darling) - single-seat light monoplane, Árpád Lampich, 12 hp (8.8 kW) Thorotzkai 2-cyl, 1924. Photo of H-MAFC - http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/L-1.jpg

L-2 Róma - single-seat light monoplane, Lampich, 18hp (13.2 kW) Thorotzkai Delta 3-cyl, 1 built, flown 04 Sept 1925. H-MAFD/HA-AFD - http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/L-2.jpg

L-4 Bohóc (Clown) - single-seat aerobatic biplane, Lampich, 35 hp (26 kW) Thorotzkai 5-cyl, 1 built 1926 (1930 L-4/60, 60hp WM/Siemens Sh10) H-MAFE - http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/L-4.jpg

BL-5 - two-seat trainer/aerobatic biplane, Antal Bánhidi/Árpád Lampich, 120 hp (88.2 kW) Bristol Lucifer,  2 built 1928. H-MAFH - http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/BL-5.jpg *

BL-6 - two-seat biplane trainer, Bánhidi/Lampich, 62.5 kW WM/Siemens Sh11, 2 built 1927
http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/BL-6.jpg *

BL-7 Holló (Crow) - two-seat trainer/aerobatic biplane (rebuilt BL-5), redesigned by Rubik and Pap, 88.2 kW WM/Siemens Sh12, 2 built 1932. http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/BL-7.jpg HA-AFL

??-8 - [??]

L-9 Veréb (Sparrow) H-MAFN
http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/L-9-1.jpg

??-10 - [??]

At this point, it is tempting to insert the series of Gerle (Turtle Dove) light aircraft designed by Antal Bánhidi since their sub-type numbers seem to fill the gap.

MSrE Gerle 11 - H-MAFM
MSrE Gerle 12 - HA-AAE
MSrE Gerle 13 - HA-AAI
MSrE Gerle 14 - HA-AAN, HA-NAG, HA-NAH
MSrE Gerle 15 - HA-BEO
MSrE Gerle 16 - HA-BLO
MSrE Gerle 17 - HA-NAC

The one fly in the ointment of inserting the Gerle series is the duplication of '16.

BL-16 - two-seat trainer/towing biplane, Bánhidi/Lampich, 88.2 kW WM/Siemens Sh12, 1 built 1935 - HA-RIS http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/BL-16.jpg

??-17 - [??]

??-18 - [??]

M-19 (R-02) - 2-seat cabin monoplane tourer, Ernő Rubik, 130 hp (95.5 kW) DH Gypsy Major
 - M-19 http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/M-19.jpg - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MSrE_M-19

M-20 (R-01) - single-seat training sailplane, designed by Ernő Rubik (hence alt R-01 designation)
 - better known as EMESE-B (open rear fuselage) and EMESE-C (fabric-covered rear fuselage) **

M-21 Harag (Fury) - single-seat aerobatic biplane, 160 hp (110 kW) WM/Siemens Sh14A 7-cyl, József Szegedy, 1 built 1936/1937  - HA-RAG - http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/M-21.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MSrE_M-21

M-22 - single-seat high-performance/aerobatic sailplane, Endrével Jancsó and József Szegedy, 3 built 1937-1938 - photos/3v/details - http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/m-22.html

M-23 - [??]

M-24 - 2-seat cabin monoplane tourer (rev. gull wing, retractable u/c), Endre Jancsó and József Szegedy, 100 hp (77 kW) Hirth HM-504A-2, 5 built 1938-1940 (M-24s HA-NAE, 'NAM-'NAN, 'NAV, and M-24B HA-NAW)  - M-24 - http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/M-24.jpg

M-25 Nebuló (Urchin) - 2-seat cabin monoplane tourer, Jancsó, 77 kW Hirth HM-504A-2, 3 built 1940 (according to Hungarian Gliders. Golden Years lists fourteen M-25s - HA-NAK, 'NAX-'NAZ, 'NBA-'NBJ) - M-25 - http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/M-25.jpg

M-26 [??]

M-27 (EM-27) - tandem 2-seat fighter trainer, 176 kW Argus As10C, Jancsó/Szegedy, designed 1942, 1 prototype built by EMESE as EM-27 in 1943. ***

M-28 Daru (Crane), high-wing monoplane glider tug, 176 kW Argus As10C, Ferenc Zámolyi/Emil Lakatos, designed in 1943, 1 built 1950. - http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/M-28(1949).jpg

M-29 (EM-29),  side-by-side 2-seat low-wing monoplane, training and liaison aircraft, 77 kW MÁVAG-Hirth HM 504-A2, Jancsó/Szegedy, 25 EM-29s built by EMESE by end of 1943. ***

M-30 Fergeteg (Storm) - tandem 2-seat high-performance glider, Beniczky, designed 1944 but not completed until after WWII (redesigned version entered postwar production).    
 - M-30 - photos/3v/details - http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/fergeteg.html
__________________

* July 2010 Aero Magazin has a piece on the Bánhidi-Lampich BL-5 and BL-6

** EMESE is the Hungarian pronunciation of the acronym MSrE.

*** EMESE was also the MSrE's Experimental Aircraft Factory Ltd. located at Ferihegy

_____________________________________
« Last Edit: July 28, 2010, 08:28:00 pm by Apophenia »

Offline hesham

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Re: MSrE Designations -- Hungarian Aircraft Designs
« Reply #2 on: July 29, 2010, 05:35:21 am »
Thank you my dear Apophenia for that great work,

but for this company,something make me confuse,in google
the M-22 refer to it as Lampich NL-XXII of 1937,but I know
that the Lampich D-20 was a two-seat trainer aircraft of
1955,now how come ?,or lampich had anther list ?.

Offline Apophenia

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Re: MSrE Designations -- Hungarian Aircraft Designs
« Reply #3 on: July 29, 2010, 03:04:18 pm »

Thanks Hesham. Yes, the Lampich NL-XXII belongs to a separate designation series. And this Austria built aircraft was a powered 2-seat biplane trainer -- nothing at all like the MSrE's M-22 sailplane.

The NL stand for Neustädter/Lampich NL-XXII because these aircraft were built in Austria by WNF or the Wiener Neustädter Flughafenbetriebs GmbH (later Wiener Neustädter Flugzeugwerke GmbH, formerly the Phoenix Flugzeugwerk). Hungarian sources refer to this aircraft as the NL XXII/37.

That said, WNF did produce other MSrE designs in Austria -- the Árpád Lampich's L-9 Veréb and Antal Bŕnhidi's Gerle 16/17/18. During WWII, WNF built Bf-109s and Hopfner/Hirtenberg designs (speaking of which, does anyone know the more streamlined WNF Wn 11C ?).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_military_aircraft_of_Germany_by_manufacturer#Wiener_Neustadter_Flugzeugwerk_.28WNF.29

BTW, Lampich's less powerful biplane trainer, the NL XXI/36 was exported to Hungary (HA-VAG in 1939), as were two NL XXII/37s (HA-VAG & HA-VAH).

Offline hesham

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Re: MSrE Designations -- Hungarian Aircraft Designs
« Reply #4 on: May 06, 2016, 05:16:42 am »
My dear Apophenia,

I would like to speak seperatly about Lampich,specially he had a glider
aircraft called LS-16,that makes me confuse;

http://www.j2mcl-planeurs.net/dbj2mcl/planeurs-machines/planeur-fiche_0int.php?code=1671

Offline Apophenia

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Re: MSrE Designations -- Hungarian Aircraft Designs
« Reply #5 on: May 06, 2016, 11:40:40 am »
Hesham, as the Jereb Gábor site shows, nobody really knows what company built Árpád Lampich's 1939 LS-16. So, hard to know if that 'S' in the LS-16 designation stands for. http://gliders-fega.fw.hu/ls-16.html

It doesn't seem to be part of the MSrE or Neustädter designation sequences. And, when Lampich was joined by another designer, his initial came last - eg: the MSrE BL-x series designed with Antal Bánhidi.

Offline hesham

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Re: MSrE Designations -- Hungarian Aircraft Designs
« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2016, 02:06:34 pm »
New Info,thank you my dear Apophenia.

Offline hesham

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Re: MSrE Designations -- Hungarian Aircraft Designs
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2017, 08:53:59 am »
Hi,

BL-8   was also two-seat biplane trainer airplane,looks like BL-7,or developed in parallel with it.
M-23  was a glider as I think.
EM-31 Kotlós  was a four-seat twin engined tourist airplane,never completed.
EM-31 Kóbor  was a two-seat twin engined tourist airplane,also never completed.

Offline hesham

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Re: MSrE Designations -- Hungarian Aircraft Designs
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2017, 08:59:34 am »
Lampich D-20 Pajtas :low wing side-by-side two seat trainer with enclosed
                             canopy and fixed tailwheel u/c, powered by a 105
                             Walter Minor engine.

If we look to Lampich himself,

he created from L-1 to L-9 for MSrE,then he continued to NL-XXI and NL-XXII light aircraft up to 1937,
but maybe he re-allocated some numbers,just as LS-16 & D-20 Pajtas ?.

Offline hesham

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Re: MSrE Designations -- Hungarian Aircraft Designs
« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2017, 09:05:04 am »
Hi,

BL-8   was also two-seat biplane trainer airplane,looks like BL-7,or developed in parallel with it.
M-23  was a glider as I think.
EM-31 Kotlós  was a four-seat twin engined tourist airplane,never completed.
EM-31 Kóbor  was a two-seat twin engined tourist airplane,also never completed.

From Hungarian magazine.